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Manasketa
Joined: 25 Jun 2004
Posts: 35
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 Posted: Sat Jun 26, 2004 7:18 pm Post subject: minimum age requirement |
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what is the minimum age requirement to get a job as an ESL teacher in China?
I'm only 17, but I'm done high school, got teaching experience, and TEFL certification. |
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anthyp
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
Posts: 1320
Location: Chicago, IL USA
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| Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2004 3:53 am Post subject: |
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| Manasketa wrote: |
| I'm only 17, but I'm done high school, got teaching experience, and TEFL certification. |
I've heard some pretty crazy stories of kids teaching in China - so yeah, you could probably find a job here. There might be an age requirement for the work permits and Visas, but hey, this is China!
Your school may even lie about your age to get you the papers you need!
Sorry but I think you should go to college for a few years, then decide whether you really want to teach.
Oh, but you already "got" teaching experience, huh? What kind?
Stay in school. |
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Manasketa
Joined: 25 Jun 2004
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2004 4:19 am Post subject: |
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 well, i'm happy for you if you can afford to "stay in school"...
For your information, i finished high school a while ago, and my teaching experience was 2 and 1/2 years of volunteer work teaching about twenty grade school kids. I enjoyed it a lot. And if it weren't for financial reasons, I would still be "in school", becoming a fancy doctor of something or another. and would probably not bother with ESL...
Perhaps I wasn't really clear on my first post, so i suppose your reaction is normal. I'll have you realise, though, that I'm much older than my years suggest. And I have no intention of being treated like a "kid" because of a mere technicality. I appreciate your suggestion to get a degree, but I'm afraid that that is not only impossible (in my case), but now undesirable: I've seen what post-secondary education can do to some people.
So anyway, does anyone *know* if there is some legal technicality that would stop me from getting a job in China? To be more specific, I'm 17 turning 18 in late November. -Thanks again  |
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anthyp
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
Posts: 1320
Location: Chicago, IL USA
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| Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2004 5:00 am Post subject: |
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Here are the requirements for applicants for a FE certificate in China:
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2 The qualifications of invited foreign experts:
a who meets the requirement of the regulations
b whose educational degree should be bachelor or above
c whose technologic title should be engineer or above
d who should have work experiences for 5 years or above in certain specialty and be competent for the task.
e who is specialized in certain technology or specialty and special skill which is necessary in China;
f who has management experiences for five years or above in oversea;
g who had ever worked as a manager of certain department in a large or middle-size foreign fund enterprise or a high-tech enterprise or above |
http://www.ebeijing.gov.cn/Jobs/ForeignExperts/EconomicTechnological/t20030927_39645.htm
which doesn't sound like you.
If you had read my first post carefully, however, you would already know that, in spite of this technicality, in spite of everything you are supposed to be and do as a FE in China, it is possible to find schools here that will hire you anyway. |
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nolefan
Joined: 14 Jan 2004
Posts: 1458
Location: on the run
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| Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2004 5:08 am Post subject: |
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While it is technically impossible for you to get a job in China per the regulations, I have seen many folks get around the requirements by volunteering..... As a volunteer, all the extra requirements do not apply to you and you still get the same benefits and air fare etc....
Over the may hollyday, I met a 16 years old Chinese American who was teaching in a high school that shall remain nameless. |
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naturegirl321
Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 9041
Location: home sweet home
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| Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2004 9:39 am Post subject: |
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If you really want to come here, read some books, prepare for culture schock and apply for jobs. Just make sure that the schools that you want to work for are legit.
You will find in China, not everyone follows the rules. Even though you SHOULD have a BA or life experience, ex be mid-30s, you may get a job anyways.
Good luck! |
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justcolleen
Joined: 07 Jan 2004
Posts: 654
Location: Egypt, baby!
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| Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2004 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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Manasketa - I have to give you credit for both your sense of direction and your sense of adventure.
Colleen |
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Manasketa
Joined: 25 Jun 2004
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2004 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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anthyp - okay. sorry about the huffiness earlier. it's just that i get the "kid" treatment a lot when people don't know how I am. I appreciate the link. that is to get the status of 'foreign expert', right?
nolefan - volunteering sounds like a good idea. Actually, i did find a volunteer position, but it was offered by Yakup International. Would taking up this offer be running after trouble? (but then again, given my position, i think i'll be "running after trouble" no matter what I do to get into China...  )
naturegirl321 and justcolleen - thanks for the encouragement! |
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justcolleen
Joined: 07 Jan 2004
Posts: 654
Location: Egypt, baby!
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| Posted: Sun Jun 27, 2004 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Manasketa wrote: |
| ... justcolleen - thanks for the encouragement! |
Over the course of my lifetime, I've learned that , when in doubt, the best course of action is to first ask myself what the worst possible scenario might be then decide if I can live with it. Sometimes the worst possible scenario is simply someone might tell us no, but one person is not everyone. If you ask for a job and one person tells you no, move onto the next.
As much as I would like to encourage you to go on to college and get your degree, I know that's not an option for everyone. When the time and conditions are right for you, perhaps you'll go. I understand that you're not convinced a degree is necessary, and for a lot of people it isn't. But it does open a lot of doors that would otherwise be closed.
I will have my B.A. in August, three weeks before my 42nd birthday, and more than 22 years after I graduated from high school. My diabolical plan is to be teaching in China as fast as I can get there (likely still wearing my graduation attire!), finally nursing my own supressed wanderlust.
What's the worst possible scenario for you? Your age may restrict your ambitions. If that's the case, all you have to do is find something else to fill your time until you meet whatever the age requirement (legally) is. Then you go and teach. Right?
I wish you the best.
