Job Discussion Forums

[Chairman Roberto]

This thread is in regard to the fascinating article MW recommended at
www.teachers.net/gazette/APR03/qiangwolff.html. (I hope I got that URL right, please correct me if it's not).

I can't make too many observations on this article, as I've only been here a very short time. I'm in no way an expert on the ESL situation in China. I could say, however, that I would give a hearty "hear hear!!" to Qiang and Wolff for their recommendation that there must be better training for the FAO. My FAO's nickname among the foreign teachers here is "Shady". He's generally a friendly, but mostly useless and befuddled bureaucrat who's made the unpleasant discovery that babysitting five foreign teachers wasn't going to be the cushy job he envisioned. His English is piss-poor, which has led to a series of aggravating miscommunications regarding telephone bills, work visas, currency exchange, and internet charges. Some of the foreign teachers think he's "trying to put on over on us", but others just chalk up these misunderstandings to the simple fact he's simply unqualified for the job.

My sharpest disagreement with the article is Qiang and Wolff's opinion that China needs no free speech, as the government already has its hands full taking care of 1.3 billion citizens: "With 1.3 billion people to provide for, there must be some restrictions on personal freedom, and this is one of them." Arrrgh!! What a crock of....! Don't get me wrong...I don't go into classes waving my arms and yelling "Free Tibet!" or "More F-15s for Taiwan!". I am very restrained in my lectures, and avoid political discussions whenever possible. I'm just sick and tired of the view that America, Australia, and the United Kingdom, the so-called "free speech regimes" as the writers put it, have some sort of monopoly on this civil liberty. I also have some students who would also take issue on Qiang's and Wolff's blanket assertion. The Chinese people can handle free speech...it's the government that can't!

Just wanted to vent on this issue...maybe I'm just tired of hearing about that Boy Scout of Perfection, Lei Feng. God, if there was any symbol of blind obedience to authority, he's it...

I am very intrigued by the writers' classification and evaluation of "1st tier, 2nd tier, 3rd tier" universities. To be honest, I'm not entirely sure where my school, Jishou Normal Teacher's College, falls into. It's definitely not 1st tier, as all the students here "dream" of someday making it into our big brother, Jishou University. I don't think it's 2nd tier, as my students are generally highly motivated...so I guess I'm at 3rd tier! How would you rate your uni?

My overall impression of this article was it is is quite informative, when it wasn't being defensive. (i.e. You don't like teaching 80 students? Try 150!). Alot of its documentation, interestingly enough, came from the ESL Cafe. Its ending recommendations are very sound, and I believe they would go a long way in improving ESL in the Wild West that is China.

thax for the recommendation,
Chairmain Roberto
Yet Another revolutionary screw in the salt mines of ESL China

[MW]

Your school is officially classified as 3rd tier.

APPENDIX �A�

Due to the nature of the historical development of education in modern China, defining a top tier, 2nd tier and 3rd tier institution of higher education in China is a convoluted matter, capable of supporting a separate journal article.. We are not dealing with a rule subject to exceptions but rather exceptions which overtake any rule. Simply stated, there are no universal criteria. The recognized criteria includes the level of government administration, the level of government financing, the level of students admitted, the level of faculty employed, as well as the history and reputation of the school. Top tier colleges and universities cater to the elite top ten percent of the potential freshman class. While there are some general determinative guidelines, the final determination is left to the court of public opinion.

In China there are separate classifications for Colleges, Technical Colleges, Training Colleges, Vocational Colleges, Universities, TV Universities, Institutes and Academies. Rankings are based upon the level of government supervision or management authority over the institution; the primary governmental source of funding; the quality of students accepted for enrollment; the geographical areas from which students may be accepted; the certificate or degree granting authority; the authority or law establishing the institution; its history and reputation; the quality of the faculty; the size of its campus, its total student enrollment; the ratio of Ph.D. faculty and full professors; and the extent and quality of its labs and other facilities. Top tier Universities ae usually located in the cosmopolitan cities of Beijing or Shanghai.

All comprehensive universities under the direct administrative authority of the Central Government, Ministry of Education, are top tier; while only some colleges and institutes under that direct authority are top tier, based upon their long history, community reputation, the quality of students, and quality of faculty. All of these top tier colleges and universities have the authority to grant doctorates and masters degrees.

