Job Discussion Forums

[vre]

Dare I?

[stillnosheep]

Of course you dare! What are they going to do? Cover you in petrol and open up with the flamethrowers? Ah, on second thoughts ...

Hell no! Fire away!

[kev7161]

I just gotta say, I love this Documentary! I watched again just the other night. Michael Moore calls it as he sees it and his views match mine almost exclusively when it comes to Bush, the 2000 elections, Iraq and the other topics in his film. Go Mike!

[vre]

Me too. It wasn't exactly what I was expecting but I found it to be very well put together. The commentary was sometimes humerous and the footage was sometimes disturbing. It was a first class film. I'm not saying everyone should absorb it like a sponge but I hope that many people's eyes are opened further by watching it.

[Kurochan]

Any of you see it in a foreign theater? Where, and what were people's reactions?

I saw part of it -- until I had to go out and puke because of a combination of heat and bad cafeteria food -- here in China (it was my second viewing). For some reason the audience thought the Marine recruiters were HILARIOUS. I wish I'd been able to stick around and ask why.

[Atlas]

A good movie but Mr. Moore is making some mistakes:

Withholding it from the "Best Documentary" category for a run at the "Best Picture" Oscar. He's dreaming, that's not gonna happen. The film, while informative and entertaining and even enlightening, was also blatantly biased, and is not going to garner enough support for best pic. As much as I love the guy, he starts with a conclusion and then fills in the gaps to maximize the sarcastic effect. Consider the way he wormed his way into Charlton Heston's private home and then blindsided the old guy after an hour or so of sucking up. The man deserves the respect of the elderly, if not for his extraordinary accomplishments. It was just a low thing to do, and the humor rang hollow.

But then I'm old fashioned and I don't like my journalists forming my opinions for me. Call me Friday and just give me the facts. I guess those days are dead and gone.

Here's another mistake: Moore is lobbying to allow his picture to be shown on national television the day before the national election. I presume he believes he has a monopoly on the truth, and I understand his intentions and even laud his patriotic efforts. But he keeps hurting his own credibility. It strikes me that he wants to influence the vote, but not give people enough time to digest his argument or perhaps find fault with it. He wants to hypnotize people in the same propagandistic manner of his proclaimed nemeses in the Republican Party. Man, I'm tired of being handed political ultimatums by people with agendas.

Do me a favor. Don't ask me who I'm voting for or what my political affiliation is. It's none of your damned business.

[stillnosheep]

yeah atlas,

and half the world is tired of the US airforce wanderin' over and bombin' the beep out of them. Guess who gets tired first.

[Will.]

Haven't seen it...
Dare I/
Why bother now it is nothing i don't know already

[denise]

I saw it in Japan--few noticeable reactions, except for occasional chuckles (like during the ice cream truck scene). I was actually really surprised--pleasantly so--that it was even showing in Japan.

I hope, but seriously doubt, that there will be a major network in the States brave enough to show it.

d

[Atlas]

[kev7161]

But somebody has to do it. It is the same with the right wing. "We're right and you're wrong and that's all their is to it." When somebody believes in their viewpoints and opinions, nobody is going to sway them to change their minds (usually). If Moore made this documentary in a "middle-of-the-road" sort of way, it would have been nowhere near as controversial and far fewer people would have flocked to see it. His points would have been lost and, of course, he would have made less money. Bush and his cronies and all their business and political gaffes have made them easy targets. Moore does dump on the Democrats from time to time but, in the last four years, Republicans have been so . . . easy.

[James_T_Kirk]

I enjoyed the film, but Atlas is so right....this movie is extremely biased! I also disdain Michael Moore's tactics sometimes (the Charlton Heston thing was just wrong in "Bowling for Columbine"). However, I think "F 9/11" is definitely worth checking out if you haven't already done so: mostly interesting, sometimes depressing, sometimes funny, overall good.

Cheers,
Kirk

[stillnosheep]

[anthyp]

OK, here is a criticism of the film as a movie:

First of all, I agree that it is difficult to even consider it a movie in the same sense we do Citizen Kane or Night of the Living Dead. After all, those are artistic ventures, films that remain open to interpretation, as all living, breathing works of art must. What we have here is a piece that doesn't want to be interpreted, doesn't attempt to tell any kind of story, and doesn't exist outside the parameters of its creator's small little world.

So let's agree that it's not a movie in the proper sense, but a documentary. Documentaries are only as interesting as their subjects, and, in F911, we have a movie that is as much about Micheal Moore as it is President Bush. After all, Mr. Moore is in just as many (and probably more) screen shots. We see his amiable mug time and time again, asking (mostly rhetorical) questions in that smug, smarmy way of his. It is really a documentary of his attitudes towards Pres. Bush. And what he wants to do is attack him.

OK, as an attack on Pres. Bush it is certainly effective. Devastating, even. But somebody has already said it -- this is more propaganda than movie (or even documentary). There is no recording of events or attempt at objectivity. Mr. Moore is clearly not interested at any sort of truth -- merely his own interpretation of it. He wants to beat you over the head with (his assertion of) the fact that Pres. Bush lied and is sneaky. And the millions who've lined up don't seem to mind.

On his own website, Mr. Moore claims that 80% of those going into it are already pro - Kerry (although I wouldn't take these numbers too seriously; after all, he claims a whopping 100% leave anti - Bush (yes, that's right, 100%!). If you were to make a film about Pres. Bush, glorifying him and his achievements in office (there must be some of them), and millions went to see it, would that alone make it good? Or bad?

A movie's popularity in no way affects its greatness. Saying that it has "galvanized" millions of people is somewhat misleading -- after all, many of those were already more than willing to take what was offered as absolute gospel.

If you like Michael Moore, and what he's selling, chances are you'll like his movie. If you don't, chances are, you won't. I wonder how many who've seen it weren't already harboring strong anti - Bush feelings? Probably not too many.

Now, if somebody were to make a truly original film about Pres. Bush, equally devastating as F911, but without the lazy politics, the blatant prejudice, maybe we'd have something to talk about. I am envisioning something Citizen Kane - esque in scope, a true work of art that tells a story that needs to be told in a wonderful, artistic way.

Alas, Micheal Moore is not that visionary. He is as lazy and subtle as the movie he has produced. And F911 is no Citizen Kane.

My Rating: 3 / 10

[Atlas]

At risk of becoming enmired in a subject in which I have only a passing interest:

SNS wrote: