Job Discussion Forums

[ppimente2]

Hello,

I've recently been offered a teaching position in China. The contract contains a clause that reads as follows:

"Teacher�s Residence Permit must be kept under the custody of the School. It will be released upon the conclusion or termination of the contract or with the School�s full consent."

Does this mean that they want to hold on to my passport?

If the residence permit is not contained in my passport, would this restrict my movement in and out of China?

Is it common practice in China for the school to hold on to residence permits?

Should I ask them to remove the clause or decline the offer?

Thanks for your advice.

[nolefan]

They are not allowed to do so by law. Your resident permit should be kept with your passport at all times per PSB regulations. All youhave to do is tell that to them and they should back off.

It seems like they want to hold it just in case you feel like pulling a runner to make it harder for you. With that in mind, one could think that they have had their share of teachers pull runners on them; That in turn begs for the simple question: Why?

Most of the time, you can travel around china and sign up at the hotels without your residence permit but you're not supposed to. The only time I was asked to produce mine was during national day when some friends took me to a mountain in the middle of nowhere outside of Luoyang. I was the first foreigner ever to show up in that neck of the woods and the cops did not know what to make of me.

[nolefan]

sorry, didn't answer the second part of your post.

I'd suggest you:

a- get them to remove that clause because it will restrict your movement out of China.
b- insist on getting in touch with FORMER teachers.

if they give you the run-around, move on.

[The Great Wall of Whiner]

nolefan is 1000000000% correct.

ppimente2 wrote:

[ShapeSphere]

I would echo nolefan's & GWOW's comments. The school is imposing illegal and excessively harsh rules on you. This does not bode well for the future. They know the real rules - so why do they feel it is proper to take this course of action?

You are not in China yet (I assume as you have to ask this question), so my gut feeling is to decline the offer. There are many other jobs all over China.

What's the name of the school? You don't have to say if you don't want to.

Hope all goes well.

[Spiderman Too]

ppimente2

As a service to your fellow newbies, I think you should post a message on the 'Job Information Journals' of Dave's ESL Cafe, the 'School Review' section of ESL Teachers Board and Nate's School Reviews website.

For such a message I think that there is no need to make any comment, as such, simply state the name of the school and the fact that they have a clause in their contract specifying that the school intends to hang on to the F.R.P. (better still, just quote the contract clause, verbatim).

For example;

Please be aware that XXX School sent me an employment contract containing the following clause, "Teacher�s Residence Permit must be kept under the custody of the School. It will be released upon the conclusion or termination of the contract or with the School�s full consent."

The purpose of posting a message would be that for anyone thinking of applying for a job at the school, at least those who are wise enough to do a 'search' before applying, they will learn beforehand of this rather unusual contract condition.

[smalldog]

In Beijing at least, residence permits are now stickers placed in the holder's passport rather than separate booklets. It would be very awkward if the employer held on to your passport.

Just ask them politely to change the contract, pointing out that you'd need it for travelling, opening bank accounts, etc. The contract was likely written by someone ignorant of its implications--I don't think you should turn down the school because of it, but do treat it as a warning sign.

[lagerlout2006]

My advice is don't even bother negotiating over it. Simply delete what you have from them and move on...Perhaps block the e-mail address.

As others say--they KNOW what they are doing and it's nasty dishonest and illegal. You could never trust them IMO.

[garbotara]

One school I know of in Beijing will not give a Candian teacher his residence permit. Even after he told them it was illegal. The school sucks so they are afraid he will leave if he has it. They are right he wants to go, but they do not have to know that.There are a lot of dodgy schools in Beijing. It seems many schools now bribe the police or go through agents to get visas.

[Roger]

I think the advice given so far is unnecessarily alarmist and misleading!

It may be correct in the cases of people whose residence permit is a sticker in their passport, but in the cases of those who probably still are the majority that get a separate residence booklet you don't need to worry!
This document is not really important for YOU; it is useful if you travel and don't want to take along your passport as it acts in lieu of a passport. But you won't really need it!
I suppose your employer believews you get a regular residence booklet rather than a sticker. You can negotiate with them, but I don't think you need to worry excessively about it!
On the other hand, you must NOT surrender your passport to your employer!

[Sinobear]

Roger, I am shocked! The PSB will tell you themselves that your Residence Permit is your property and you are supposed to carry it on your person at all times (even in the bathroom).
It is the Foreign Expert's Certificate that is of no consequence to you to have and to hold, til death do you part.

No more liquid lunches.

[tarzaninchina]

Once they have your residence permit and experts certificate, all 3 (including your passport) are to remain in your possession at all times. You can't travel or book into a hotel without the residence permit. Free legal aid from the foreign affairs office of the city/province cannot be obtained without the red book.

Upon leaving the institution, you give them the red book. Upon leaving China, you will most likely need to surrender the green book (although that depends on circumstances, so check other threads).

It is illegal for them to retain any of these 3 documents outside of processing which will NEVER take more than 3 weeks. The ONLY reason schools will try to do this, either by simply saying they don't have it yet or flat out retention, is to restrict your mobility. Not good. Really.

[ShapeSphere]

Sinobear & Tarzan are right.

Roger - are you out of your mind!? You need the Residence Permit and it is your property. What kind of school deems it proper to keep a small green booklet a teacher needs and is legally entitled to keep?

Be wary in China. Be very wary. That is the message in simple terms.

[latefordinner]

The school may not have evil intentions, but that's not the question. The question is, do you trust them?
I have it on good authority (ie, I've read it here on Dave's, like everyone else) that not every school in China is crooked. I've also read somewhere that the race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong. How do you think the smart money bets?

[Old Dog]

I, for one, would certainly not venture out from my home base with a passport containing an expired single-entry Z visa and without my Resident's Permit. Could be some problems there at hotels and airports, domestic and international!

Very strange advice from Roger. Treat it with a grain of salt.