Job Discussion Forums

[vikeologist]

Only certain schools are allowed to employ non-Chinese nationals.

I thank Bobrage on Raoul's China Saloon for the following information.

Quote:

This is the list of work units (companies, colleges, schools, universities, baozi stalls) that are authorised to employ non-Chinese nationals and have been given an Alien Employment License Number (AELN) that allows them to do so. Every year the State Administration of Foreign Experts updates this list. You can use this to check if your potential employer has the right to hire you, or whether something dodgy is going on.

http://webadmin.safea.gov.cn/pic/wjs/1397097838.mingce20140331.pdf

Admittedly it's in Chinese.

If you are not employed legally (for instance you didn't get a letter of invitation / Z visa) then you could be subject to a fine of 5000 to 20,000 RMB. In serious circumstances, detention of five to 15 days may also be imposed.

http://lawandborder.com/faq-new-china-visa-law/

Of course people may choose to work illegally, (which would include working for a second employer that isn't your main / sponsoring one). You may think it's worth the risk. I think that's up to you, but if you're caught, ignorance won't be accepted as a defence by the Police.

I think that the board quite rightly has rules on advocating working illegally, so there's no point having a discussion on whether we should work illegally.

However, maybe people could identify schools or situations to avoid, or if you're thinking of coming to China and you're not sure if you're being told the truth by a potential employer / recruiter in this regard, then you could ask for clarification.[/b][/b]

[JamesD]

I don't want to hijack your thread but this might be the start of a handy list for newbies.

Checklist:
If any of these apply to you............

- the school won't put you in touch with a current FT.
- you don't have enough money to live on for at least three months (in case an employer dumps you).
- you can't (emotionally or financially) afford to turn around and immediately fly home if an employer does not start paperwork for a work visa within the first week (some can still convert visas, many can't).

..then for the sake of all, please do not come to China.

[vikeologist]

Hijack away.

One thing that's worth mentioning is that a school may genuinely have reasons for someone to come on a tourist visa and then pop to Hong Kong to get the student visa.

Typically this will be to save time because they need you to start urgently.

Often this is just a lie to get you to come to China, but even if it's true, you may fail to get a z visa in Hong Kong, especially if you're American. I've heard in the last week of a visa being refused for 2 stupid reasons, one of which was that China are unhappy with USA at the moment.

The visa office in the USA are a lot less likely to be anti-American.

Yet another reason to only come on a z visa if you're going to work here.

[JamesD]

[goodbyeus]

I am going through this situation now. What's puzzling is that I was hired by a very large and seemingly reputable university, not a private english school. The school seems to insist that I come on a tourist visa. When I questioned this and said that I thought that this was illegal, the response was that it is illegal to teach without permission from "the Bureau" and that the Fao will change my tourist Visa to Z visa as soon as everything is prepared (earlier he told me a list of documents that I needed to change the tourist visa into a Z visa). After reading the laws, this still does not seem like a good idea so I suppose I will keep job searching : /

[Bud Powell]

How about: Have a Clue

I was on vacation in the states and eating in a restaurant in the Blue Ridge Mountains last year. I got into a conversation with the waiter who said that he was looking into China as an alternative to waiting tables. He had no education beyond high school.

I have no doubt that he found a job and has made a perfect S of himself.

[Bud Powell]

[Non Sequitur]

[Bud Powell]

[Non Sequitur]

It means relying on the number of degrees (credentials) an individual has rather than testing on-the-job ability.
Your further information about the waiter is interesting.
Hopefully his CV would show him up in an application process. Then maybe not (TIC and all that).
Best

[Riff Raff]

income usually correlates to income. always exceptions. some of the most charming, accomplished. and financially secure ppl i know have degrees and some never finished high school.

the more i know about the universe, the less i know. degrees are an indicator. in itself, degree tend to be... useless and unnecessary. save for legal fec etc.

it might convince joe schmoe to let u try, but having a driver's license and certs dont mean ya can drive like a pro.

love love love the op links above. thanks vike !

[Riff Raff]

...

[wonderingjoesmith]

Dear OP,

I wonder how many local employers follow the law or are above the law and how many employees follow the law or are protected by the law. Who the system is set up by and who for would be interesting to know as well.

I look forward to identifying all that mainland China has to offer.

Rationally yours,
Joe

[Juice]

http://www.expatforum.com/expats/china-expat-forum-expats-living-china/464018-cftu-confirms-1-600-china-foreign-teachers-deported-2014-so-far.html

As you can see from the above, it is what the China job agents and recruiters DON'T tell you! I would wager that less than 10% of them are even licensed to do business in China. My Recruiter went by the name of "Michelle Wang" but now I learn her real name is "Zhang Mei Li" and she uses 12 different email addresses and she just changed her disposable mobile telephone number.

While in China (before I got deported) I never once got to see or know her office location and the people she said she worked for now claim they don't even know her. Looking back, I think agents and recruiters should be avoided altogether and newbies should use the links the OP posted and find their own jobs. Before I got the boot one of my colleagues showed me a list of direct employers he got from the CFTU, but it was bad timing for me (I got picked up three days later when the visa cops came to our school unannounced).

I never even heard about SAFEA until after arriving in China.

[mw182006]

Ahh, I thought it smelled like CSTFU around here.