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lagerlout2006
Joined: 17 Sep 2003
Posts: 985
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 Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 4:17 pm Post subject: |
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I thought Moore's closing point was right on. There's no such thing as Al Quida and no such person as Binladen. The "war" is not against terrorism or Iraq ---it's against American people. The war is the status-quo vs. people who want to change it. Keep people stupid and worrying about nonsense. This fact hit home a few days ago when they issued more terror "red alerts" . Buildings might be blown up ---yes they have been saying this for 3 years. Keep people stupid and worried about WMD and the devil and you have no problem.
Moore is goofy at times but he's basically right. Another poignant bit was showing people in trailer parks talking about "terrorists-they can strike anywhere." People reported a Bible group to the "snitch hotline." Keep people worrying about ghosts and they wont see the real enemy. |
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Stephen Jones
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 4124
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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It isn't proven that sexual humiliation was allowed by policy. England (the bad apple soldier, not the country) originally told the press she and her colleagues acted on their own. Only now, that she is in court-hearings, is she saying intelligence officers told her it was ok. Do liberals believe "Innocent until proven guilty" applies only to them?
Sleep deprivation was used in only one case.
I might be wrong about this as I'm recalling it from memory. I don't believe the camp commander actually transferred to Abu Ghraib. They only got "advice" from some people at Gitmo. By the way, the style of treatment used has been completely different. In Gitmo they mostly use a positive-reinforcement method where rewards are given for information. |
What little there has come out of treatment meted out to prisoners at Guatanamo Bay suggests treatment the same as at Abu Gharaib. Bear in mind that they transferred the commander of Gitmo (Sanchez) I think, to Abu Gharaib, and as a result the treatment of prisoners considerably worsened.
Positive reinforcement is a technique used by the FBI, but they seem to have lost out to the CIA and military intelligence in this power struggle.
As for sexual humiliation in most parts of the world being forced to be naked in the presence of women guards is considered to be precisely that. Private England really didn't have to stray too far to pass the line.
The interrogation techniques have been laid out in official documents, and there is a lot of corroboration both from inmates and jailors.
They did take advice from the Israelis, but bearing in mind the British arrmy's long training in brutal interrogation techniques, and that the CIA, at the School of Americas, ran a torture academy where South American military officers were given lectures by doctors on how to apply electric shocks to subversives' eyeballs, I doubt if they would have needed much training. |
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moonraven
Joined: 24 Mar 2004
Posts: 3094
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| Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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SOMEONE on this thread asked the rhetorical question if because of a few "bad" soldiers we shouldn't trust the government. After a lengthy roll on the floor with my sides splitting I checked my body for fractures. There is no reason to trust THE government--what is this, Big Brother-land--period. Why should anyone trust any entity that doesn't respect or even acknowledge his/her interests?
Rest assured, help is on the way--yesterday Bush announced that he and his cronies in THE government were just as creative as Al Quaeda in coming up with ways to harm the US. That would be another side-splitter if it weren't so obviously true. |
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nawlinsgurl
Joined: 01 May 2004
Posts: 363
Location: Kanagawa and feeling Ok....
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| Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2004 7:46 am Post subject: |
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| moonraven wrote: |
| SOMEONE on this thread asked the rhetorical question if because of a few "bad" soldiers we shouldn't trust the government. After a lengthy roll on the floor with my sides splitting I checked my body for fractures. There is no reason to trust THE government--what is this, Big Brother-land--period. Why should anyone trust any entity that doesn't respect or even acknowledge his/her interests? |
I totally agree. Even though I think America is a great place to be because of its numerous advantages, I have to admit that our government is at least 98% corrupt. I mean any government that tests diseases on the military and pushes for a "Consitutional amendment" to same-sex marriages should not be trusted.
| moonraven wrote: |
| Rest assured, help is on the way--yesterday Bush announced that he and his cronies in THE government were just as creative as Al Quaeda in coming up with ways to harm the US. That would be another side-splitter if it weren't so obviously true. |
He has. It's called "passing Bills to help build up countries we have ruined" |
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