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Making it Work while Teaching on a University Salary
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buravirgil



Joined: 23 Jan 2014
Posts: 967
Location: Jiangxi Province, China

PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

astro-turfing is not hard to spot
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Emp1



Joined: 25 Mar 2015
Posts: 50

PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dblkhqc wrote:
Redact personal information, not all, but enough if you like, so we can still who and what you are and where you are ... I'd love to see this legally required written permission from your primary employer and it being signed off by the Foreign Expert Bureau for this extra work you are doing. I guess it doesn't exist. Another Immigration Criminal Violator. Hiding as criminals. I'm an open book because I follow the law.


Lol, immigration laws that aren't enforced don't concern me.
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bograt



Joined: 12 Nov 2014
Posts: 331

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Lol, immigration laws that aren't enforced don't concern me.


How does doing extra jobs work out with taxation? is that not enforced either?
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mike w



Joined: 26 May 2004
Posts: 1071
Location: Beijing building site

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Emp1 wrote:
dblkhqc wrote:
Redact personal information, not all, but enough if you like, so we can still who and what you are and where you are ... I'd love to see this legally required written permission from your primary employer and it being signed off by the Foreign Expert Bureau for this extra work you are doing. I guess it doesn't exist. Another Immigration Criminal Violator. Hiding as criminals. I'm an open book because I follow the law.


Lol, immigration laws that aren't enforced don't concern me.
\


Hahaha. TROLL1 vs TROLL2 ............. astoundingly hilarious!!!!
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7969



Joined: 26 Mar 2003
Posts: 5782
Location: Coastal Guangdong

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mike w wrote:
Emp1 wrote:
dblkhqc wrote:
Redact personal information, not all, but enough if you like, so we can still who and what you are and where you are ... I'd love to see this legally required written permission from your primary employer and it being signed off by the Foreign Expert Bureau for this extra work you are doing. I guess it doesn't exist. Another Immigration Criminal Violator. Hiding as criminals. I'm an open book because I follow the law.


Lol, immigration laws that aren't enforced don't concern me.
\


Hahaha. TROLL1 vs TROLL2 ............. astoundingly hilarious!!!!

Only 1 can come out alive.
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buravirgil



Joined: 23 Jan 2014
Posts: 967
Location: Jiangxi Province, China

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mike w wrote:
Hahaha. TROLL1 vs TROLL2 ............. astoundingly hilarious!!!!

Maybe you know this? But they're likely not separate entities. It's a technique of astro-turfing, or guerilla marketing.
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Emp1



Joined: 25 Mar 2015
Posts: 50

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bograt wrote:
Quote:
Lol, immigration laws that aren't enforced don't concern me.


How does doing extra jobs work out with taxation? is that not enforced either?


Nope, cash in hand.

mike w wrote:
Hahaha. TROLL1 vs TROLL2 ............. astoundingly hilarious!!!!


Because those who put their financial needs above those of their employer are trolls, obviously.

Get your head out of the sand and start running the numbers concerning how much you need to save to have 'x' quality of life when you stop working. Hell, working for 6000rmb a month is a crap life anyway even without considering savings.

You all need to be focused on money, money, money. Failure to do so will ultimately see you in a state nursing home when you hit old age, or worse...not being able to pay for the doctors fees when you hit a serious illness (as many of us will eventually).
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mike w



Joined: 26 May 2004
Posts: 1071
Location: Beijing building site

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Get your head out of the sand and start running the numbers concerning how much you need to save to have 'x' quality of life when you stop working. Hell, working for 6000rmb a month is a crap life anyway even without considering savings.

You all need to be focused on money, money, money. Failure to do so will ultimately see you in a state nursing home when you hit old age, or worse...not being able to pay for the doctors fees when you hit a serious illness (as many of us will eventually).



Oh, you're hilarious. Do you really think you are the only foreigner in the whole of China who thinks about saving and investing for his/her retirement?

I know of very few who haven't already gone down that road, and who haven't got any sort of plan, and I know many who have their long-term finances well planned.

I'm afraid it's you who needs to get your head out of bank balance and have a good look around.

Yes, there are a few who will ultimately fall flat on their 'derriers' in later years, but please, don't make the general assumption (which from the 'trolling' tone of your posts is what you are doing) that everyone is in the same boat.

And just for your peace of mind. The RMB6000/month you quoted in your last post - I earn that in a week - I stopped teaching in schools and universities about 10 years ago. I don't have a problem with anywhere to live (I own two properties 'back home'). My Chinese wife owns property in China. When I retire in 3 or 4 years time, I will not be leaving China. And bank balance is bulging. Happy now?

