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ssjup81
Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 664
Location: Adachi-ku, Tokyo, Japan
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 Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:46 am Post subject: |
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| Glenski wrote: |
| Cool Teacher wrote: |
| Glenski wrote: |
IMO, I wouldn't say that the reason Japanese are so modest is because they are a "refined" culture. I'm not even sure what that means!
IMO, they are modest because they grow up with the mindset of not losing face. Shame is a big motivator in Japan (and many Asian cultures). |
Yeah but why would being good at English be a face looser?  |
A sense of perfection, perhaps. I knew a woman who had taken dance lessons for 15 years and still claimed to be "not so good" at it, despite winning some trophies. Also, if they are around another Japanese when saying this, they may simply not want to appear to be boasting, even if they are good. Different culture, different norms. |
To me, the culture seems to thrive on modesty. |
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teacheratlarge
Joined: 17 Nov 2011
Posts: 192
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:10 am Post subject: |
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Though in some ways, talking about "Japanese" chopsticks doesn't sound modest.
There are some actual differences in chopstick length and the usual material used (I like the steel ones in Korea), but sometimes it is said as if only Japan used chopsticks. Actually, a few of my students have brought up this "unique" point of Japan. When I pointed out that other countries use chopsticks, including China who used them earlier than Japan, my students suddenly were quite quiet. |
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ZennoSaji
Joined: 02 Feb 2010
Posts: 87
Location: Mito, Ibaraki
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| Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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In my experience, theirs is a culture of duality - Wanting to have their cake and eat it, too.
Face to face and amongst one another they are expected to behave modestly and save face and not boast. But as Japanese people, they are of course the superior race and won't hesitate to let us gaijin know it. |
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sideways_gun
Joined: 28 Apr 2010
Posts: 49
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:57 am Post subject: |
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| ZennoSaji wrote: |
In my experience, theirs is a culture of duality - Wanting to have their cake and eat it, too.
Face to face and amongst one another they are expected to behave modestly and save face and not boast. But as Japanese people, they are of course the superior race and won't hesitate to let us gaijin know it. |
I just shoot them down as they come along. Logic shuts up the intelligent ones very fast. The latest ridiculousness is in people being surprised I have had hayfever in the past when I WASN'T in Japan. "You have hayfever overseas too??" Umm.. yeah... anywhere where there are, you know, trees and flowers, there will be people who suffer from hayfever so.. yeah... |
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OneJoelFifty
Joined: 06 Oct 2009
Posts: 463
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| Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:36 am Post subject: |
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I had some friends that went to America a while ago. When they were going through security (pre-9/11, they were friendlier then I'm sure) the person that took their passports looked at the names. Sarah, Chris...and he said "Gee, you guys have American names over there!" They were from England.
Just saying. |
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steki47
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 1029
Location: BFE Inaka
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| Posted: Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| OneJoelFifty wrote: |
I had some friends that went to America a while ago. When they were going through security (pre-9/11, they were friendlier then I'm sure) the person that took their passports looked at the names. Sarah, Chris...and he said "Gee, you guys have American names over there!" They were from England.
Just saying. |
This could be a separate thread, but I have mentally collected goofy things other teachers have said.
-The American teacher who asked his Aussie co-worker if they had Lincoln on the Australian five-dollar bill. The American was quite surprised at the answer.
-The Canadian who asked me (also American) if the US produced maple syrup. |
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Cool Teacher
Joined: 18 May 2009
Posts: 930
Location: Here, There and Everywhere! :D
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| Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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| sideways_gun wrote: |
| ZennoSaji wrote: |
In my experience, theirs is a culture of duality - Wanting to have their cake and eat it, too.
Face to face and amongst one another they are expected to behave modestly and save face and not boast. But as Japanese people, they are of course the superior race and won't hesitate to let us gaijin know it. |
I just shoot them down as they come along. Logic shuts up the intelligent ones very fast. The latest ridiculousness is in people being surprised I have had hayfever in the past when I WASN'T in Japan. "You have hayfever overseas too??" Umm.. yeah... anywhere where there are, you know, trees and flowers, there will be people who suffer from hayfever so.. yeah... |
They  Them  superior race logic shuts up the intelligent ones
Gee! You guys are a bit |
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Cool Teacher
Joined: 18 May 2009
Posts: 930
Location: Here, There and Everywhere! :D
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| Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:15 pm Post subject: |
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| steki47 wrote: |
| OneJoelFifty wrote: |
I had some friends that went to America a while ago. When they were going through security (pre-9/11, they were friendlier then I'm sure) the person that took their passports looked at the names. Sarah, Chris...and he said "Gee, you guys have American names over there!" They were from England.
