Job Discussion Forums

Stephen Jones · Joined: 21 Feb 2003 Posts: 4124

NCTBA and John Slat will no doubt tell us tomorrow about all the people they have known in the last ten years who have been arrested for possession of a bible or taking part in a bible reading group.

If they don't then I'll be tempted to believe that maybe the US & UK embassies do know a little more than they do.

Whatever you do you should not bring one of these Sunday School Bibles with pictures. I was intrigued to read back in 1992 of a massive amnesty for Philipinos jailed for possessing a bible and pornography. I was rather cursing myself for not having kept up with the latest exciting developments in religious worship when an American friend who had met one of them in the Philippines explained that the 'pornography' were the pictures in the illustrated bibles they had.

With regard to not covering the head that has been the official stance for at least twenty years but the muttaween are notorious for making up the rules on the spot. One of my more amusing experiences in Riyadh was watching a muttawa chasing a couple of British housewives around the Kuwaiti souk waving a stick and screaming at them in Arabic, whilst they were wagging their fingers at him and telling him to take it up with the Saudi foreign office. The young policeman accompanying the muttawaa was keeping out of it, looking suitably bemused.

Mia Xanthi · Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 12:20 am Post subject:

lizziebennet · Joined: 24 May 2009 Posts: 355

Post deleted

johnslat · Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 2:57 am Post subject:

Dear Stephen,
Well, I never knew anyone who got arrested for having a Bible. But then, I hung around with people who were agnostics/atheists/had a lot more sense than to try to bring one.
So, are you advising the lady to pack her Bible?

"If they don't then I'll be tempted to believe that maybe the US & UK embassies do know a little more than they do."

Ouch, that means you'll believe I'm more ignorant than dirt.

Regards,
John

lucreziaborgia · Joined: 19 May 2009 Posts: 177

Lizziebennet, I imagine taking a Bible into the KSA would be similar to
showing 'Apocolypse Now' to a class of NVA Khe Son veterans. When in Rome...

Stephen Jones · Joined: 21 Feb 2003 Posts: 4124

I can't see why the lady can't just download and print out the Bible. It would seem to be easier (apart from anything else you can miss out all the boring bits). If she is attached to the particular bible she has the problem is that they may still impound it and later lose it even though the law says different. The possibility of Customs even looking at it is minuscule though.

Cleopatra · Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:59 am Post subject:

I normally tell people that bags are raarely subject3ed to stringent searches these days and that printed matter tends not to arouse suspicion, so long as it's not in Arabic and does not include too many pictures.

However, I still would nto risk taking a bible through customs. The risk is small but potentially serious. Try to download it from the net if you manage to find an uncensored site once there.

Middle East Beast · Joined: 05 Mar 2008 Posts: 836 Location: Up a tree

I've entered the KSA numerous times. I never had my laptop or flash drives checked. I've entered with dozens of DVD's--none X-rated, but some R-rated--and there have been a couple of occasions when they looked at each DVD label (I carried them without their jackets in hardcase containers) but they never confiscated any of them.

I always entered the country on a new contract with a Bible. I never had a problem with that.

johnslat · Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 4:31 pm Post subject:

Dear MiddleEastBeast,
Very glad to hear that. I've had books checked, a laptop taken away and checked (had to call and call and finally was able to take a taxi out to the airport to collect it) and same with some DVDs.
Maybe I fit some kind of "profile?"
I never tried to bring a Bible in, so I can't add any personal experience about that.
Regards,
John

Middle East Beast · Joined: 05 Mar 2008 Posts: 836 Location: Up a tree

johnslat · Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 4:47 pm Post subject:

Dear Middle East Beast,

"Seriously, I think this illustrates the fact that you just can't predict what you will face with Saudi customs "officials."

Exactly - and therein lies the problem with giving one's personal experiences, that they will be presented/interpreted as being what anyone/everyone can expect.

Regards,
John

Middle East Beast · Joined: 05 Mar 2008 Posts: 836 Location: Up a tree

johnslat · Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 5:02 pm Post subject:

Dear Middle East Beast,

We agree - personal experiences are very helpful as long as they are NOT presented or interpreted as being what everyone can expect. There are exceptions, of course, such as the one you mentioned - that one needs permission to leave the country. That's always true for EFlers working in Saudi (unless one does a runner.)
Regards,
John

Middle East Beast · Joined: 05 Mar 2008 Posts: 836 Location: Up a tree

I appreciate your words, John.

I'd insert a caveat, though. If you do a runner, it means you have a single or multi-exit/re-entry visa, i.e. you have their permission to leave. But even then they can choose to cancel it before you can get out.

Before I left the KSA after I resigned (in compliance with the contract) I had a valid multi-exit/re-entry visa. I chose not to do a runner despite the fact that my friend was detained before his final exit just weeks before. The Saudis canceled my visa, THEN informed me that they would not issue the final exit visa.

In retrospect, perhaps I should have done the runner (which would have been my first).

johnslat · Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 5:29 pm Post subject:

Dear Middle East Beast,
I've been doing a little research on "exit visas", since I wasn't sure whether Saudi was the only Middle Eastern country that required workers to get one.

So far, I've found this:

"If you are going to exit Qatar and are in Qatar on a WORK permit or WORK visa, you will need to get an exit permit when leaving for vacation. The reason for this is to protect companies and the country itself from people trying to escape their obligations. (i.e. paying a penalty ticket, or terminating a contract early)."

http://www.iloveqatar.net/visa.php

Regards,
John