Somewhere in a previous post I think you said you had been here 11 or 12 years - that means you've still got a lot to learn.
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Son of Bud Powell



Joined: 04 Mar 2015
Posts: 179
Location: Since 2003

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Emp1 wrote:

Professional doctors go to medical school. Professional lawyers go to law school. Accountants take the CPA. Teachers take their PGCE/MA in Education. If you have no higher level quals, it's not a professional job, it's entry level transitional work where you can both easily replace your employer and be easily replaced yourself.

No one wants to directly take on the argument about banking lots of money being essential. They can't, because it's true. Anyone working in China and banking less than $2,000 USD a month is setting themselves up for a tough life long term.


WAKE UP CALL: DAYTIME

In the U.S. college and university professors don't major in education, and they aren't certified. By the time someone enters college, the "how" of education is not as important as the "what". Method is not stressed because it is assumed that students who enroll in college already know how to learn and how to behave.

If you don't have a college education empt1, you are not only not a professional, but you are also not legal.
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Emp1



Joined: 25 Mar 2015
Posts: 50

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mike w wrote:

Oh, you're hilarious. Do you really think you are the only foreigner in the whole of China who thinks about saving and investing for his/her retirement?

I know of very few who haven't already gone down that road, and who haven't got any sort of plan, and I know many who have their long-term finances well planned.

I'm afraid it's you who needs to get your head out of bank balance and have a good look around.

Yes, there are a few who will ultimately fall flat on their 'derriers' in later years, but please, don't make the general assumption (which from the 'trolling' tone of your posts is what you are doing) that everyone is in the same boat.

And just for your peace of mind. The RMB6000/month you quoted in your last post - I earn that in a week - I stopped teaching in schools and universities about 10 years ago. I don't have a problem with anywhere to live (I own two properties 'back home'). My Chinese wife owns property in China. When I retire in 3 or 4 years time, I will not be leaving China. And bank balance is bulging. Happy now?


Congratulations, although if you look at the content of my posts and the topic of this thread, my posts are aimed at university teachers. You're not earning 6000rmb a week at a Chinese university so your 2 properties and whatever job you have are not relevant to this discussion.

My stance is simple...6000rmb a month is not enough. It's not even close. Looks like we agree on that. So then we move onto the solution. How does a university teacher earn more money? Well, the most obvious way is to teach more classes. Assume he uses the uni salary for general living...this will of course assume a nice holiday abroad to a place outside China once a year, like most workers in the west manage to do...so we're not living on just 3000rmb a month here, we're using the full salary. To bank the 12000rmb a month that is essential for long term quality of life, that's going to be a lot of extra classes. Assume the teacher gets 200rmb per class, that's 60 extra classes per month, or around 15 a week. If the teacher has 16 university classes as well, that's 31 classes in total...quite a lot and would be extremely tiring if you were giving 100% all the time and going proper planning and marking for them.

But wait? 15 extra classes is relatively easy to get by walking into a high school or training centre in the evenings. We could work Saturdays and during some of the uni vacations too, and make even more money! That will mean we're saving much quicker since every additional yuan earned is going straight into the savings fund. If we slack off at uni, we're only really putting in effort for 15 classes, meaning we can add a few more, get some more cash, and still not suffer burnout, especially as uni jobs are only active for 8 months of the year.

Do you see where I'm going with this? More classes means more money. If any newbie ESL teacher has an ambition to own a couple of properties and have a bulging bank balance as you claim you do, he'll be wise to prioritise quantity of classes over quality, since it's the quantity that brings home the money.

I would also add it's more important to do this when you're young. If you can work, work, work for a few years and save above and beyond that $2,000 amount, that's much less work you need to do when you're older because of the power of compound interest. Younger ESL teachers in particular should not care about lesson quality at all providing it's enough to not get fired (and it takes an awful lot to get fired here...) since a yuan earned today is 2 yuan you won't have to earn tommorow.
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bograt



Joined: 12 Nov 2014
Posts: 331

PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How many properties an anonymous internet poster says they own or how much they claim to make a week isn't interesting to most people one here I imagine, but Emp1 raises some issues about work that are worth discussing. Personally I can understand the attitude that low pay should equal low productivity and making hay while the sun shines. However, unlike him, I would never break the law. I make sure I pay taxes in my own country and wouldn't feel comfortable not doing it in another. People come up with all sorts of reasons to excuse themselves from any responsibility for this - I put my family first, I don't agree with the system, rich people do it all the time etc...In the end it boils down to how much integrity you have as a human being. It's the easiest thing in the world to avoid any responsibility to the greater society you're living in and when people are not forced into it, it takes a lot of growing up to be honest and contribute.
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mw182006



