Job Discussion Forums

[GTZetton]

Greetings, all. I've written this post over the course of a few days, when I was looking through a bunch of topics here (and waiting for my account to be activated), so apologies if it seems a bit disjointed.

The gist of it is that, contrary to most people, I have a background in Japan(studies), but not in teaching, outside of recently finishing the Celta course. I intend to move to Japan and work as a teacher there, despite the fact that that is seemingly discouraged by most people here... But before I hop on a plane, I have some questions for you.

Some more background info
- I'm a Dutch (white, if it matters) male. Late 20s.
- Finished the CELTA course last Friday, have been recommended for a pass (probably just a normal one, not A or B). No other background in teaching. During CELTA I actually managed to work with a Japanese student for the Focus on the Learner assignment.
- BA and MA in Languages & Cultures of Japan completed (in English and Japanese), with a minor in English-Dutch & Dutch-English translation studies.
- Lived in Kyoto for a year (2012-2013) during my MA. It was the best year of my life.
- Japanese level somewhere between N1-2. Probably closer to 2 nowadays, I've gotten rusty since I came home.
- Looking to move to Japan for the long haul, preferably in the Kansai area (if not immediately then eventually) since that's what I know and love. But, as they like to hear, "I'm flexible."
- Was originally planning on teaching children, but 1) Celta is mostly about preparing you to teach adults 2) my TP groups at Celta have been so much fun I pretty much changed my mind anyway.
- Do not have a driver's license, let alone a Japanese one.

Qs:
- I was looking at Shane/Saxoncourt, but on the teflblacklist people are extremely negative about both the institution and the people who work there. Those posts are from 7-9 years ago though, (how) have things changed since then? They certainly sound like a very attractive option here http://www.saxoncourt.com/jobs-abroad/teach-english-in-japan/ Small classes, a one week young learner course to complement my Celta, full support with visa/bank accounts and accommodations, et cetera. Sounds too good to be true... Especially considering what they were apparently like a decade ago.

- With my background, what sort of pay should I be looking for? Based on some of the job listings and posts on this forum, somewhere between 250-300.000 p/m seems around average. I saw a very nice looking position at Ritsumeikan for 350k plus two 500k bonuses, but some of the requirements are quite literally above my pay grade, especially for someone as wet behind the ears as me. Living in Japan for a year during college has giving me somewhat of an idea of what to expect spending wise (I learned to love the 100 Yen Lawson very early on), but I wasn't making any money at the time. For reference: I lived in a college dorm for 34.000 yen a month with water/electricity/internet included. We had shared showers/toilets/kitchens (worth it). It wasn't the healthiest lifestyle but I was able to live on the cheap with a 100 Yen Lawson and a Nakau practically around the corner.

- I'm operating under the assumption that most native speakers don't speak much Japanese, at least not when they're first getting started there, and that my particular college background will compensate for the fact that I am not actually a native speaker of English, a requirement that seems to appear more often on job listings than mere 'native level English'. Should I disabuse myself of this notion? Or does this actually open up avenues for me to pursue that are unavailable to other would-be teachers who don't speak Japanese? Is there something specific I could/should look for? I have to imagine that I'm coming at this from a different background than most English teachers working in Japan.

- While I hesitate to call myself a Celta robot, as some people seem to refer to new Celta graduates, it is definitely true that Celta is all I know right now when it comes to teaching. While I am certainly open to new/different teaching philosophies, I don't think it's weird when I say I would prefer to start at a place that at least somewhat thinks the same way as how I've been taught to think. Japanese companies generally seem to appreciate it if you have a Celta degree, but that obviously doesn't automatically mean that they also want you to teach the Celta way, just that they acknowledge the course's existence. I just read a post where someone said Nova was beginning to introduce the concept of pair work, when pair work is one of the top 3 things that have been drilled into me, so clearly Nova might not be the best place for me. That said, I know enough about the Japanese education system that more than a few parts of it are a 180 degree turn from what I've learned at Celta.

- Many places won't accept applications from abroad, while some do. Obviously it would be nice to get a job at a place that will help arrange your visa and accommodations before I get on a plane. But from what I've read, I get the sense that it is usually the less reputable (cowboy?) outfits that will take care of these things beforehand, only to then treat you like garbage, put you in a shoebox and charge you out the wazoo for the privilege of living in it. Does anyone have any good experiences with places that hire from abroad?

