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MrLucyTheBoxer
Joined: 05 Aug 2014
Posts: 9
Location: Gold Coast, Australia
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 Posted: Sun Aug 10, 2014 11:16 pm Post subject: Qualifications Matrix |
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Hi,
I was just wondering if anyone has put together a qualifications matrix for what is required to teach English (legally, on a visa) in different countries? I was thinking that something that some kind of table that named the country, the requirements, and a link to the official visa site would be good.
I'm happy to compile it if you want to post the info in comments below.
Cheers,
Ben |
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suphanburi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014
Posts: 916
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| Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 2:08 am Post subject: Re: Qualifications Matrix |
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| MrLucyTheBoxer wrote: |
Hi,
I was just wondering if anyone has put together a qualifications matrix for what is required to teach English (legally, on a visa) in different countries? I was thinking that something that some kind of table that named the country, the requirements, and a link to the official visa site would be good.
I'm happy to compile it if you want to post the info in comments below.
Cheers,
Ben |
The biggest problem with such a matrix is that the various governments keep changing the rules as we go, ie:
Associate + TEFL
degree + native speaker
degree + TEFL
degree in education
degree in "English"
to name but a few.
In the decade that I was in Korea it went from native speaker to NES + TEFL, NES + degree, NES + degree + police check, to finally, for work in public schools, NES+degree+police check+TEFL.
The same is happening in other countries as different governments try to tighten up their education systems.
One thing that is fair to say is that, for those places that don't yet require a degree, it will soon be the entry level document. For a LARGE number of countries it already is a requirement for a visa or work permit.
Coupled with those almost insurmountable and constant changes there is also the fact that the rules are different based on YOUR country of origin.
North Americans are pretty much locked out of western Europe.
Americans can't work at teachers in Brunei.
Some countries permit only those with passports from "NES countries (US, UK, Ireland, Canada, Aus, NZ and sometimes South Africa).
etc.
And again, the goalposts constantly change based on other political treaties between nations.
Good luck with your project.
Personally, I would suggest that you check the requirements at the local embassy/consulate that you will be getting the visa issued at. They will tell you what they want this week for the documentation to accompany your visa application.
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 5:07 am Post subject: Re: Qualifications Matrix |
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| MrLucyTheBoxer wrote: |
| I was just wondering if anyone has put together a qualifications matrix for what is required to teach English (legally, on a visa) in different countries? I was thinking that something that some kind of table that named the country, the requirements, and a link to the official visa site would be good. |
Requisite job qualifications can vary among employers based on their individual business needs and/or academic directives. Be aware there are countries in which employers and not the visa regulations dictate the minimum required experience, licensure, and academic qualifications regardless of the profession. In this sense, the visa regs don't distinguish between a hotel maid and a nuclear physicist in terms of what's required for general (legit) employment. However, the government may require that foreign workers' qualifying academic degrees must have been completed via face-to-face/on-campus instruction and not through online or distance learning (i.e., online degrees are not recognized). Plus, visa regs specify which nationalities can obtain legal work despite some employers' preference for some nationalities over others (e.g., native speakers only).
Other than singling out any remaining countries in which someone without a degree might still find legal employment, I'm curious as to who you contend would be interested in a qualifications matrix---how that target audience would find such a tool useful. Frankly, since both the job postings and the country visa requirements clearly indicate what's needed, where's the value in this type of matrix? Besides, visa regulations aren't static; they can/do change, which means this type of matrix would require regular updates in order to maintain some level of accuracy. |
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MrLucyTheBoxer
Joined: 05 Aug 2014
Posts: 9
Location: Gold Coast, Australia
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| Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 5:18 am Post subject: |
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Hi Nomad,
I think that anyone who is interested in teaching overseas would find this useful. It would offer a one-stop place to review all the different requirements to work out where you could go, without having to go and look at 27 different job ads to try and work it out.
Besides, from my experience, looking at jobs in China and Vietnam for example, the requirements from job to job are different, which is why I was interested in the official regulations. For example, in Korea, there is a special visa for English teachers which has minimum requirements, yet different schools and universities ask for things above and beyond this.
Just thought it would help people out.
Ben |
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esl_prof
Joined: 30 Nov 2013
Posts: 2006
Location: peyi kote solèy frèt
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| Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2014 4:24 pm Post subject: Re: Qualifications Matrix |
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Ben,
Assuming that you have the time and energy to put such a matrix together, I don't think it would hurt. Indeed, the more readily accessible information that's out there, the easier it is for everyone, especially the new and inexperienced.
Perhaps the easiest way to do this would be to set up a public Wiki or spreadsheet (see http://adjunct.chronicle.com/ for a similar but technologically more sophisticated example) that would enable instructors from around the world to submit or update data about legal requirements in their respective countries.
