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LongShiKong
Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 1082
Location: China
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 Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 1:04 am Post subject: Another case of brash self-accreditation in Canada |
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Some time ago, I wrote about the University of Toronto's Faculty of Education's (OISE's) Online TEFL program. I found it odd for a fac of ed to provide a teaching cert course without a prac, even if it is an online course. In fact, when I last wrote about it, the prac was optional:
From the FAQ:
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Is the TEFL (Online) Course accredited?
TEFL courses are not accredited. Institutions or universities can be accredited, but there is no official external accrediting or evaluation body to govern the standards of Teaching English as a Foreign Language (TEFL) courses.
The TEFL Online course was designed by the University of Toronto Faculty of Education, which is an internationally recognized university and ranked as one of the top 20 universities in the world. Upon completion of the course, graduates receive a certificate issued by the University of the Toronto Faculty of Education (OISE).
Is there a practicum?
No. There are no live or in-class components to the TEFL Online course and no teaching practicum. A practicum is not a requirement for all TEFL jobs. Teaching practice completed as part of a TEFL course does not count towards years of full-time teaching experience when applying to jobs. |
By that logic, one might expect them to argue, the only rationale for a B.Ed. prac would be to satisfy the Ministry. of Ed. and perhaps to cut costs the 4 months teacher candidates are off on practicum.
Well, here's another Canadian self-accrediting institution that's seemingly gone the next step, accrediting not just itself but feeder ed institutions: The Canadian Language Learning College. Note the following from the link:
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Proudly Recognized by a Canadian Provincial Government
THE ONLY SCHOOL IN THE WORLD
That Created an Award to improve the International Education Industry
CLLC is also recognized and associated with top educational organizations nationally and internationally, and maintains partnerships with over 40 university and college partners. |
Obviously, this is a gov't initiative to attract foreign students to Canada but to what extent is sponsoring int'l ed awards a conflict of interest when you're also hoping to partner with said int'l ed institutions to recruit those students? |
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Marinx
Joined: 15 Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Location: Guangdong
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| Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 3:52 am Post subject: |
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I don't see where it says they are funded by the Canadian government, or where it says they are accredited.
It looks like they are similar to Herzing College or University of Phoenix sort of thing. Privately owned though they probably do get *some* funding from the government of Nova Scotia.
"Proudly Recognized by a Canadian Provincial Government " means absolutely nothing. TEFL Canada is the Canadian (national) standard to meet.
The Canadian government said it would be increasing resources for ESL but it hasn't delivered, despite the fact that refugees are pouring in. I'm honestly not sure if they would provide a dime to any language center that wasn't properly accredited. |
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suphanburi
Joined: 20 Mar 2014
Posts: 916
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| Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 4:16 am Post subject: |
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They are just another language center with a good webmaster and marketing man.
They are NOT an accredited school or post secondary educational institution.
They are NOT a degree granting institution.
They are NOT a university or college nor are they legitimately affiliated with one.
They are just another EFL center taking money from foreigners for language classes and Canadian tourism.
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LongShiKong
Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 1082
Location: China
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| Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 4:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Marinx wrote: |
| I don't see where it says they are funded by the Canadian government, or where it says they are accredited. |
Well, it turns out they are accredited by both Languages Canada and the IALC but you have to scroll to the very bottom.
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| It looks like they are similar to Herzing College or University of Phoenix sort of thing. Privately owned though they probably do get *some* funding from the government of Nova Scotia. |
And the other provinces they've expanded to.
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| "Proudly Recognized by a Canadian Provincial Government " means absolutely nothing. |
Yes, it could mean they were officially recognized in a law suit.  )
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| TEFL Canada is the Canadian (national) standard to meet. |
For teaching, not for schools. See their accreditor IALC What should matter to students is not your credentials but whether the DoS ensures you measure up to them. I recall a CELTA observation where we thought we were in the classroom of an untrained newbie on his first day.