- People speak pretty highly of Interac in the "best schools for new teachers" topic, but I am somewhat confused by the "have acquired an education delivered in English for at least 12 years" requirement listed on their site. Do they mean "all" of the education, as in, " every course in grade/high school/college?" If that's the case, the "native-level speaker" requirement seems disingenuous and really just means "if you've had this many years of studying in English, you're probably a native speaker to start with." Is it even that big of a deal if I have 1) a BA/MA (taught in English and Japanese), and 2) recently passed the IELTS with a score of 8 (I still feel robbed)?
To make things even more interesting, this topic pretty much http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=107607 craps all over Interac from start to finish.

- This is more a question for down the line, but most of the discussions going on in this place seem to be about companies like AEON and Coco Juku. However, one person mentions that "jobs at private high schools and private junior high schools are often overlooked. You can make a pretty good salary at private schools and increasingly private high and junior highs are offering foreign staff tenure." ( http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=110411 ) How hard is it, and what is it like actually working at an 'ordinary' junior/high school? Is it radically different from working for a place like Interec? I say this is more a question for down the line because, from what I can remember, pretty much all of these places that could just as easily hire a Japanese English teacher, require at least several years of teaching experience before you'll even be considered. This is what I was originally aiming for, though, and I've still not dismissed the idea, regardless of my positive experiences with teaching adults at Celta.

- Follow-up to the question above: the vibe I'm getting is that you use a place like Interac/Aeon/Shane to get into Japan and then, as fast as humanly possible jump ship to look for a better place, after a certain point. What is that point? I'm thinking after you have the 2-4 years of experience necessary for most other jobs? Is that when you start looking for jobs at an ordinary school (maybe even a university if you have the extra qualifications required)? Does that mean you're almost certainly going to be stuck in an abusive relationship with your first employer for a few years after you get off the boat? It sounds almost like a hazing for English teachers. Also, what does that mean for the longtime users of this section of ESLCafe? Are you generally in nicer working environments, with only topics like this one reminding you of the emotional scars picked up in your early years? People refer to these places (and eikaiwa in general) as stepping stones, and places from which they move on. Move on to what? Surely not another crappy place they can cross off the list.

- Probably a nonstarter, and as someone who has actually studied Japanese culture for the better part of a decade, I should know better, but I have to ask: are there any places where dress codes are not a huge deal?


I realize that I've been answering my own questions here and there as I've been preparing this post, but I'm guessing you guys still have a lot of useful and interesting input.

Thanks! And sorry for the godzilla sized post. It's almost 3 pages in my Word document...

[TokyoLiz]

With your background, you may be a good candidate for the JET Program, and there is a precedent of Dutch participants. You ought to try for a CIR position.

http://www.jetprogramme.org/index.html

Eikaiwa really is a hazing - it's how you get an initial visa to work in Japan. The alternative is ALT contract work. I came over years ago with an awful recruiter (they misrepresented the job), escaped in four months to a private high school job and have taught EFL and language arts since.

Interac, don't get me started. As a former school board administrator, I saw Interac do all kinds of despicable and illegal things. It took a lot of effort to run them out of town, but the city did it. Grrrr.

[GTZetton]

I looked into JET before I even learned of Celta's existence (I think everyone who studies Japanese does so at some point), and at least one guy I know from college has done it (in 2013 or 14, I think), but there are only two places for people from the Netherlands every year (well, two ALTs and one CIR), so the odds of getting in don't seem great. Plus, I'm obviously already too late to do anything in 2015. Having to wait until March 2016 is a bit too long for my taste. I was hoping to be in Japan before there the end of 2015 (I'm assuming eikaiwa don't follow the Japanese school calender, which would be one of the few nice things about them).

Shame about your experiences with Interac. Out of all those institutions, that one seemed the least shady, until that one topic and now your post.

Edit:
I've read some posts that say putting working experience at an eikaiwa on your CV might actually be a bad thing. Does JET experience have any similar negative connotations? I'm not sure about CIRs, but being an ALT is different from being a 'real teacher' who does everything him/herself, so I'm wondering if ALT experience as a JET guy is considered particularly relevant. I would think that CIRs are probably even further removed from actual teaching since it sounds like it's mostly behind the scenes work.

