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How do you tell a Saudi student they've failed?
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Citizenkane



Joined: 14 Jun 2009
Posts: 234
Location: Xanadu

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Honestly, I think a large part of the problem is teaching everything through the medium of English (in theory at least).


Agree that insisting on English teaching everywhere is a huge waste of time, money and resources. But when you say 'in theory' what do you mean? That classes which are supposed to be done through English in reality are not? If so I agree. So many times I've walked past 'English medium' content classes to hear the prof droning away in Arabic, maybe inserting a few technical terms in English. Fine as far as I'm concerned, but it shows the silliness of it all.

Quote:
And we have all discussed this at various times either on this board, in faculty rooms, or by email. But... we were never asked before they made this decision... nor have any of us been asked since... at least not by anyone who has the power to change it


Kinda ironic..... the English speakers who make money out of teaching English in the Gulf don't think it's a good idea, while the Arabs who have to spend years learning the language are all for it! I suggest we don't' make too much of a noise over it though - a bit like turkeys voting for Christmas!
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just wait until I retire in 2012 and then you kiddies can do what you want !
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veiledsentiments



Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA

PostPosted: Sat Feb 20, 2010 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Citizenkane wrote:

Quote:
And we have all discussed this at various times either on this board, in faculty rooms, or by email. But... we were never asked before they made this decision... nor have any of us been asked since... at least not by anyone who has the power to change it


Kinda ironic..... the English speakers who make money out of teaching English in the Gulf don't think it's a good idea, while the Arabs who have to spend years learning the language are all for it! I suggest we don't' make too much of a noise over it though - a bit like turkeys voting for Christmas!

No, I don't think that they are all for it. I suspect that many, if not most, of them think it is as wasteful and counterproductive as we do. Personally, it was nice having the job... but as someone who thinks that education should first and foremost exist to benefit the students, I have to say that it is a nightmare for them and doesn't produce the graduates that these countries actually need.

VS
(Don't worry scot... the system will last until your retirement and beyond... probably beyond employment possibilities for your grandchildren...)
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Cleopatra



Joined: 28 Jun 2003
Posts: 3657
Location: Tuamago Archipelago

PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When doing placement interviews for new students, I often ask the girls "So, why do you want to study at this college?" Very often they reply by saying "Because the courses are in English." Now, they may simply be saying this because they think it is something that will impress us (!) but they may also mean it. There is a huge prestige factor attached to studying in English, and the fact that the courses are hopelessly dumbed down to make up for the students still-low English abilities is of course never mentioned.

I've also found that many students - even those who claim to want to study in English - complain about having to do Foundation Year(s) and say they don't understand why they have to spend so much time studying English. Uh... maybe because you don't actually know English very well, at least not enough to read college books and follow lectures in it?

In reality though, as CK pointed out, students don't have to do much of either of the above, at least not in any meaningful sense. I too have had the experience of walking past classrooms only to hear Arabic being spoken by the teacher. Fine as far as I'm concerned, but it does show that the whole 'English medium' thing is, as our friend VS would say, really 'smoke and mirrors'.
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scot47



Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 15343

PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It seems to be a peculiarity of the GCC States. Other states in the Arab World, Syria, Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt provide tertiary and further education without making everyone pretend to do it in English.

Very odd.
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Mia Xanthi



Joined: 13 Mar 2008
Posts: 955
Location: why is my heart still in the Middle East while the rest of me isn't?

PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who was it on here who referred to "the Great Training Robbery"? That's my favorite comment on all this.
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veiledsentiments



Joined: 20 Feb 2003
Posts: 17644
Location: USA

PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scot47 wrote:
It seems to be a peculiarity of the GCC States. Other states in the Arab World, Syria, Iraq, Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt provide tertiary and further education without making everyone pretend to do it in English.

Very odd.

Exactly!! I've always wondered where the whole idea actually came from. Countries like Egypt and Lebanon do have English based universities which get the students who can pass IELTS and/or TOEFL before starting content courses. Those that can't do that or afford to pay for Foundation classes (and legitimately pass them) go to Arabic medium universities.

Medicine seems to be the one subject that is nearly always taught in English - even at places like Cairo University... mainly because almost all of the current research is published in English.

Oh... and also air traffic controllers and pilots...

VS
(Great training robbery indeed)
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