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| The Canadian government said it would be increasing resources for ESL but it hasn't delivered, despite the fact that refugees are pouring in. I'm honestly not sure if they would provide a dime to any language center that wasn't properly accredited. |
You've confusing landed immigrant/refugee ESL with foreign/exchange student ESL. The former's a minor drain on the economy, the latter's a major boost since the hope is they'll go on to degree programs in Canada.
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| They are just another language center with a good webmaster and marketing man... |
..and their own commercial passenger plane |
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Marinx
Joined: 15 Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Location: Guangdong
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| Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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| LongShiKong wrote: |
You've confusing landed immigrant/refugee ESL with foreign/exchange student ESL. The former's a minor drain on the economy, the latter's a major boost since the hope is they'll go on to degree programs in Canada. |
You are right. My reading comprehension was not spectacular, sorry. |
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LongShiKong
Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 1082
Location: China
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| Posted: Thu Oct 26, 2017 1:25 am Post subject: |
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I'm wondering if the 'and' in the bold heading at the bottom 'Accreditation and Membership' may be why they're downplaying their accreditation by an int'l ELT regulatory body. While the Better Business Bureau (BBB), for example is just as much a 'private members club', there's something in the following statement that I wouldn't expect from the BBB:
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| "IALC is a network of leading independent language schools and the Global Village schools are a perfect fit for us. They have a great reputation and all passed our inspection with flying colours," --- IALC president, Alexandra Borges de Sousa. |
Does it not seem the IALC, a supposedly independent governing body, stands to benefit from this inspection? I'm referring to the line: "are a perfect fit for us".
What do others think? |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Thu Oct 26, 2017 3:21 am Post subject: Re: Another case of brash self-accreditation in Canada |
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| LongShiKong wrote: |
Some time ago, I wrote about the University of Toronto's Faculty of Education's (OISE's) Online TEFL program. I found it odd for a fac of ed to provide a teaching cert course without a prac, even if it is an online course. In fact, when I last wrote about it, the prac was optional:
From the FAQ:
| Quote: |
Is the TEFL (Online) Course accredited?
TEFL courses are not accredited. Institutions or universities can be accredited, but there is no official external accrediting or evaluation body to govern the standards of Teaching English as a Foreign Language (TEFL) courses.
The TEFL Online course was designed by the University of Toronto Faculty of Education, which is an internationally recognized university and ranked as one of the top 20 universities in the world. Upon completion of the course, graduates receive a certificate issued by the University of the Toronto Faculty of Education (OISE).
Is there a practicum?
No. There are no live or in-class components to the TEFL Online course and no teaching practicum. A practicum is not a requirement for all TEFL jobs. Teaching practice completed as part of a TEFL course does not count towards years of full-time teaching experience when applying to jobs. |
By that logic, one might expect them to argue, the only rationale for a B.Ed. prac would be to satisfy the Ministry. of Ed. and perhaps to cut costs the 4 months teacher candidates are off on practicum.
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UofT OISIE is obviously trying to set up its own equivalent to a CELTA program, though an online only program. So that people can show their qualification and get a nice little checkmark next to the place "TESOL certificate" in areas where people don't really pay attention to what's what.
UofT ***does*** have a 'real' certificate program for language teachers. It's not through OISIE. It's through Woodsworth College, not OISE. It DOES require a practicum. And it is recognised by TESL Ontario for teachers in the LINC system in Ontario (which requires a one-year postgrad 'certificate' program). This online program is totally different. It's only a scam if you also feel that CELTA is a scam because it says it's from Cambridge university. I don't think many people would think of a CELTA as equivalent to any program that the University of Cambridge offers, though.
The entire thing is odd because UofT OISIE is where the international students go to learn English, and are taught by people who went through the program at Woodsworth college (of UofT).
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Well, here's another Canadian self-accrediting institution that's seemingly gone the next step, accrediting not just itself but feeder ed institutions: The Canadian Language Learning College. Note the following from the link:
| Quote: |
Proudly Recognized by a Canadian Provincial Government
THE ONLY SCHOOL IN THE WORLD
That Created an Award to improve the International Education Industry
CLLC is also recognized and associated with top educational organizations nationally and internationally, and maintains partnerships with over 40 university and college partners. |
Obviously, this is a gov't initiative to attract foreign students to Canada but to what extent is sponsoring int'l ed awards a conflict of interest when you're also hoping to partner with said int'l ed institutions to recruit those students? |
Different province. UofT is in Ontario. This is from Nova Scotia. These provinces are not even in the same region. Different provinces have different education systems.