[Mothy]

As a former JET, it's only helped me get jobs after JET. The only drawbacks to someone in your position doing JET are the long odds and having to wait.

[nightsintodreams]

I actually quite liked Interac. Depending on which region you are placesd it can be a good job to get you started in Japan, BUT I'm pretty sure that (just like all/almost all the dispatchers) they wont take non-native speakers.

As much as this should not be the case, I'm afraid that being a native speaker means a lot more to companies than having any Japanese ability. This country is full of idiot English teachers who can't speak a lick of Japanese, but the number of times I've met a non-native English teacher can probably be counted on one hand, and they were usually on spouse VISAs.

Of course, search for a job first, but if you can't find one, just apply for a working holiday VISA and come on over for a year.

Unfortunately, with your nationality and choice of degree (Japanese studies), the odds are probably against you being able to stay beyond that first year, unless of course you meet someone and get married.

Good luck!

[currentaffairs]

1. I might look into Westgate and the options on offer. Short three month contract and one year work visa (so you get some time to find a 'proper job').

2. I would probably go for the Kansai area because you will have more opportunities there (and you liked Kyoto). Anywhere outside Tokyo basically.. especially for a non-native speaker.

3. Check websites like ohayosensei, JALT, JREC and jobsinjapan.

4. As a non-native speaker you might want to do the Cambridge Proficiency exam (CPE) at some point.

Good luck!

[GTZetton]

I just received an email from one of my CELTA instructors. She was approached by someone at Gaba in charge of marketing efforts in Western and Northern Europe. Apparently they are expanding and increasing their recruitment efforts in non-English speaking countries, including the Netherlands.

Long story short, I am (indirectly) pretty much being handed a job offer at Gaba on a silver platter, with the caveat that, from what my own research has told me, it is tantamount to a poisoned apple. But, beggars can't be choosers, I suppose.

[nightsintodreams]

Yea, they're pretty terrible but if I were you, I'd still take it.

After all, you're a non-native English speaker who majored in Japan studies, what else are you going to do?

Once you're here and settles, you can look for something better.

[marley'sghost]

"The Poisoned Apple of Gaba"....I like that.
The only good thing with GABA is that with their flexible working hours you can schedule yourself lots of time to look for a better job.
Sadly, Interac is probably one of the better dispatch outfits. No horror stories in my branch really. The company will thread every loophole to keep you temporary, transient, and part-time, but the folks in my office are at least helpful and friendly on the rare, rare occasions I have any contact with them.

[Lamarr]

GABA won't really develop any of the skills you've learned on the CELTA. Teaching quality and teaching development comes right down the bottom of the list. All they're bothered about is that you turn up on time and don't annoy the clients, so that they're not put off signing up for more lessons.

GABA, and a lot of eikaiwa, are only concerned with getting as much money off people for as little outlay as possible (in other words, keeping overheads and wages as low as possible). It's got nothing to do with teaching and education.

It's basically just a money-making racket, and nothing more!

[GTZetton]

Well, I applied. They emailed me back asking if I had either 3 years ESL experience or a BA (or higher) degree that was taught in English. My MA was taught in both English and Japanese (both of which are listed on my diploma, while only English is listed on the site of the programme), so I should probably be okay?

At least they emailed me back at all. Quickly too. Only 1 day instead of the 10 they said it might take. I guess that's a good sign.

[rtm]

[GTZetton]

I gave a clear, accurate answer and said that the language courses were in Japanese and all the other ones were in English.

I was operating under the assumption that just saying "yes, it was" would not be good enough and they'd want some sort of proof, so I sent scans of my diploma, a supplement and my transcript. =/

If that means I've already shot myself in the foot, well ****.

[GTZetton]

Okay, so I made it through that part without any problems, they said it was fine.

My current problem is references. I'm sure I can get one from one of my Celta instructors, but I can't get any from previous employers, which is what one of the two needs to come from.

Crap.

[GTZetton]

Phew. Got that part covered, somehow.

Sent in my recruitment form, cover letter and everything yesterday, and got a response today. First interview early next week! The saga continues.