If the initial effort went well, then perhaps the matrix could eventually be expanded to include the difference between minimum legal and actualemployer requirements for a job (when those exceed the legal minimum) or, for that matter, salary, benefits, and working conditions at specific schools.
I think this idea has a lot of potential. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 5:39 pm Post subject: |
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| MrLucyTheBoxer wrote: |
| I think that anyone who is interested in teaching overseas would find this useful. It would offer a one-stop place to review all the different requirements to work out where you could go, without having to go and look at 27 different job ads to try and work it out. |
Okay. For what it's worth, the governments of Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, and Qatar will not approve employment visas for foreigners whose qualifying university degrees included online coursework. |
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VietCanada
Joined: 30 Nov 2010
Posts: 590
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| Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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An undergraduate degree in English would probably be sufficient for most countries in the world. Add a BEd to that and your golden in any any country wishing a teaching certification in addition to any plain old bachelors.
Get a Masters in English, education or linguistics to accompany your BA English, get published and a whole new world will open up before you.
TEFLs, TESOLs and CELTAs are for those who cannot get the education degree or a relevant masters for whatever reason. Or for those on an extended ego trip. They are particularly useful for those with bachelor degrees in irrelevant subjects. Despite the fact that just having the degree demonstrates a proficiency and/or an awareness of English usage well above what's necessary for a basic EFL position. |
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Shroob
Joined: 02 Aug 2010
Posts: 1339
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| Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 5:37 pm Post subject: |
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| VietCanada wrote: |
An undergraduate degree in English would probably be sufficient for most countries in the world. Add a BEd to that and your golden in any any country wishing a teaching certification in addition to any plain old bachelors.
Get a Masters in English, education or linguistics to accompany your BA English, get published and a whole new world will open up before you.
TEFLs, TESOLs and CELTAs are for those who cannot get the education degree or a relevant masters for whatever reason. Or for those on an extended ego trip. They are particularly useful for those with bachelor degrees in irrelevant subjects. Despite the fact that just having the degree demonstrates a proficiency and/or an awareness of English usage well above what's necessary for a basic EFL position. |
Gonna have to disagree with that. Having a degree does not demonstrate anyone's proficiency to teach - unless that degree is in teaching/has teaching elements. Nor does it demonstrate an awareness of English usage 'well above what's necessary for a basic EFL position'. Having a degree in media studies, history, IT, or a whole host of subjects does not give one an understanding of the English language or how to teach it.
The TEFL, TESOLs, and CELTAs are relevant to the teaching market and, I'd argue, much more useful than an irrelevant degree. If I was a DOS I'd take someone with a CELTA over someone with a degree in physics any day of the week. No offense to any physic grads out there. |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| An undergraduate degree in English would probably be sufficient for most countries in the world. |
Not in Europe or in any Anglophone country that I am aware of.
Ditto what Shroob said - and, in addition, I'd take a CELTA holder over a BA English any day. Knowing something about the language is no signal that one can convey that knowledge effectively to non-native speakers thereof (and yeah, I have hired people occasionally over the past decade +). |
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Sashadroogie
Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 11061
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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| Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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| VietCanada wrote: |
| Despite the fact that just having the degree demonstrates a proficiency and/or an awareness of English usage well above what's necessary for a basic EFL position. |
Whatever about the highly subjective comments about certificate courses, the above idea is just deeply mistaken. |
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Sashadroogie
Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 11061
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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| Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2014 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Shroob wrote: |
The TEFL, TESOLs, and CELTAs are relevant to the teaching market and, I'd argue, much more useful than an irrelevant degree. If I was a DOS I'd take someone with a CELTA over someone with a degree in physics any day of the week. No offense to any physic grads out there. |
This idea is very much in line with the realities of the EFL world. |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 3:58 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| TEFLs, TESOLs and CELTAs are for those who cannot get the education degree or a relevant masters for whatever reason. Or for those on an extended ego trip. They are particularly useful for those with bachelor degrees in irrelevant subjects. Despite the fact that just having the degree demonstrates a proficiency and/or an awareness of English usage well above what's necessary for a basic EFL position. |
It happens rather often that someone with experience solely in one country generalizes that experience to the whole world of EFL.
This seems to be such a case to me; the advice given here most certainly wouldn't apply to many, many job markets in the field worldwide. |
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Sashadroogie
Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 11061
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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| Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 4:21 am Post subject: |
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| spiral78 wrote: |
| Quote: |
| TEFLs, TESOLs and CELTAs are for those who cannot get the education degree or a relevant masters for whatever reason. Or for those on an extended ego trip. They are particularly useful for those with bachelor degrees in irrelevant subjects. Despite the fact that just having the degree demonstrates a proficiency and/or an awareness of English usage well above what's necessary for a basic EFL position. |
It happens rather often that someone with experience solely in one country generalizes that experience to the whole world of EFL.
This seems to be such a case to me; the advice given here most certainly wouldn't apply to many, many job markets in the field worldwide. |
So very, very true... |
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