Just saying. |
This could be a separate thread, but I have mentally collected goofy things other teachers have said.
-The American teacher who asked his Aussie co-worker if they had Lincoln on the Australian five-dollar bill. The American was quite surprised at the answer.
-The Canadian who asked me (also American) if the US produced maple syrup. |
I don't know the naser to that last one.  |
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sideways_gun
Joined: 28 Apr 2010
Posts: 49
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Cool Teacher wrote: |
They Them superior race logic shuts up the intelligent ones
Gee! You guys are a bit |
This is the thread of sweeping generalisations and/or a collection of people's unsurprisingly similar experiences. Enjoy the banter made to make you go "I KNOW, RIGHT!!"
I for sure didn't come to Japan to "educate" them. Only regarding correct use of English, at least (^_^ > Admittedly, matters of foreign affairs and social integration are not in my field... |
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Zira
Joined: 23 Jan 2012
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 9:32 am Post subject: |
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| I find that Japanese students are as competitive as anywhere else (some of them even more so) but the society and surroundings still discourages this. It seems very hard for the talented ones to succeed in that environment. I talked to some of them and they are rather tormented young individuals and they usually have to go abroad to realize their full potential. |
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OneJoelFifty
Joined: 06 Oct 2009
Posts: 463
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| Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 1:10 am Post subject: |
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| sideways_gun wrote: |
| Cool Teacher wrote: |
They Them superior race logic shuts up the intelligent ones
Gee! You guys are a bit |
This is the thread of sweeping generalisations and/or a collection of people's unsurprisingly similar experiences. Enjoy the banter made to make you go "I KNOW, RIGHT!!"
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I felt I had to point out that a lot of these things aren't uniquely Japanese though, are they? As for the superior race/Japan is number 1 stuff...does it really come close to America for that mindset? |
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sideways_gun
Joined: 28 Apr 2010
Posts: 49
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 1:43 am Post subject: |
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| OneJoelFifty wrote: |
I felt I had to point out that a lot of these things aren't uniquely Japanese though, are they? As for the superior race/Japan is number 1 stuff...does it really come close to America for that mindset? |
I have to say that from a British person's point of view it DOES remind me of that. Except that, when an American brags, it does tend to be about things that I think ARE enviable about America. The "American Dream" is not something that can exist in dreary little Britain. We don't have the strength of industry or even numbers. Yeah, the pound USED to be strong, but I think that was only in the context of Europe. Globally... we're not so important, if not for being the "other" influential English-speaking nation.
When Japanese people brag it's about things that, in my opinion, are not even worthy of envy or awe. And sometimes they are just bullshit! Hence why I like to laugh. They also tend to make it "good because we ARE Japanese" so it's no longer about society but about BLOOD. Americans don't talk like that, as far as I've experienced.
What do you think? |
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OneJoelFifty
Joined: 06 Oct 2009
Posts: 463
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| Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 3:48 am Post subject: |
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You might have a point about the blood thing, although it's an opinion I've not experienced first-hand, and would imagine it's considered an outdated view by most Japanese.
The American Dream...it's a myth isn't it? The working conditions in America are pretty bad from what I've read. I'm from England, and we're fairly self-deprecating, but at least we can point to stuff like free healthcare (for now anyway). |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:50 am Post subject: |
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| Cool Teacher wrote: |
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This could be a separate thread, but I have mentally collected goofy things other teachers have said.
-The American teacher who asked his Aussie co-worker if they had Lincoln on the Australian five-dollar bill. The American was quite surprised at the answer.
-The Canadian who asked me (also American) if the US produced maple syrup. |
I don't know the naser to that last one. |
The answer is yes, they do. I don't think that last one is a bad question, actually. |
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steki47
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 1029
Location: BFE Inaka
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| Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:55 am Post subject: |
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| GambateBingBangBOOM wrote: |
| Cool Teacher wrote: |
| Quote: |
This could be a separate thread, but I have mentally collected goofy things other teachers have said.
-The American teacher who asked his Aussie co-worker if they had Lincoln on the Australian five-dollar bill. The American was quite surprised at the answer.
-The Canadian who asked me (also American) if the US produced maple syrup. |
I don't know the naser to that last one. |
The answer is yes, they do. I don't think that last one is a bad question, actually. |
Oh, that was a question. I don't know the word "naser". I feel dumb.
Yes, the US produces maple syrup. We are the second largest producer in the world.
Not to argue with you, but I thought it was a silly question as the two countries share a rather large border, some of which includes a lot of forest land.
Funny, I had to explain to my JHS kids that maple syrup comes from a tree. They thought it was from an insect. (That's honey!) |
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