Job Discussion Forums

[LongShiKong]

Is it just me or does the number of NNSETs seem to have increase? Here in Beijing, I've met dozens of Russians in the past year who're all teaching kindergarten on business visas. If it's happening here in Beijing and Shanghai as the article below suggests, it's probably going on in smaller cities to an even greater degree. Anyone have stats or care to guess on the NS to NNS expat teacher ratio within their educational sector, city, province or nationally?

[LongShiKong]

Here's the source article in the Global Times: http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1027455.shtml

[rioux]

"However, considering China's massive need for foreign English teachers, it's not clear how stringently this new rule will be implemented and how far it will spread."

Even with non-native English speakers teaching there is still a tremendous shortage of teachers. Put this policy in place, do a total block of VPN's nationwide, tighten the regulations of the NET's and those NET's who remain will demand big time pay seeing they are the only few ones left.
http://forums.eslcafe.com/job/viewtopic.php?t=115943

I have an idea....make it so the NET's that remain must have their MA degrees as well or be certified teachers.

[OhBudPowellWhereArtThou]

Certification is a good idea for primary grades and in secondary grades, but certification in which areas? In the U.S., areas of certification are numerous. Is a certified math teacher or a French teacher, or a science teacher qualified to teach English? Is a certified Education teacher actually qualified to teach anything or everything? (They understand the how of teaching, but do they understand the what of teaching?) In the junior division level (freshman), BA and BS curricula are pretty much a re-hash of high school unless one places in an advanced course (a distinction that is not always noted in the transcripts except, perhaps, with the tag of as "honors").

I have no problems with non-native speaking English teachers teaching in China. I've known teachers from Germany, Sweden, Norway, and Denmark (all former engineers, not English majors) whose understanding (and command) of the English language far outstripped many degree-holding native speakers .

I believe that there is a place for those who hold only a TEFL certificate. My observation is that they are (or were) mostly to be found in the language mills that handed the curriculum to the teacher. As long as they had good command of the curriculum and stuck to it, most performed admirably, sometimes better than degree holders.

I think that what is needed in China is a better match of degree to the subject area to be taught. This is especially needed at the university level.

On the Chinese university level, a masters degree in the area to be taught should be required. That and a university-prescribed curriculum should be given unless the FT's area of expertise lies outside the university's ability to set such a curriculum.

It was proposed that all teachers be required to be certified in their home countries. That's a lovely idea, but in most states, certified teachers are required to continue to take classes throughout their careers. What if the certified FT doesn't complete the required coursework and their certification lapses? Should they be required/allowed to return home to complete the required coursework?

Should the FT college teacher be required to be certified when his own country has no certification system for university and college teachers?

A lot of thought (something which seems to be sorely lacking in many cases) must go into implementing changes in order to get the desired effect of hiring foreign teachers to teach in Chinese schools.

[Non Sequitur]

It's hard to see the manpower planning in recent events:
1. Insisting on native speakers.
2. Insisting on degree + 2 years work.
3. The uptick in numbers teaching remotely who may in previous times have actually worked in China.
The only explanation I've heard is that it is intended to provide more jobs for Chinese grads returning from overseas.
My Chinese informant says that to come back from say the UK with a commerce degree and be forced to work as a teacher, would be a huge loss of face - not to mention the income differential.

[ChrisHenry15]

It'll affect the market for FTs marginally at best.

[The bear]

Even if the rules do tighten up, which they have been, 'legitimate' foreign teachers won't benefit as some posters believe.

All it will do is increase the number of illegal teachers - those on the wrong visa.

If China was serious about this, instead of flowery words and half-assing everything, they'd have a crackdown on employers as well as employees. Wouldn't take much and the message would spread. But until that happens you'll see the business visa teacher, questionable degree teacher, tourist isa teacher.

Also, being a native speaker doesn't automatically make you a good teacher. I'd rather hire a non-native with good English and teaching qualifications than a native speaker with a BA in an unrelated subject.

[asiannationmc]

Now that China’s has combined the Alien Employment Permit and the Foreign Expert Permit; integrated into the Permit System for Foreigners in China, a work permit based on a single number classification system that will follow the foreign worker so look for other changes to occur. Seems an online application process (only in Chinese) can now be accessed by the employer in China. submit an application, documents to a centralized management system for foreign workers

Read this on China Briefing .