Joined: 10 Dec 2012
Posts: 310

PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Weird, I make 6k/mo teaching 9 hours a week and live just fine. I love these wackos that pop in from time to time to tell us how to live our lives and that we're all doing it wrong if we're not exactly like them.
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Deats



Joined: 02 Jan 2015
Posts: 503

PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I kind of understand what he is saying. And I agree that living fine on 6k a week can only go so far. Yes you can live fine NOW, but what about later? You have NO pension, NO money to fall back on.

I never taught in other institutes, I always had kids come to my house - these were kids of other uni teachers and their friends. My wife and I raked in $5500 a month between us. After 4 years doing this I could afford a house - but I don't need to buy one cos I get given a free house with my teaching gigs.

However, when I retire the money is there and will only continue to grow over the next 25 years. Living the life of a retired person in the West is damn expensive. Even in Asia it will be expensive if you have any medical problems.

Don't think people should do feck all work though. I was always professional to the level I needed to be - i.e. don't give work to be marked as it is all plagiarism anyway. With no marking, life is a lot easier.
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Emp1



Joined: 25 Mar 2015
Posts: 50

PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mw182006 wrote:
Weird, I make 6k/mo teaching 9 hours a week and live just fine. I love these wackos that pop in from time to time to tell us how to live our lives and that we're all doing it wrong if we're not exactly like them.


Awesome long term future you've got going here.

Deats wrote:
I kind of understand what he is saying. And I agree that living fine on 6k a week can only go so far. Yes you can live fine NOW, but what about later? You have NO pension, NO money to fall back on.

I never taught in other institutes, I always had kids come to my house - these were kids of other uni teachers and their friends. My wife and I raked in $5500 a month between us. After 4 years doing this I could afford a house - but I don't need to buy one cos I get given a free house with my teaching gigs.

However, when I retire the money is there and will only continue to grow over the next 25 years. Living the life of a retired person in the West is damn expensive. Even in Asia it will be expensive if you have any medical problems.

Don't think people should do feck all work though. I was always professional to the level I needed to be - i.e. don't give work to be marked as it is all plagiarism anyway. With no marking, life is a lot easier.


Don't try and wake the ostriches up to their reality. They're apparently quite happy earning peanuts, but woah man, look I only have to work 14 hours a week, I'm free like a bird and can wake up at 11am... Rolling Eyes Woah man look at how professional I am, look at how much extra time I can put into my lesson plans, the Chinese definitely don't laugh at me for being a sucker earning peanuts while they drive to work in their Audi, oh no. Rolling Eyes

You've got the right idea - private lessons in the evenings, batten down the hatches and save some serious money while the gravy train is still flowing. I prefer to teach in other institutes because the money is more reliable in terms of if they cancel you still get paid, but there's plenty of ways to make the money rain from the sky...I think your way has the higher 'ceiling' in terms of earnings but is also more difficult to set up.
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Deats



Joined: 02 Jan 2015
Posts: 503

PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It took a year before I earned some serious money. But once word of mouth gets around, you don't have enough hours in the day! On a weekend I would teach at the dining room table, the missus in the study and we'd be knocking out 18 hours per day combined. Cha-ching. Also, there is no travel time or taxi fares to pay if they come to you.

I always worried about getting busted going to another school. Nobody is gonna bust you in your own apartment. If someone wants to come in (not that they could/would) you say you are babysitting your friends' kid.

One other thing I did once I had my students... privates would sometimes just not show up or cancel a minute before the lesson. So I typed up a contract. They paid up front per term. This meant no cash changed hands at lessons any more. They could cancel up to 4 hours before a lesson and rearrange the lesson for another time in the term. Funny that nobody missed a lesson when they paid up front!!! Then it was guaranteed cash on the first day of term.

People who say it is illegal work, and not paying tax blah blah blah are daft. When in Rome... You should NEVER behave like you would in your own country, cos it isn't the way it works! People always say you should respect the culture and try and fit in... well cash in hand is what the Chinese do - restaurants, markets, taxis without meters etc etc.

Met plenty of people working for years in the same city and went home without a penny. Could never understand the mentality. Work hard, play hard. We took 2 x 2 month vacations around the world every year and still ended up with buckets full of cash.

So much so, I think we have decided to move back in September.
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