Job Discussion Forums

[Ryan425]

Does anyone know the going rate per hour to teach subject-specific English to a class of Vietnamese teachers?

My credentials: I've been teaching for eleven years. Five of those years have been here in Vietnam, and the rest was back in my home country. I taught in the English and Adult Education departments there. Here, I teach Academic English (all skills) in university, high school, and middle school. I have a MA in TESOL.

Thanks in advance!

[vabeckele]

It is up to you and how much you feel your service is worth. Private clients will have less money to shell out when it comes to down it and will not be able to afford a 150 dollar hourly fee, whereas a large company might not bat an eyelid.

One of my main problems has been in justifying those fees to my clients; I tell them of my experience, education and what I believe will benefit the company and clients will ask for a meeting - "Very impressive", they say, "but all I need is a backpacker at 20 dollars an hour". This, when they know exactly what my background is and still called me out.

I could be wrong, but there isn't really much added value between you and a backpacker here in Vietnam. If you have generated enough wind, or have become a large corporation, no-one will question it.

Spin the wheel and charge anything between 20 and 150 dollars.

[mark_in_saigon]

[biliana]

[vabeckele]

[toiyeuthitmeo]

Binh Duong seems to be the southern port of call for VN English teacher training and exams. TKT exams going on, IELTS work. It's there.

[Jbhughes]

I know we're going slightly off the topic here, but the point about creators of seminal works and the more 'where do oi put me ladder, mate?' is a really good one.

I've been told a number of times recently things a long the line of: 'you're a foreigner teacher, you can teach better than Vietnamese.' This usually goes a long with 'you don't need to prepare, I think you can just go in and teach.' This comments usually coming from people who have no about my background, just know I'm English (actually, they probably think I'm Mỹ).

It's such a weird mentality, and starkly contrasted to how people consider me in other ways. I find being a foreigner here, most VN think I can't possibly do anything. I'm sure we can all cite examples, like my friend going into a place to fix his watch, for them just adjust it to the correct time and give it back to him! As if a 50 something doesn't know how to adjust his watch!?!

You are really well qualified, Ryan425. I think you should really sell yourself and push the boat out with the price. I don't have experience with what teacher training, so can't say any more. But do state the obvious. Many times.

I've applied for a number of jobs recently and it is honestly like people just haven't looked at the CV or cover letter whatsoever. Don't allow some paper-pusher with poor English skills and a heightened sense of self-worth to get in the way, either. Just go over their head. Tell everyone repeatedly about your experience and qualifications and how good they (and you) are and why, assume that whoever you are talking to doesn't understand the worth of your qualifications and that you need to re-explain it to them many times so that they fully understand.

Have you ever watched people in authority here and how they deal with underlings? They talk. They go on and on and on and on, the lower people have to sit their and politely listen and agree. It's how the system works, even if the younger ones don't agree or don't like it, they have to sit and listen. If they start to disagree or say something counter to what you are saying, you have to immediately jump on them and keep yourself up at the top of the pile. That's my experience of how the older and more important teachers or managers work here. Even just older people in class, they do this to exercise and affirm their authority.

Anyway, you've been here a bit longer than me, so probably know all of the above anyway. Good luck!

[mark_in_saigon]

[vabeckele]

I have been a victim of trying to change things within and between departments of universities. I had very strong encouragement to start work at one public economic uni and one private. Needless to say the dialogue between the international department and the English department was non-existent, even though both had just signed up with an overseas programme.

Both of these universities, stopped communication immediately after I suggested some changes for these programmes to work. One private university has hired a 'volunteer' teacher well into the 60's. Doesn't this person know the fees charged to the students and the profits made? Well...

I had sent my c.v. to a centre and got a call a few days later. After the general niceties were over, the interviewer asked me, 'do you have any experience?" "Did you get my c.v.?". "Yes." I left as quick as possible.

As for 'us' not being to do anything, it is just another 'Orwellian' tale.

[Andy123]

OMG!! This posting brings back many unpleasant memories. I have taught primary through university Viet teachers. At first all is well and then all hell breaks loose.

The primary problem is lexical approuches. They are above average in IQ but lack the ability to explore methodology that may improve their learning and knowledge. They are always right.

After a week or so they begin to verbalize the party line "We know best for teaching Viet students because me are Viet and you no understand" .

I would bring in example after example, academic books after acadmeic books and activity after activity and nothing will allow them to even entertain that the normative methodology taught throughout most of the world will aid them.

I would even bring in my prefix and suffix lessons for guessing word meaning. This lesson allows the Ss to guess correctly (multiple choice) 75% of the time. Yet the new knowledge is soon deposited in the bin at the end of class.

My motto is to avoid teaching teachers, priests and nuns. Surprisingly Viet government officials are fun and open-minded Ss. Go figure.

[Ryan425]

My purpose has never been to teach the teachers how to teach their students. I assumed that they, like I, had graduated from a school of education and had tweaked their skills through experience. My focus is on helping them to improve their English which, in turn, will help their charges to speak better.

[TRH]

My assumption when I read the first post, was that the OP was talking about private lessons for a relatively small group of Vietnamese teachers, and as he clarified later, English lessons not teaching lessons. If so, I would think they might be somewhat motivated but short of funds. I have heard the starting salary is around 2M VND/month and does not come up much with seniority. These teachers are probably making substantially less than the parents of most Saturday morning language mill students so I would think he would have to hold the line near the bottom of the private lesson scale.

Here is an idea. Try to find out how much they take in per hour when they cram ten to twenty kids into one of their after-school tutoring setups and charge them each that much.

Most posters seem to have thought the setting is institutional. If so, good luck.

[BenE]

I'm pretty sure the British council do this in Hanoi where they send more experienced teachers to do seminars for local teachers. I think they just pay the teachers standard wages for this but I might be wrong.

[skarper]

TBH Vietnamese teachers probably need BOTH English lessons and English teaching lessons. But if you teach in a modern, varied and interactive style they will 'pick up' TEFL methods at the same time. You could have some kind of 'how to best teach English' guided discussion tasks to see how well they have absorbed these ideas.

Personally - I would never teach local teachers unless they were 'on their own dime' - as the Yanks have it. In that case you really need to figure out what is fair. BTW - Vietnamese teachers ain't poor. Salary is risble but they can make 2-3 times this in private classes, after hours work and 'gifts'.

If working through a centre and teaching teachers who have been told to come to class in their own time and without extra compensation - IMO I'd want 100USD an hour - but I do know I'd never get it. That is kind of the point.

[TRH]