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SamVilde
Joined: 23 Jan 2005
Posts: 2
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 Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 8:32 pm Post subject: Questions about a job offer |
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Hi there,
I've been looking for jobs in Japan and was just offered one at a language school, contingent upon my acceptence of their terms. I wanted some feedback on whether the things they are asking are standard--some seem a little weird to me.
* I am to pay all costs associated with the work visa. (!!)
* After 2 sick days, I am required to pay any substitute who would cover my classes.
* Along with training being paid at less than the full rate (I understand/accept this), my first month is paid at less than full salary.
* The fee for breaking contract without giving 90 days notice is 40,000 yen. I have a proven track record of fulfilling obligations, but this seems steep if I find myself with a company which is unsupportive.
The job itself sounds good. But he salary is slightly less than standard starting salary, and the rent is slightly higher than what I've been seeing advertised. When I combine this with the amount I will be sinking into airfare and set-up costs, it seems high risk. ESPECIALLY to work for a company which does not extend the good will of providing the work visa.
So my question: Are these stipulations normal, and will be similar to other companies -- something I should get used to if I want to work in Japan -- or could the job be a financial danger?
Thank you.
Sam |
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Nismo
Joined: 27 Jul 2004
Posts: 520
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 8:55 pm Post subject: Re: Questions about a job offer |
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| SamVilde wrote: |
| * I am to pay all costs associated with the work visa. (!!) |
I don't think they can do that legally. I am not sure, though.
| SamVilde wrote: |
| * After 2 sick days, I am required to pay any substitute who would cover my classes. |
Unless they are still paying you while you are paying the substitute (basically, they are giving your wages to the substitute), they can't do that as that would make you an employer.
| SamVilde wrote: |
| * Along with training being paid at less than the full rate (I understand/accept this), my first month is paid at less than full salary. |
That is acceptable, and common. Some places even pay probationary wages up to 3 months. You can find many employers who do not pay probationary, though.
| SamVilde wrote: |
| * The fee for breaking contract without giving 90 days notice is 40,000 yen. I have a proven track record of fulfilling obligations, but this seems steep if I find myself with a company which is unsupportive. |
That is illegal. You are not obligated to pay them any money, because you can't sign away your freedom in a contract. That would basically be like buying your way out of employment.  |
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Zzonkmiles
Joined: 05 Apr 2003
Posts: 309
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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Any company that makes you cover the costs associated with procuring your visa is a company you should not even think twice about working for. Ditto with the 2 sick days deal.
As bad as many people say the Big 4 are, at least they don't pull crap like this. At NOVA, for example, you simply don't get paid for the lessons you don't teach (assuming that you call in before the deadlines). You don't have to pay for another teacher to cover your lessons.
Don't sign that contract. Find another place to work. If you're comfortable, posting the name of the school might be useful so that it could prevent another person from working for that sketchy outfit. You also might want to consider joining the teacher's union for your own protection. |
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Mike L.
Joined: 28 Feb 2003
Posts: 519
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| Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2005 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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Agree with previous 2 posters!
Be sure to post the name of the school and the Japanese trash that run it here once you find another job.
I'd also turn a copy of anything, if you have it, over to labor standards and the tax office too! |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2005 12:28 am Post subject: Re: Questions about a job offer |
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| SamVilde wrote: |
* I am to pay all costs associated with the work visa. (!!)
* After 2 sick days, I am required to pay any substitute who would cover my classes.
* Along with training being paid at less than the full rate (I understand/accept this), my first month is paid at less than full salary.
* The fee for breaking contract without giving 90 days notice is 40,000 yen. I have a proven track record of fulfilling obligations, but this seems steep if I find myself with a company which is unsupportive.
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Obtaining visas dont cost employers anything, all they do is send the paperwork to immigration. Sounds like he is making money out of his employees
| SamVilde wrote: |
** After 2 sick days, I am required to pay any substitute who would cover my classes.
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By law employers do not have to provide sick days but may take it out of your paid hollidays. Making you pay for a replacement is probably illegal as they are penalising you for being sick. Tell the employer where to go
| SamVilde wrote: |
* The fee for breaking contract without giving 90 days notice is 40,000 yen. I have a proven track record of fulfilling obligations, but this seems steep if I find myself with a company which is unsupportive.