As others have said, this is obviously a for-profit outfit and not a provincial college or university. (And so is the online TEFL from OISIE, which is why is specifically for TEFL - you cannot teach in Canada with it, they only offer it to make money). |
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LongShiKong
Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 1082
Location: China
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| Posted: Thu Oct 26, 2017 6:00 pm Post subject: Re: Another case of brash self-accreditation in Canada |
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| UofT OISIE is obviously trying to set up its own equivalent to a CELTA program, though an online only program. |
Obviously not succeeding. My guess is a CELTA and Trinity would be the only out-of-N.A. TESL cert's that TESL.ca would recognize and therefore, even in the UK or EU, the 300 hr Woodsworth College one with the 30 hr prac would be preferable than OISE's.
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| It's only a scam if you also feel that CELTA is a scam because it says it's from Cambridge university. I don't think many people would think of a CELTA as equivalent to any program that the University of Cambridge offers, though. |
Not unless someone tries passing it off as a 4 yr rather than 4 wk cert. 
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| Different province. UofT is in Ontario. This is from Nova Scotia. These provinces are not even in the same region. Different provinces have different education systems. |
No. Same province TOO. As I said, the college expanded which is seemingly why it has its own plane. Apparently they fly students from campus to campus throughout the year so they get to experience 4 different Canadian locales.
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| As others have said, this is obviously a for-profit outfit and not a provincial college or university. |
Bit of both, I'd say. Canadian colleges and uni's also exist for profit. Why else do you think there's a college strike on in Ontario now-----call it a class cash clash=== and B.Ed. programs admit far more candidates than anticipated teaching vacancies. |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 12:15 pm Post subject: Re: Another case of brash self-accreditation in Canada |
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| LongShiKong wrote: |
| Quote: |
| UofT OISIE is obviously trying to set up its own equivalent to a CELTA program, though an online only program. |
Obviously not succeeding. My guess is a CELTA and Trinity would be the only out-of-N.A. TESL cert's that TESL.ca would recognize and therefore, even in the UK or EU, the 300 hr Woodsworth College one with the 30 hr prac would be preferable than OISE's. |
TESL Canada doesn't cut it in Ontario, not for LINC programs. CELTA isn't accepted in LINC in Ontario.If you haven't got a TESL Ontario certificate (and there is a list of what is acceptable on their homepage) then you just won't be able to teach in the LINC program. So you can teach in a private language school. This certificate isn't even for that- it's for teaching outside of Canada (it may be that they HAVE to bill it like that to avoid it being a directly competing [but so much more craptacular] program to Woodsworth's program.) I think they still have a M. Ed offered off-campus in Second Language Education that requires a B.Ed or a TESL Ontario certificate (like someone with a B.Ed to teach elementary school learned the same as a person who learned psycholinguistics and second language acquisition), and is still more expensive than being an international student from Australia or New Zealand.
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| It's only a scam if you also feel that CELTA is a scam because it says it's from Cambridge university. I don't think many people would think of a CELTA as equivalent to any program that the University of Cambridge offers, though. |
Not unless someone tries passing it off as a 4 yr rather than 4 wk cert. |
Then why worry about it all? Tonnes of companies in Ontario offer TESOL certificates that aren't approved by TESL Ontario. They aren't useful in Ontario, unless you want to work at a private language school (not a provincial college or university)- and some of them won't be accepted by a private language school either- they bill themselves as for teaching 'overseas' and refer you to jobs that you can get with no training whatsoever.
