Job Discussion Forums

[johntpartee]

Just like students anywhere. Some of them take it very seriously, some of them don't. At that age (young adolescence), the mindset is "anything goes and we'll all live forever". The way that English has been taught in China has primarily been rote rather than conceptual learning; especially in the rural areas. Chinese teachers who speak semi-English teaching students to make "English noises". The powers that be got hip to the fact that this is not a good thing. You gotta remember, it's only been thirty eight years since Nixon came here; before that, this was a closed area. Almost no Western influence. We are the first wave of the new English education in China. It'll take some time, but they'll figure it out.

[wildgander]

Oh, I expect that of students. I was referring to the school administration. Why aren't they expecting more of their ESL teachers and giving them support to do the job? Someone had written that they just wanted white faces to please parents and didn't really expect the ESL teacher's to do more than entertain the students. I'm trying to figure out why the administrators are not taking this more seriously.

[daCabbie]

[menso35]

[wildgander]

I have not read "Battle Hymn of the Tiger Mother" but I was sent a sound file of an interview with her. [The censorship of the Internet is very frustrating here but I've friends and family who can email me converted YouTube videos etc.]

I hope I can get this told briefly. I've seen asian parenting first hand in the United States and it is on the one hand much more demanding and on the other hand much more supportive than the western approach. Yes the children are asked to do a lot but they don't do it alone or unassisted. The parent or older sibling is right there with them helping and providing support. I like that closeness and interdependence. I think sometimes the stress level goes too high, but though they show it in different ways the stress level of the over indulged and often emotionally neglected American child is just as high. It just manifests in different ways.

[Laurence]

[TexasHighway]

Laurence wrote:

[wildgander]

daCabbie commented that, "Change comes from the top down here. A mid-level admin is not going to start changes within a school, it is an attack on the current management styles. Doing so is to risk your job. "

I know China is seeking to become ever more competitive in international business. Many successful American and Japanese corporations have improved their performance by soliciting and implementing suggestions from their workers

I admit I know almost nothing about communism but I had thought that communists were supposed to, in theory at least, value workers and should listen to them. I know in practice it was the party members who made the decisions. I am looking for two things here. The first is to better understand the business culture of ESL in China. The second thing is to see if there may be a conceptual path to bridge a more rigid top down structures to a more contemporary business model. I'm not saying western because I think that Japan has be innovative in this area also.

All your inputs have been very helpful to me. Any further thoughts on this system and how to communicate with my superiors on this topic?

Thank you,

Wildgander

[cormac]

[igorG]

I think the mainland leaders have learnt from the fall of communism in eastern Europe and so they are frightened the same could happen to them. Changing their educational system would mean that the new generation would be smarter which could prove potentially dangerous for the local leaders. Also, changing the educational system would mean that materials would have to be greatly changed and teachers would have to be re-trained or hired outsite their little circles which could take much of their control away from them. Then, foreigners would have to be given a larger role in the local system and that would most likely compromise the 60 years old system, which brings up the uniformly obedient workforce for the filthy local employers that often know little about the field of business they are in. As for the local schools' administrators, they too have a little knowledge of what their schools are about and so they'll only do their best to keep their jobs as it's been mentioned on before.

[wildgander]

What does a newcomer to China such as myself need to know about the Chinese education system? How does it differ from the American education system and what do I need to do to adapt to it? This really seems to be something I need to understand.

Thanks everyone for the informative posts,

Wildgander

[igorG]

When you accept the position, make sure you smile at all times and think of what issues to adress or not. Complaining too much, even if about some important things, may and most likely will send a hostile vibe.

Your class may be observed by a clueless local administrator that may not speak English at all. Swallow your pride! After the class observation, you may not get an official or any feedback at all. If the administrator smiles at you, it means it has gone well, but still you may have done something wrong which you may find later on. What you should really do before, during or after your class observation is quite difficult to tell 'cause the local like keeping "secrets".

Your role in the class is often symbolic, although at times you get to practice what the local students have already learnt. There sure are some serious courses for FTs on mainland, although watch out for how many students you fail or who you fail. According to the local system, its not only the students that fail. You may ask for a permission to form your classes prior to starting the courses, however, it's highly unlikely your employer will allow you to tamper with their system.

Finally, be ready to compromise your position at all times and learn how to deal with it. If your employer likes you, your students will like you too. If your students like you but employer doesn't, your employer may find some that do not. Be aware that your local coworkers are important for your job and if some do not like you your feet may quickly trip over obstacles you will not be able to cope with. Therefore, again, give them all big smiles and lots of positive feedback about the city and your job, and above all do not speak too much with them as anything may and will go against you on the end, if worst comes to worst.

[sistercream]

As someone (like most contributors on these boards I guess) who comes from a society which values linear thinking and deductive logic, it took me years to get my head around the fact that these concepts hardly even figure in Chinese culture/ education. Once you realise that the people you are working with simply don't use the thought patterns that we regard as normal, it gets easier even while it remains baffling

[wildgander]

sistercream brings up a new point for me to consider. What about my assumptions as an American (westerner?) about thinking. How does this differ from my Chinese administrators, colleagues, and students? What should I be looking for? or what experiences have others had in China with this?

Thanks,

Wildgander

[Non Sequitur]

With respect I feel the OP is overintellectualising the situaton that he/she will encounter.
So much of your energy will be taken up with just living and getting yourself to class and making something happen for the students.
The kids know the system is crap and will appreciate an effective teacher who practises a student-centred approach and treats them as collaborators not subjects, Chinese teachers do.
They will in time effect change - it's beyond us (FTs) to do it.