Job Discussion Forums

[Cleopatra]

[Sheikh N Bake]

[007]

Well, KFUPM engineering programs were accredited by ABET (the Accreditation Board for Engineering and Technology in USA) in 2001, and were found to be substantially equivalent to similar accredited programs in the U.S.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_Fahd_University_of_Petroleum_and_Minerals

[Sheikh N Bake]

Agreed. There are two kinds of US accreditation: professional (degree program, according to field of study) and by entire university.

[oxford123]

let's wait what happens next !!

[Mia Xanthi]

[007]

[Stephen Jones]

There are plenty of other 'accreditations' in the US, S&B , than the regional accreditations, which I don't think a Saudi university would be allowed to apply for, though I don't know for certain.

[Sheikh N Bake]

As pointed out earlier, there are two types that count: The regional ones and the professional ones such as the engineering accreditation that 007 has noted, or the international MBA one. The third one I know of is irrelevant and the one I'm sure the Gulf ignores: the Council of Higher Education Accreditation.

[lcanupp1964]

I feel that the conversation of accreditation is important and needed, but not at the expense of trying to tarnish a reputation of a university. Now, I know that 99 percent of you fellow posters has not done this; I'm just refering to one person. Using the ELI program at KAU as an example is wrong, mainly due to the fact that KAU is not planning to �get rid of teachers that don�t have a master�s degree�. One poster (I won�t mention his fake user name because he will just insult those who disagree with him and use words like �nappy�) is trying to create this rumor for some unknown reason. He did say that 5 teachers at ELI/KAU were dismissed last year due to reasons that didn�t seem fair. Gee, life is fair? 5 teachers out of over 150 teachers that now work in the ELI at KAU being dismissed are not bad numbers � even IF they were let go for reasons that are not fully understood. In a world where some Western teachers (and I am from an English-speaking country) run their mouths at every turn, complain about everything and treat their fellow co-workers with distain should be asked to leave. Maybe the university was using �lack of educational credentials� as an excuse to spare telling those 5 teachers that they were simply a pain in the you-know-what. I believe that any school/university has the right to dismiss a teacher for not being a team player, or not fitting in with the �normal� level of professionalism that most teachers strive for. I know a lot of people who may read this may overreact to the phrase �not being a team player�. Think about it this way and please use a little common sense; to me, being a team player is being there for your students, your fellow co-workers and your place of work. One does not have to kiss a** to do this. I have a MA in education, but in hindsight and with over nine years of ESL teaching experience in a lot of countries (including four in the Middle East), I would rather hire a teacher with over five years of ESL teaching experience that only has a BA/BS than a teacher with a MA and less than 3 years of ESL teaching experience. Again, I have my MA, but sometimes I feel that some teachers walk around thinking they are special JUST because they have a MA. Experience counts more than JUST having an advance degree. To paraphrase a joke by Wood Allan: �Those who can�t do will need up teaching and those who can�t teach, end up teaching ESL�. Some people (like the unnamed, fake poster who started the rumor about KAU) should relax and find the sense of humor that every teacher needs to have. I love being a teacher and I am very pound of the ESL profession. Maybe unnamed poster was one of the five teachers that were dismissed from KAU last year. Judging by his rude and unprofessional comments towards this forum and to anybody who disagrees with him, including the immature and very crass PMs he has sent me, I�m glad he was fired. I was also very happy that the MOD choose to take down one of his rudest posts that just was an attack on me - a person who happens to believe that one should provide proof before a lie is posted on this website. Just wait a few minutes and fake poster will now provide his normal rude and unsupported comments. This guy is bitter.

BTW: Has anybody noticed that unnamed poster is the only person that has this "information" about KAU? Would you think that more teachers would have posted something, anything negative about KAU? Do a search on the university. You will not find one, single negative comment about the university (unless you count this guy's crazy rant) Whew!!! I feel better getting this off my chest! Thanks for the space and time for allowing me do this.

[krish]

Ref: "He did say that 5 teachers at ELI/KAU were dismissed last year due to reasons that didn�t seem fair. Gee, life is fair? 5 teachers out of over 150 teachers that now work in the ELI at KAU being dismissed are not bad numbers � even IF they were let go for reasons that are not fully understood. In a world where some Western teachers (and I am from an English-speaking country) run their mouths at every turn, complain about everything and treat their fellow co-workers with distain should be asked to leave. Maybe the university was using �lack of educational credentials� as an excuse to spare telling those 5 teachers that they were simply a pain in the you-know-what."

More than 20 teachers were given a letter of non-renewal of contract last year. Some were later taken back and deployed in other institutuions under the university. There was a situation when 8 teachers from India (all non-Muslim) remained the last to be dealt with. It was not possible to give them the excuse that they lacked educational credentials - because all of them had MA in English + excellent degrees in education + teaching experience ranging from 5 to 15 years. Half of them had PhDs from universities that are approved for UK and US jobs. KAU jeopardised their career prospects by giving them their non-renewal letters only by June, and then the exit-only visas. To wash their hands off, the management conducted an interview for them by a university in the rural area of the Kingdom - only after a few of the teachers had left for home. Some of the remaining ones got through the interview and those who had returned home and the ones who failed to get through the interview had to try hard to get a job somewhere, since the recruitments for that year were already over. They could have been saved from this predicament if the non-renewal letters were handed over in March-April, when the decisions were made anyway, for reasons not given.
Now - it was clear that the non-renewals were not based on the teachers'qualifications or teaching abilities - the only common factor in their case was that they all belonged to one nation, and one religion. Their educational qualifications and teaching experience were impeccable by international standards (proof: most of them are working now in institutions where high academic standards are required). Moreover, a few teachers from India with much lesser qualifications are still working there, because they are Muslims.
Back to the question of the need for teachers with MA in a university like KAU - it is very clear that the students there don't need anyone who has more than just a BA and a teaching degree - but if a university cares for some improvement, and research (some which reflects their own situation), it is advisable to look for at least a certain percentage of teachers with higher degrees. I do not understand why those who argue for teachers with basic degrees try to draw some very wierd views about those with higher degrees. Do they have to tarnish the image of others just in order to project their issues? How can they know what teachers with higher degrees are capable of, when they do not have a clear idea about those degrees and the effort and dedication needed to get them? That said, I maintain that a university should have the integrity to protect its exisitng staff - since they were brought to the institution after careful selection procedures. It is NOT FAIR to abuse dedicated teachers on the basis of some vested interests and gossips - no matter whether the teachers happen to posses PhDs or BAs. Those who side up with injustices and try to diminish the harm done to individuals should rethink a bit and ask whether any religion supports unfair deals on the basis of the flimsy argument that life in general appears to be unfair? How can it ever get fair when so many like them embrace injustice for selfish motives?
If one needs to maintain credibility, it is better to have clear criterea for selection of teachers in the first place, instead of creating confusion during every academic year. Thoughtless acts and narrow-mindedness can only defeat the purpose of 'Education', which is supposed to take the front seat in universities.

[lcanupp1964]

I agree 100%. It�s not fair and I hate the fact that teachers that are NOT from English-speaking countries are being treated like that. You are right - a teacher should be judged are their abilities and not where there from I wish the system was perfect, but again, life is often not fair. I was "lucky" to be born in an English-speaking county. I'm sure you know how the game is played - students want Westerns to teach them more than teachers that are not from English-speaking counties. It is not fair and I hate that way of thinking. But if enough students complain, there is not a lot a university can do. Thanks very much for your thoughts. I wish we lived in a world that this didn't happen.