Colleen |
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anthyp
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
Posts: 1320
Location: Chicago, IL USA
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| Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2004 6:09 am Post subject: |
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I, too, must apologize for the tone of my posts.
I am one of those who would like to see this field a little more "professional" ... but my sarcasm wasn't really warranted. And I was wrong to call you a "kid."
Yes, that is a link for the requirements to teach as a FE in China. Now, I understand the whole issue of "Foreign Experts" has changed recently, but, from what I understand, you still have to be an FE (or possibly "Foreign Teacher") to teach English here.
That being said, good luck! As you seem to recognize, you can run into trouble in any kind of position in China - as a volunteer or teacher.
I have heard both good and bad things about Yakup (mostly bad), so, if you can't find anything better, you might want to look into it. |
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lajzar
Joined: 09 Feb 2003
Posts: 647
Location: Saitama-ken, Japan
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| Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2004 8:44 am Post subject: |
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| Manasketa wrote: |
well, i'm happy for you if you can afford to "stay in school"...
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You can't afford to stay on at school, yet yu can afford to fly half way round the world for a job in a country which pays very little? Whatever.
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For your information, i finished high school a while ago, and my teaching experience was 2 and 1/2 years of volunteer work teaching about twenty grade school kids. I enjoyed it a lot. And if it weren't for financial reasons, I would still be "in school", becoming a fancy doctor of something or another.
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You may find that classroom dynamics are remarkably different because of your age. At your age, there is no way any students at JHS age or higher would take you seriously, and regardless of how you see yourself, any school that hires you will likely do so because they see someone who isn't mature enough to stand up for themself.
Not my opinion, wish that's all it was. Simply an observation of human nature.
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and would probably not bother with ESL...
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If EFL is merely a second choice career for you, I'd definitely NOT want you working in the same school as me.
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Perhaps I wasn't really clear on my first post, so i suppose your reaction is normal. I'll have you realise, though, that I'm much older than my years suggest. |
Funny, when I was your age, I thought I knew everything too. Perhaps you do, perhaps you don't. But no one ever lost money betting against genius 17 year olds.
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| And I have no intention of being treated like a "kid" because of a mere technicality. |
It's not your opinion that decides how you get treated, it's theirs. Don't convince us; convince the Chinese. Have fun telling your Chinese boss he's wrong 
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I appreciate your suggestion to get a degree, but I'm afraid that that is not only impossible (in my case), but now undesirable: I've seen what post-secondary education can do to some people.
So anyway, does anyone *know* if there is some legal technicality that would stop me from getting a job in China? To be more specific, I'm 17 turning 18 in late November. -Thanks again |
I believe the legal technicality is if you have about 10 years of paid work experience in the relevant field, then the degree requirement can be waived. However, I suspect you are looking for illegal technicalities.
You want to teach, get a degree. It's that simple. It sucks, but then, so does life in general  |
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Manasketa
Joined: 25 Jun 2004
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:32 pm Post subject: |
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Lajzar:
To all the personal pseudo-assaults, i simply won't bother answering, since it is useless to bandy words about one's character with someone who has no idea who I am and what I am about. Believe as you will: it doesn't cost me a thing.
However, I would like to let you know that teaching ESL is not a second choice. Put simply, if I had taken the time and enormous amount of money necessary to get a doctorate, or even a BA, I am far less likely to NOT USE IT. As far as I can tell, med students use their degrees to practice, not teach ESL.
However, I'm glad we agree not to form a pair in a school. I'll hold you to that. 
Take care |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2004 2:12 am Post subject: |
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| Manasketa wrote: |
Lajzar:
However, I would like to let you know that teaching ESL is not a second choice. Put simply, if I had taken the time and enormous amount of money necessary to get a doctorate, or even a BA, I am far less likely to NOT USE IT. As far as I can tell, med students use their degrees to practice, not teach ESL.
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You're from Canada. You might want to research what you need in order to teach ESL in Canada (or indeed what is required of an individual to get "even a BA"), before insinuating that material learned is not applicable to teaching, or more specifically, teaching ESL. A degree is a barrier that must be passed. Just like knowledge of English is a barrier that must be passed in order to get into university or a good high school for many of the students taught in Asia. A degree is also insufficient if you want to teach ESL in Canada. You need further training. Further training specific to teaching ESL and an undergraduate degree is a pre-req.
Consider this: most of the people who are manager-trainees at Staples, Chapters, Block Buster etc. have degrees. It's a job that used to require only a high school education. You have a high school education. Why would somebody on the other side of the world trust you with their business (because if they lose their clients- students- then they will lose their business as well), if people in your own country no longer consider you adequately prepared to be taught how to be a manager of seventeen year olds who are working after school and people making a full-time living doing retail?
A university degree is proof that you can finish something that you started and proof that you can think. If you want to work in an academic setting, then you need to be able to proove that you can think.
Get a loan, go back to school. Or get a full time job at staples etc. and find out what full time work is all about. Either way, you'll learn something, and after all, life is a learning experience. |
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Manasketa
Joined: 25 Jun 2004
Posts: 35
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| Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2004 2:38 am Post subject: |
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everything you say is very true. most jobs now do require a degree.
i find it sad though, that today you need to spend 30-40000$ to prove that you can think... |
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johnslat
Joined: 21 Jan 2003
Posts: 13859
Location: Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA
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| Posted: Tue Jun 29, 2004 3:13 am Post subject: If I only had a brain |
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Dear Manasketa,
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| i find it sad though, that today you need to spend 30-40000$ to prove that you can think... |
It's pretty clear you haven't met many people who have PhDs. in Linguistics.
Regards,
John |
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