Job Discussion Forums

Leon Purvis · Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:39 pm Post subject:

The OP has written a Masters theses AND attended law school? He indicates that he has a BA in English. A BA is not the same as an MA. Must I explain the difference between those two degrees as well?

The fact that I profess to have studied the ENGLISH LANGUAGE, how it works, theories of how it evolved, how it is used, and how it has been used is no indication of an overinflated sense of self-importance.

If, however, if I were to propose that I am a lawyer because I can argue a point logically, employ deductive logic, use truth charts, and apply my knowledge of business law, then that would be a pretty good indication that an ego problem exists.

It makes little difference to ANYONE how much difficulty a law student has in completing his course work or how grueling the test. It does not make his course of study AND EXPERTISE IN ANY AREA OF THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE equal to or greater than someone who possesses a Masters of Art in English.

There are different courses of study for different professions. What part of that do you not understand?

And what's with the ad hominem attack? That isn't a very good argument, counselor.

shuize · Joined: 04 Sep 2004 Posts: 1270

Leon Purvis · Posted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 12:57 am Post subject:

I love it. A JD / PhD in China.

Perhaps his own family suffered from self-importance. Mine doesn't and none of my PhD teachers did either. That must be a JD thing.

Have fun.

This discussion is getting p*ssy. I've got better things to do than compare apples and figs.

fat_chris · Joined: 10 Sep 2003 Posts: 3198 Location: Beijing

YAAAAAAAAAWN!

Is the degeneration of this post for real?

Rolling Eyes

Anyway...

jm21, best of luck in finding a position to your liking. You seem to have done your homework in learning about what's out there. I think it will end up all right for you.

Regards,
fat_chris

jm21 · Joined: 26 Feb 2008 Posts: 406

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

jm21 · Joined: 26 Feb 2008 Posts: 406

Tsuris · Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 1:13 am Post subject:

It all depends on how much you want to avoid the arctic cold weather in the winter. Dalian is in Liaoning province, in the northeast, and it is frigid cold there in the winter. Quite strangely, the areas that have the coldest and driest winters also have the most humid and oppressive summers. Pollution will be impossible to avoid in any industrialised city. Yunnan province in the west is fairly temperate all year round and there are areas in the south and southeast, outside of the major cities, that are livable, if you don�t need the experience of a big city. There is no industry to speak of in Hainan province, so the water and air are fairly clean, but there aren�t many job opportunities there and the pay is on the low side. If you are looking for a cosmopolitan location, then you should be looking at Shanghai or Guangzhou, but the crowding and pollution can get to you after awhile. If you prefer a more sedate atmosphere, then Kunming in Yunnan or Haikou in Hainan are good choices, but as I said the pay is low there. Living and working in China is always a matter of trade-offs, never an ideal situation anywhere, and many stay put year after year because they prefer to live with the devil they know.

arioch36 · Joined: 21 Jan 2003 Posts: 3589

tsuris

well said

Jordean · Joined: 12 Dec 2006 Posts: 238

billwynne · Joined: 07 Dec 2007 Posts: 13 Location: Guangzhou

I replied to this thread a few months ago-practiced law for 35 years, burned out, blah, blah.

Well, the wife and I have taken positions at a college in GZ. Decent pay and ok package. 20 teaching hrs a week, mon=fri only Half pay during vacation, apartment on campus. We report on aug 25, and I'll report back.

As to issues in my earlier post, have sold house and possessions, found a perfect home for the labrador; now if only someone would buy my saltwater aquarium.

By the way, omission of the school name is deliberate. I've been warned about locals swooping in and stealing your job. Will disclose that after I show up for the job.

We're excited. Nobody seemed to mind that I'm 60 years old. They
[u]claim[/u] to be impressed with my JD=college is foreign business oriented. Then again, they claim to be impressed with my wife's PR background. Talk's cheap.

So, one extremely burnt out lawyer headed for the middle kingdom. See you in GZ

flutterbayou · Joined: 01 Apr 2006 Posts: 244

Hi, I also have my JD but did not want to practice law.

I think that you should be aware that American law graduates are to be found practicing law in law firms in all the major cities in Asia and the Middle East.

I was too burned out to sit for the bar, plus couldn't resist the urge to return to my more comfortable university position in the States as a writer and instructor of writing. I couldn't give up the artsy for the arbitrary.

BUT... it seems that the only thing keeping you from sitting for the bar is not a previous career you love but a bad case of the `i cannot take it anymore` syndrome, which is entirely understandable.

My unsolicited advice is to stick it out and pass that bar. You don't have an MA to fall back on but can use that JD as a ticket to work anywhere in the world for a solid wage.

In fact, a lawyer friend of mine is practicing law in Shanghai and teaching part-time at a university,. so that he can mingle with the locals

Best to you.
Flutter

nantosaken · Joined: 12 Mar 2008 Posts: 1

Hi, I have a JD and I'm a member of the California bar. I haven't been able to find a decent job in Asia. I applied to over a 100 law firms in Japan, and several in Hong Kong. When I look at the job postings for attorneys they almost always require excellent grades or at least a couple of years of experience practicing corporate law. I also applied for a few jobs that were not for attorney positions but considered a JD an asset, but still no luck.
I would like to know if anyone out there knows where to get these decent jobs overseas if you didn't graduate at the top of your class or make law review.
I hope mainland China is different.

flutterbayou · Joined: 01 Apr 2006 Posts: 244

Check your pm box

jm21 · Joined: 26 Feb 2008 Posts: 406

Hi folks. It's been a while since I've been on this forum but back again.

I ended up taking and passing the bar, then was a bit anxious about the salaries in China and wanted to at least try law out so...

The stock market crashed a couple days after I got the exam results and by the time I was sworn in there were basically no jobs in WA. I ended up opening my own practice and have been surprisingly successful. The money is pretty good but very high stress and largely doing the same 4 forms over and over again.

I met a girl from China over the internet and flew over to visit her last month. I had a great time, loved the people and culture there, and now thinking about the whole teaching in China thing again. A $1,000 20-some hour plane ride to see your girlfriend kind of sucks, and she has a really great job with a lot of opportunities she'd have to give up if she moved here. And with all the restaurants, fresh food, things to do, etc. over there the small town I'm in seems pretty damn dull. Much cleaner air though.

With the value of the dollar down a bit it seems much more reasonable (easier to pay student loans). All things considered the amount of money I'd have left to blow (after housing, utilities, food, phone, etc.) wouldn't be that much lower in China (if I was making at least 10,000 rmb at my age, maybe 18k 10 years from now), especially if you had a wife and a few kids. I'd just be worried that if the yuan fell in value a lot or the dollar gained a lot then student loan payments would become burdensome.

But I think I would want at least 10,000 rmb to live off of. How possible is that? Not sure where I'd be yet because I'd want to continue practicing for at least a few more months to get some money together and she is going to get transferred pretty soon. I may be able to do some legal work over the internet but not sure how that would work out with continuing education and all that. Pay is good though. It would be kinda nice to have a lower paid/lower hour gig at a University and try my hand at writing or something. Or learn Mandarin and try to get involved with an international company.