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Hatcher
Joined: 20 Mar 2008
Posts: 602
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 Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 6:38 am Post subject: PhDs for 2,000USD a month? |
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| I see on this forum and others job ads for English speaking or western PhD holders with starting salaries of 2,000USD a month.... Are Chinese universities getting PhDs for that salary? |
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Shroob
Joined: 02 Aug 2010
Posts: 1339
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 7:18 am Post subject: Re: PhDs for 2,000USD a month? |
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| Hatcher wrote: |
| I see on this forum and others job ads for English speaking or western PhD holders with starting salaries of 2,000USD a month.... Are Chinese universities getting PhDs for that salary? |
It's more than just salary that attracts people to Chinese universities. It's the whole package.
Working as few as 6 hours a week at a stress free job, free house, no utility bills, 5/6 months paid holiday a year, etc. |
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roadwalker
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 1750
Location: Ch
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 8:24 am Post subject: |
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I've never met one, but I wouldn't be surprised. I've met JDs, MBAs and various other masters, but no Ph.Ds. Of course, having a degree doesn't guarantee a good job at home either. I worked at a record shop (before CDs) with two Ph.Ds (one bonafide and one ready to defend his dissertation.) Both in psychology I believe. Perhaps one or both eventually got a job that paid.
I seriously doubt there are Ph.D.s with western university tenure-track employment history teaching for that salary. Unless they got caught with pants down or worse. Otherwise unemployable people with multiple post-bachelor degrees? Sure. |
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Hatcher
Joined: 20 Mar 2008
Posts: 602
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 8:51 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks. Look at the Dalian University of Finance and Eco and they have several ads for PhDs. I just wonder what PhD would go there. |
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MisterButtkins
Joined: 03 Oct 2009
Posts: 1221
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 11:43 am Post subject: |
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My friend with a PhD teaches at a joint venture school and makes 30k.
I think the Chinese schools are just hoping that a PhD bites. Kind of like when you send out emails looking for jobs, you still email a few places with qualifications you don't meet. Because why not? |
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Non Sequitur
Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 4724
Location: China
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 1:57 am Post subject: |
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| Hatcher wrote: |
| Thanks. Look at the Dalian University of Finance and Eco and they have several ads for PhDs. I just wonder what PhD would go there. |
I think that is Dongbei (Northeast) U of Finance and Economics which is in Dalian.
It's a prestigious school and the best FT accom I've seen.
They may the quoted figure but not to a new Dr.
A teacher with substantial teaching and publishing creds would be expected for that dough.
'Why' they would go there is as variable as human nature. |
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MisterButtkins
Joined: 03 Oct 2009
Posts: 1221
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 3:16 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| It's a prestigious school... |
Does this really matter? The prestigious schools in China don't necessarily pay more. I remember, a couple of years ago, Beida was advertising for ESL teachers for 5600 a month. They wanted a masters degree with publications. I personally was offered a job by a Beijing school that is 'prestigious' for 4000 a month. IE, barely enough to buy food in Beijing. Add in that a real university is probably going to want the FT to do more work than a podunk normal college, and I really don't see the point.
Working for a prestigious school would be a good resume booster if you want to move to an even more prestigious school, but as I said, what's the point? International schools and joint-venture unis still pay more. And if you have the credentials (PhD, research, pubs) to get hired at one of the REAL prestigious schools in China (Beida, Qinghua, Zhejiang Uni, and a couple of others), you aren't likely to improve your chances that much by teaching for a year at some 'prestigious' college that, let's face it, is still a joke outside of China. |
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Non Sequitur
Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 4724
Location: China
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 4:47 am Post subject: |
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| MisterButtkins wrote: |
| Quote: |
| It's a prestigious school... |
Does this really matter? The prestigious schools in China don't necessarily pay more. I remember, a couple of years ago, Beida was advertising for ESL teachers for 5600 a month. They wanted a masters degree with publications. I personally was offered a job by a Beijing school that is 'prestigious' for 4000 a month. IE, barely enough to buy food in Beijing. Add in that a real university is probably going to want the FT to do more work than a podunk normal college, and I really don't see the point.
Working for a prestigious school would be a good resume booster if you want to move to an even more prestigious school, but as I said, what's the point? International schools and joint-venture unis still pay more. And if you have the credentials (PhD, research, pubs) to get hired at one of the REAL prestigious schools in China (Beida, Qinghua, Zhejiang Uni, and a couple of others), you aren't likely to improve your chances that much by teaching for a year at some 'prestigious' college that, let's face it, is still a joke outside of China. |
I am talking about the China context and as a nationally ranked (as opposed to provincial level) school it is seen as prestigious.
Certainly the students I encountered there seemed to feel they had done well to be accepted and the MBA programme seemed to attract good enrolments.
The salary was mentioned by the OP and I commented on what bang the school might want for that kind of buck.
As for internationals, their main concern, as far as my contacts have said, is a home country teacher registration. Expat parents sending kids to international schools insist on that. A PhD wouldn't trump it.
People on a pathway into academia often work their way up through various employers until they reach tenured nirvana.
If you need to, sneer away at Chinese employers. But the fact that you are on this site suggests you are in the Chinese system and without other ready options. |
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Denim-Maniac
Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1238
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 6:01 am Post subject: |
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Ive only ever witnessed / been around one person who has done a runner. And that was a PhD holder! She wasnt a qualified teacher of course, or even an experienced one ... but very academical.
