Job Discussion Forums

[thehairyhorse]

Although I am a 'tefler' I beleive that really it is a sham
It�s ok to travel and pick up a bit of local currency but tefl is mainly just about head nodding and pretending to be interested.
All these discussions about whether a degree etc . .. is needed just miss the point really - ok a degree, Ma, or whatever may make you feel important but if you�re earning bugger all who is having the laugh on who?
Who agrees with me that to spend 4 yrs at Uni and then just doing Tefl is an acheivement?

[marblez]

I'm having a hard time understanding what you're saying. Are you saying that a degree is a waste of time if you all earn the same amount in the end?

I am biased in this topic, as someone who is nearing the completion of a degree. But one of the main reasons for obtaining a degree (for me) is to "open doors" incase I choose other careers later.

For example, my father, was earning over $70,000 a year as a store manager. It was an excellent job with excellent benefits. No degree was required because he was there for over 30 years, and back in the 1970's only a grade 10 education was sufficient (he had grade 12). He was laid off in 2002 and now makes $9/hour at home depot. No companies will hire a man for a management position without a degree. It's a crappy job with a so-so company.

So that's my personal experience as to why I am getting a degree. But I also highly value education (that is why I am interested in teaching). Who am I to educate students in a particular subject if I cannot even be bothered to educate myself?

I don't really have a problem with overseas teachers who DON'T have degrees. As long as they are doing it for the right reasons, and not caring about the money. But really, if all they cared about was money, WHY would they be in it at all? This occupation is no goldmine.

[ls650]

[GeorgeD]

i understood what you were saying Mr. Horse, i didn't really get what you were saying though marblez. Congratulations on your studies marblez, and the story about your dad. can't see what they have to do with tefl though.
i've been in this arena of nonsense for nearly ten years. private language schools - up their own a r s e s mostly, they're not interested in whether you've done a degree or not, they want you to keep the customer satisfied, end of story in most cases. white faces in the right places. you can be a bosnian serb fresh out of a war crimes tribunal as far as they're concerned.
even the british council don't ak for degrees, just celta and two years experience.

the degree comes in handy in getting you a working visa in countries that demand dgrees to get working visas. it also gets you jobs in places that demand degrees.

you'll hear lots of self-righteous people on these post trying to tell you how much of a professional service they think they're doing and tut-tut to anyone who doesn't take the work seriously. well, good for them for bringing a bit of dignity to a sea of rediculousness.
telfling's got worse and worse in terms of pay and conditions in most cases. you aren't going to find many efl jobs that offer pensions, paid holidays, sick pay etc. there are some out there, but they usually demand some form of compromise. most people get into tefl to get away, push -pull factors. quite often it's personal reasons, personal agendas, personal baggage and these things don't lend themselves well to making compromises.
if making loads of money, buying a nice house in your own country, nice car blah, blah, blah aren't your cups of tea then tefl offers you the chance to do things that many others only dream about. it's a way of seeing the world without being hit over the head with a beer bottle and shanghaid onto a cut-throat whaling boat in the morning.
but there are plenty of other, higher paying jobs that allow you to see the world. i was once in a pub somewhere when i met a bunch of english workmen being put up in a 4 * hotel and on four times my salary for fitting the horizontal ecsalators in airports. stress free job, no complaining students, no bs, just arrive, enjoy the hotel facilities, lay the esculator and off they go. and all that without degrees.

i think on the whole you should do it for yourself. shack up with a romanian acrobat while earning ten times her country's average wage for three hours work a day. i can't be bothered anymore to try and contort myself into a classroom magician, but it's not hard to do a few hours decent work a day. and for that compromise i get time, energy and resourses to scheme up and execute all kinds of lunacies.

when people talk to you about acheivments, we shouldtry and take a few moments to stop and think about just who's values are these acheivments are pegged to. if they're not yours then you may as well just "throw the homework on the fire and take the car downtown".

[Spinoza]

[Mouse]

I think a lot of people are over-estimating the sort of quality of life the many of their compatriots are living 'back home'. Many lawyers in the UK, for example, don't earn that great a living (partners and those in top firms aside), and that's for a load more stress and mental angst than I have to face in my current job. As for not getting perks, pensions, etc, that depends on the position... and to be honest, the kind of job security that brings peace until retirement is getting rarer on the ground in whatever country you happen to hang your hat (which is what Marblez was saying, GeorgeD, in a post which seemed perfectly coherent to me).

[Glenski]

[SueH]

Glenski,

I think there was in that post a degree of irony that has once again been lost in the internet ether.

I may be wrong of course ..

[Spinoza]

Thanks for sticking up for me, Sue.

I was indeed attempting to be funny.

I apologise for any offence caused to anyone - it's just my awful sense of humour there I'm afraid.

[Gordon]

I think IS650 said it well, "you get out of it, what you put into it." There is something about having pride in your work. If your employer doesn't care, it means that you should work somewhere else or get more education and/or experience and then move on to another school. Everyone starts off in a crappy school because we didn't have any expereince to warrant a better employer. Over time (hopefully), you get better and better jobs.

Many of us are not teaching to drink our faces off and get laid by the foreign nationals. If you don't want to take your job seriously, that is your business, but for many of us this is a career. I plan to be teaching ESL/EFL for another 20 years and have done it for 9 already.

[Teacher in Rome]

GeorgeD wrote:

[shmooj]

[denise]

It's a farce only if you treat it as one. It is a career for me. I take my job seriously (and I have the little bits of paper to prove it), yet I still manage to have a bit of fun every now and then when I am not busy in the classroom.

If you think this field is a joke, then fine, do your two-year stint at a conversation school, travel around, sleep with the locals, get it all out of your system, and then go back home and get a "respectable" job and just reminisce about your wild, youthful days. Meanwhile, those of us for whom this is a career will keep teaching and loving what we do (while still enjoying the benefits that the short-termers always cite).

d

[Sadken]

I've been working in a law firm for 6 years now and recently passed my degree after four and a half years of part time-study. I'm one of the lucky ones in that if I wanted to continue studying to qualify as a solicitor, my firm would pay for it and I would then be able to do a further two years of study, however, I know of plenty of people who have got their degree, embarked on a one year �10,000 course only to find that the job situation is limited at best once they have qualified. There are so many qualified solicitors I know working in admin jobs in the court or else jobs completely unrelated to their qualifications that it is not true. Even if you do manage to land a job after qualifying, the average pay for a first year post qualified solicitor is �14,000. At that stage you'd be looking at being about �25,000 in debt.

TEFL seems to be a decent way for me to see the world, some culture and grow up a bit before committing myself 100% to a career path. For the past couple of years I haven't really enjoyed law but it is very safe and probably would pay off in the end, however, teaching is a career choice that, although she is knackered and full of complaints, my mum has never once regretted and one that has given her hundreds of memories. What kind of memories will law provide me? After six years I think I have about 2 or 3, every other day was more or less the same. I think it depends very much what you are looking to get out of your career and your life as to whether or not you see TEFL as a waste of time.

[Sadken]

I am also led to believe that some of these girls are WELL fit and will do ANYTHING.