(but actually an Masters of Arts {MA} at Cambridge isn't a graduate degree and people DO pass it off as a graduate degree. Same thing happens with people from Ancient Universities in Scotland, and Dublin and Oxford. Actual graduate degrees from those schools are called M.Lit and other things)
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| Different province. UofT is in Ontario. This is from Nova Scotia. These provinces are not even in the same region. Different provinces have different education systems. |
No. Same province TOO. As I said, the college expanded which is seemingly why it has its own plane. Apparently they fly students from campus to campus throughout the year so they get to experience 4 different Canadian locales. |
Yeah. Just like all those other certificates that are only useful outside of the province. Nobody in Ontario who has done any real research at all would go near any of them, unless their goal is to go overseas for one year and that's about it- they aren't interested in a career.
Many people aren't looking at doing language teaching for their career and so don't want to spend an academic year full-time in order to do that. A year at a university IS a masters degree in TESOL in other Commonwealth countries. Ontario just wants to force people into going back over and over.
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| As others have said, this is obviously a for-profit outfit and not a provincial college or university. |
Bit of both, I'd say. Canadian colleges and uni's also exist for profit. Why else do you think there's a college strike on in Ontario now-----call it a class cash clash=== and B.Ed. programs admit far more candidates than anticipated teaching vacancies. |
I'm not in Ontario now, but my understanding is that it's for pay for the part-timers who are getting screwed over.
It's not just B. Ed programs that accept far more people than the requirements. It most (if not all) of the postgraduate certificate programs offered through Ontario colleges (they show 90% plus hiring rates by including 'freelancing'- which means no job but looking). And the library science graduate degrees etc. It's most programs in Ontario. |
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Marinx
Joined: 15 Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Location: Guangdong
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| Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 2:16 pm Post subject: Re: Another case of brash self-accreditation in Canada |
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| GambateBingBangBOOM wrote: |
| ...TESL Canada doesn't cut it in Ontario, not for LINC programs. .... |
Ontario. The special snowflake of Canada. "I'm sorry nationally recognized program, we're superior to you." |
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Scott in Incheon
Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 58
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| Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 2:23 pm Post subject: |
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Just a quick note.
TESL Canada is closing its doors. With the loss of BC and Ontario it really didn't have the members to keep going.
Not sure what will take its place in other provinces. |
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Marinx
Joined: 15 Jul 2017
Posts: 86
Location: Guangdong
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| Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 3:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Scott in Incheon wrote: |
Just a quick note.
TESL Canada is closing its doors. With the loss of BC and Ontario it really didn't have the members to keep going.
Not sure what will take its place in other provinces. |
That's a bummer. Oh well, not a thing I can do about it. |
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ntropy
Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 671
Location: ghurba
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| Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| "Proudly Recognized by a Canadian Provincial Government " means absolutely nothing. TEFL Canada is the Canadian (national) standard to meet. |
TESL Canada announced last week it has voluntary closed its doors, no longer offering accreditation or any other service. |
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LongShiKong
Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 1082
Location: China
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| Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 5:17 pm Post subject: Re: Another case of brash self-accreditation in Canada |
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[quote="GambateBingBangBOOM"]TESL Canada doesn't cut it in Ontario, not for LINC programs. CELTA isn't accepted in LINC in Ontario.If you haven't got a TESL Ontario certificate (and there is a list of what is acceptable on their homepage) then you just won't be able to teach in the LINC program. So you can teach in a private language school. This certificate isn't even for that- it's for teaching outside of Canada (it may be that they HAVE to bill it like that to avoid it being a directly competing [but so much more craptacular] program to Woodsworth's program.) I think they still have a M. Ed offered off-campus in Second Language Education that requires a B.Ed or a TESL Ontario certificate (like someone with a B.Ed to teach elementary school learned the same as a person who learned psycholinguistics and second language acquisition), and is still more expensive than being an international student from Australia or New Zealand. [quote]
I could've saved you a lot of typing had I just drawn your attention to TESL.ca's 3 levels or 'standards'. Sorry.  |
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LongShiKong
Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 1082
Location: China
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| Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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| ntropy wrote: |
TESL Canada announced last week it has voluntary closed its doors, no longer offering accreditation or any other service. |
You obviously didn't read the FAQ page. |
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