She started working at my place ... spent 4 x 90 minute lessons doing introductions. Seeing as that is 4 x 90 minutes with the same class of just 6 students, it didnt go down too well. Not sure what the hell she was doing that took so long, but the students complained to our education department on the fourth day ... our PhD holder disappeared that same night. She wrote a nasty email to the boss apparently, although I didnt see it, and fled China. |
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hochhasd
Joined: 03 Jul 2008
Posts: 422
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 8:54 am Post subject: |
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| Denim-Maniac wrote: |
Ive only ever witnessed / been around one person who has done a runner. And that was a PhD holder! She wasnt a qualified teacher of course, or even an experienced one ... but very academical.
She started working at my place ... spent 4 x 90 minute lessons doing introductions. Seeing as that is 4 x 90 minutes with the same class of just 6 students, it didnt go down too well. Not sure what the hell she was doing that took so long, but the students complained to our education department on the fourth day ... our PhD holder disappeared that same night. She wrote a nasty email to the boss apparently, although I didnt see it, and fled China. |
Pile
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MsBlackcurrant
Joined: 22 Aug 2012
Posts: 77
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 8:41 pm Post subject: |
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Last year I got in touch with a British PhD holder who was teaching English at a Chinese university. I'm a PhD holder who's seriously considering doing the same this September. (These PhDs aren't in TEFL).
Increasing competition for university posts in the UK means that you have to present a strong research profile to be considered for employment. If you haven't developed such a profile before you graduate then you have to do so afterwards. Some people will get jobs in shops or offices, etc., while they do research - but there are lots of other folk after those jobs too! Moreover, some hiring committees look askance at this kind of experience.
The appeal of teaching in a Chinese university is that you're working with the appropriate age-group in an educational environment, and that you have enough spare time to study. The downside is that you won't have easy access to books and articles (not everything is on kindle). You'll also need some academic support from back home, or some kind of online academic network.
My aim would be to produce one/two drafts of a monograph over one/two years in China. The final draft would be sorted out on my return to the UK. It would be interesting to know if anyone else has used their free time in China this way. |
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Non Sequitur
Joined: 23 May 2010
Posts: 4724
Location: China
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 11:22 pm Post subject: |
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| MsBlackcurrant wrote: |
Last year I got in touch with a British PhD holder who was teaching English at a Chinese university. I'm a PhD holder who's seriously considering doing the same this September. (These PhDs aren't in TEFL).
Increasing competition for university posts in the UK means that you have to present a strong research profile to be considered for employment. If you haven't developed such a profile before you graduate then you have to do so afterwards. Some people will get jobs in shops or offices, etc., while they do research - but there are lots of other folk after those jobs too! Moreover, some hiring committees look askance at this kind of experience.
The appeal of teaching in a Chinese university is that you're working with the appropriate age-group in an educational environment, and that you have enough spare time to study. The downside is that you won't have easy access to books and articles (not everything is on kindle). You'll also need some academic support from back home, or some kind of online academic network.
My aim would be to produce one/two drafts of a monograph over one/two years in China. The final draft would be sorted out on my return to the UK. It would be interesting to know if anyone else has used their free time in China this way. |
Great post!! |
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it'snotmyfault
Joined: 14 May 2012
Posts: 527
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| Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 12:26 am Post subject: |
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| MsBlackcurrant wrote: |
The appeal of teaching in a Chinese university is that you're working with the appropriate age-group in an educational environment, |
There's a good chance that you'll go into the prestigious uni with your PhD, looking forward to getting down to some serious work and the students will say..."can you sing a song for us?", then play with their i phones for 90 minutes.
A few people have told me that the hardest thing about uni's such as Peking and Xiamen is getting accepted, and once there you don't have to work hard for your degree. I don't know how true that is, but I can easily believe it.
Like you say though, It'll look better on your CV than Starbucks or Waterstone's. |
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MsBlackcurrant
Joined: 22 Aug 2012
Posts: 77
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| Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| it'snotmyfault wrote: |
| MsBlackcurrant wrote: |
The appeal of teaching in a Chinese university is that you're working with the appropriate age-group in an educational environment, |
There's a good chance that you'll go into the prestigious uni with your PhD, looking forward to getting down to some serious work and the students will say..."can you sing a song for us?", then play with their i phones for 90 minutes.
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Actually, I've quite enjoyed singing songs in my previous experiences of teaching EFL! It's preferable if there's something in the lyrics that warrants discussion. I once got a group of Spanish students singing along to 'Mad Dogs and Englishmen'. Do you think Chinese students would like that?
As for i phones, what sort of educational exercise are you referring to there?? I'm a bit technologically challenged, but I get the impression that the Chinese EFL classroom needs to work out how to incorporate mobile phones into the learning programme or else admit defeat! |
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it'snotmyfault
Joined: 14 May 2012
Posts: 527
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| Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 1:30 am Post subject: |
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| MsBlackcurrant wrote: |
| it'snotmyfault wrote: |
| MsBlackcurrant wrote: |
The appeal of teaching in a Chinese university is that you're working with the appropriate age-group in an educational environment, |
There's a good chance that you'll go into the prestigious uni with your PhD, looking forward to getting down to some serious work and the students will say..."can you sing a song for us?", then play with their i phones for 90 minutes.
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Actually, I've quite enjoyed singing songs in my previous experiences of teaching EFL! It's preferable if there's something in the lyrics that warrants discussion. I once got a group of Spanish students singing along to 'Mad Dogs and Englishmen'. Do you think Chinese students would like that?
As for i phones, what sort of educational exercise are you referring to there?? I'm a bit technologically challenged, but I get the impression that the Chinese EFL classroom needs to work out how to incorporate mobile phones into the learning programme or else admit defeat! |
If you like singing I'm sure the students will love you.
There's no educational exercise going on with their phones, they just chat to their friends on the social network sites, play games, watch movies.
I don't know what the answer is, some kind of technology that disables phones when they're in the classroom, now that would be useful!! |
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