Job Discussion Forums

[talentedcrayon]

I have run into a bit of a problem at my current job. I've taught teens and university students before, and there are always a few who have no interest and don't care if they fail. But, at this university, the majority of my students are like this.

Half the class is on WeChat or playing RPGs on their phone. Another 40% of the class is asleep. Oh, wait, that's of the students who bother to show up at all. There is usually around 25%-50% absenteeism

That leaves me with about 2-4 students per class who are paying attention. In one of my classes there are 0 students paying attention.

However, even the few students who seem to care do not take notes or do the homework I assign. Also, they don't keep my handouts from week to week, so they are also lost a lot of the time.

I work for a technical college. So, these students are the ones with some of the lowest scores on the gaokao.

I have now started taking phones away from students if I see them in class. However, some students refuse to hand them over. Next week I am going to start kicking students out. There is no reason for them to be there if they are just going to play games and talk in class.

On Monday I scheduled a meeting with the department to discuss this.

I am at the point of either quiting... Or just resigning myself to teaching the 2-4 students who care, and failing the other 90%.

The university warned me when I took the job that their students were pretty unmotivated. But, I was expecting it to be similar to my last uni job.

Many students have already failed... and we are only 2 months in... because they won't be able to make 67% attendance.

Has anyone else been in this kind of situation? Any advice?

[7969]

Your main problem is these students aren't English majors, and for them English isn't a priority. I don't blame them for their lack of interest.

A high absenteeism rate shouldn't be a problem here. Obviously if they're not showing up they have no interest, and if they were there they'd probably be doing nothing anyway. Don't worry about this group because they aren't causing you any difficulty by not being there. If they fail that isn't your problem, and it's no different from teaching back in Canada or the US.

For students who do show up but aren't paying attention, get them active in some way. Either by starting a discussion, or if you're giving a lecture, ask periodic confirmation questions to see if they grasped the information. Hand out some kind of short written assignment that you'll check in class. This will urge at least a few of them to get busy doing something. No idea what kind of lesson you're giving but maybe you can try something different than what you're doing now.

Tell your students that if they're not interested in this class to not come, and at the end of the term you'll "reward" them by giving them the bare minimum to pass. I'd rather disinterested students not show up than show up and do nothing. Then you can focus on the students who really are there to learn. It's not an ideal solution, but it's better than what you've described is currently happening. Or you can just fail them all, but some schools have a policy where no students are permitted to fail. You might want to ask about that.

Forget about taking phones away. First they don't belong to you, and secondly a lot of students use the phone as their dictionary (even in your classes there will be a couple using it for that purpose). Confiscating phones isn't going to win you any respect either. Before anyone comments on that I prefer to win respect by showing respect. On that same note I hope you're not one of these FTs who flip out and start screaming at students for doing/not doing this, that and whatever else. That will also backfire on you, and make you look like an idiot. You don't seem to be that kind of teacher though.

I've got a couple of rules in my class that work well. I let the students know they can use their phone but turn it down so I don't hear it. Many of them use it as a dictionary, and I know some are on Wechat, but if I don't hear it I don't worry about it. I also let my students know that they can't be late. Once the bell rings if they're not in class don't bother coming. Both of these rules are clearly explained on Day 1 and so far this term I've had a total of zero problems with my students regarding phones and being on time.

[JamesD]

This might help a little. Since you're at a tech school can you slant the lessons to include vocab/jargon or situations they might encounter in their 'professions'? May gain the interest of a few more.

(Are they military brats? What are they doing with RPGs in class?)

[JB140767]

[quote]A high absenteeism rate shouldn't be a problem here.

Yeah it should, sometimes students are required to study things they don't particularly want to - it is the essence of being a student.



Tell your students that if they're not interested in this class to not come, and at the end of the term you'll "reward" them by giving them the bare minimum to pass.



Horrific advice



Forget about taking phones away..... Confiscating phones isn't going to win you any respect either


Somehow I think at least some of the students will respect the teacher who stands up to these lazy bums. I am also confident the students will not respect any teacher who is basically a doormat to facillitate these guys


lot of students use the phone as their dictionary (even in your classes there will be a couple using it for that purpose).

so make a rule - dictionary ok, but if I see wexin or angry birds, I take it away

Confiscating phones isn't going to win you any respect either. Before anyone comments on that I prefer to win respect by showing respect.

Theres a difference in being respectful to students and being a pushover



I know some are on Wechat, but if I don't hear it I don't worry about it.

Awful, just awful

[wangdaning]

In a university situation there is no right to take a phone away. If you do try, be ready to be told you are stealing (because you are).

OP, it seems really bad. You might talk to those in higher places. If they refuse then just let the class know they are a joke unless they shape up.

[7969]

[talentedcrayon]

At my uni, teachers are allowed to take phones away. I place them on a desk at the front of the room and the students get them back at the end of class. It isn't stealing, its a 90 minute confiscation and the students can see their phone sitting at the front of the class.

I teach accounting, so I am already using the jargon (constantly). But, as I proved to my students this week... I know more accounting vocabulary in Chinese, than they do in English, and it isn't my job to learn accounting in Chinese. I thought leading by example, and proving to them that it was possible for an intermediate Chinese speaker to learn the vocab, might inspire them to learn in English (I was wrong).

But, its not just their poor English that makes this hard. It's clear to me that many of these students do not even understand simple things in Chinese like what affect debiting accounts recievable will have on the balance of accounts receivable. What that says to me is that, even after 2 years of accounting education, they have learned absolutely nothing. They have literally wasted the last two years of their life.

I spend hours and hours rewriting a textbook into plain and simple English, preparing visuals, preparing simulations... I give them what I create... and they don't even bother to look at it.

I think my options are...

1.) Quit...

2.) Keep on keeping on and just accept that 90-95% don't care. Perhaps, with time I can win some of them over.

[JB140767]

[rogerwilco]

Most of my lesson plans are based upon the students speaking about themselves.
I assume that most of them are narcissists that love to talk about themselves.

That is what works for me, and 95% of them speak in every class.

[LarssonCrew]

Couldn't stop laughing at wangdaning and his comment. Taking a cell phone away is stealing?

Let's look at the legal definition of stealing

"Removing someone's property with the intention of permanently relieving them of it.'

Well, if you plan to return it at a later date then you are not doing that, are you.

Of course, if the Chinese teachers did that, no students would complain and they'd be humble and apologise.

I just wish China would stop making a divide between a Chinese and a foreign teacher. Include them in everything and treat me as if I were a staff member, not such that 'Well he's not Chinese, he won't want to [insert thing here.]' I can't imagine me not respecting the Dutch European Community Law lecturer less than a local British teacher whilst I was at university.

Seems alot of staff and student differentiate entirely between the two [Of course they don't want us to get involved in them making all their dirty, under the table corrupt money]

[rogerwilco]

[spiral78]

Guys, this is clearly an institutional problem. I suggest the OP schedule a meeting with the powers-that-be, describe the situation, and negotiate together what s/he can legitimately do.

This has quite a lot of benefits:
whatever steps the teacher takes to gain control will have institutional backing
pass/fail will be on specific terms agreed with the institution
OP will find out exactly how much (or little) the institution values the work he's trying to do - and can then gauge the time and energy he spends on it accordingly

The powers at the institution should be open to such discussion as they've acknowledged lack of interest on the part of the students in advance.

Frame it as 'asking for advice' but be sure to have some ideas for improvements in mind - have something ready to offer.

[7969]

[talentedcrayon]

[spiral78]

Let us know the outcome of the meeting!