Comprehensive universities under the administration of provincial governments are 2nd tier.
Comprehensive universities under local municipal administration are 3rd tier. Comprehensive universities at all levels are required to have an area of 1,000 mu, 10,000 students, and a specific ratio of Professors, Associate Professors, lecturers and Ph.D.s or they remain colleges.

Provincial Colleges are under the administrative authority of a provincial government and provide technical training. They may grant a two or three year certificate, four year diplomas, four year Bachelor degrees, seven year masters degrees, and some may grant nine year doctorates. Professional training colleges grant 3 year diplomas. A top tier provincial college has the authority to grant a doctorate degreeand are usually located in a provincial capital city. All others are 2nd tier. These colleges are primarily funded at the provincial level but they also receive some financial support from the provincial government and sometimes from the Central Government.

Municipal Colleges (as distinguished from municipal universities) are under the administrative authority of a local municipal government and grant three year special technical certificates or four year bachelor degrees. These colleges are primarily funded at the municipal level but they also receive some financial support from the provincial government and sometimes from the Central Government.

Vocational colleges are professional training institutions administered at both the provincial and municipal levels, with corresponding funding, but primarily they are municipal. These colleges grant 3 year diplomas and 4 year bachelor degrees. Ministry of Education, are top tier; while only some colleges and institutes under that direct authority are top tier, based upon their long history, community reputation, the quality of students, and quality of faculty. All of these top tier universities have the authority to grant doctorates and masters degrees.

Some comprehensive universities or colleges under the administrative authority of other Central Government Ministries may be top tier depending upon their long history, community reputation, quality of students and quality of faculty. Those that are top tier may grant doctorate and masters degrees. The other ministry institutions that are 2nd tier may also grant doctorate or masters degrees.

Professional training colleges grant 3 year diplomas. A top tier provincial college has the authority to grant a doctorate degree. All others are 2nd tier. These colleges are primarily funded at the provincial level but they also receive some financial support from the provincial government and sometimes from the Central Government.

Institutes are highly specialized colleges or universities granting bachelor and masters degrees and doctorate in agriculture, medicine, science, law, technical subjects, music, language, and physical training. These institutes are administered at the national (Top Tier), provincial (2nd tier), and municipal (2nd tier and 3rd tier) levels with corresponding financial support. However, provincial institutes may be top tier based upon long history, community reputation, quality of students, and quality of faculty.

TV University is a unique higher educational system financed by the Central Government and can issue certificates, diplomas and bachelors. They have schools administered at provincial (2nd tier), municipal (3rd tier) and branch (4th tier) levels.

Academies are military schools with Central Government financing from the army and may be 1st tier, 2nd tier and 3rd tier based upon the type of training offered and the types of degrees granted.

[Minhang Oz]

Does anyone know if anything similar to this piece has been attempted before? Of course there is subjectivity and some oversimplification,but given the size of the task,and the fact that the only resources available were forums like this one and the various recruiting sites,I think its a fair effort,and should be recommended widely to prospective TEFL newcomers to China . [Let's get it right-if our students were in an English speaking country they'd be ESL. Here they learn-we hope-English as a foreign language.The whole thing is confused by many of them speaking one or two dialects other than Putonghua which are mutually unintelligible!] FAO's are an interesting case study.There seem to be two main types.The competent English speaker,capable,knowledgeable and on the way up:so won't be an FAO for long.Then there's the loyal Party man and school servant getting his reward. If he's got any sense he employs an English major graduate to do the actual work,because he speaks the language like Donald Duck,if he's lucky. [excuse the gender generalisation please] However there are banquets,trips,an entertainment allowance to be taken care of....and he will. The lack of data about us,the teachers,is interesting.What's our profile? What about age,gender,qualifications,experience? We can all provide anecdotal information,but that's all it is. The authors' documentation of average salaries confirms what we know,in that it's related directly to the wealth of the city/province we teach in. Also. the "complaints" section would not suprise followers of the Job Information Journal. It doesn't really reflect this forum-perhaps a more mature group with greater cross cultural experience who have sorted out their employer related concerns? So that's my two cents worth.