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Actually stating a figure for a fine or a penalty in a contract is illegal, and they can not do that according to the Labor standards Law.
the maximum they can fine a teacher is 50% of one days pay or 10% of your gross monthly income in one calendar month. So unless you are earning 400,000 yen a month a 40,000 yen fine is illegal. As long as you give two weeks notice they can not fine or penalise you as quitting a job is perfectly legal in Japan.
Question: My employer cut my wages. When I was paid only half of the wages outlined on the contract, I asked for an explanation. He remarked only that my work was unsatisfactory. He said I made a lot of mistakes and was often late. Is it legal for an employer to cut wages for such reasons ?
Answer: Basically it is illegal for an employer not to pay an employee the wages specified on the contract. Also, an employer is not allowed, according to the Labor Standards Law, to make a contract forcing an employee in advance to account for a loss incurred on the job. Accordingly, if an employer has a claim for damages (limited to damages caused intentionally and/or by malpractice), he/she must consider it separately from wages. For absence or lateness, wages may be reduced according to the rule of employment. Another case in which a reduction of wages is sanctioned is after several occurrences of an employee being late. This would be stipulated in the contract. In this case as stated in Q5, the amount of wage reduction should not be more than half the daily wage for a single violation, or more than one tenth of the monthly wages for all violations.
From the GU website
I want to quit my job before the end of my contract and now my employer won't pay me this month's wages. He also wants me to pay a fine of one month's salary. Is this allowed?
No. Your employer cannot set a predetermined fine for quitting during your contract (Article 16). Furthermore your employer must provide you with all outstanding wages, tax forms and a certificate of employment within seven days of you leaving your job (Article 23).
If this happens, it is very easy to retrieve both the fine and the back wages using union's expertise and the Labour Standards Office.
If you do quit your job without the proper notice you are liable for damages, but the company must actually prove business damage in a civil court for you to have to pay any damages regarding your quitting. We have never actually seen a language company sue an employee for quitting a contract without proper notice.
I would give this place a VERY wide berth.
Last edited by PAULH on Tue Jan 25, 2005 8:56 am; edited 2 times in total |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2005 12:53 am Post subject: Re: Questions about a job offer |
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| SamVilde wrote: |
ESPECIALLY to work for a company which does not extend the good will of providing the work visa.
Thank you.
Sam |
I dont understand this- do you mean to say they will not sponsor your work visa for a full time position or that they are simply making you pay for processing it?
Getting a work visa from an employer costs nothing, and I would not fly across the world for someone that will not sponsor a work visa anyway. Is he asking you to come on a working holiday or tourist visa?
I would stay away from anything or anyone that asks you to work on a tourist visa, as not only is it illegal to work on one, you lack any protection whatsoever if you get fired or he stiffs you on wages. |
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JimDunlop2
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Posts: 2286
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2005 7:04 am Post subject: |
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I have one word for you: RUN!
That is all.
P.S. I've always been required to cover my own visa application costs -- even with the Board of Ed. It's about 5000 yen for processing. It's not a big deal... But the other things you mentioned are bad, bad signs. |
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Ajia
Joined: 22 Jun 2004
Posts: 31
Location: Mie-ken
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| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2005 8:45 am Post subject: |
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| Don't do it. |
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PAULH
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 4672
Location: Western Japan
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| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2005 8:53 am Post subject: |
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Just one final note
If an illegal clause is in your contract it is still illegal and invalid and cannot be enforced on an employee. Your employer can not enforce an illegal provision that is not backed up by the Labor Standards Law in Japan and various statutes.
The contract is still legal, the individual clauses are not, and you can report him to the Labor Standards office or a union. Just becuase its written in a contract doesnt make it written in stone, as Japanese labor law takes precedence.
If you are really desperate for work you can take the contract back to him, show him where what he is doing is illegal, show him the clauses in the labor standards law and that you will not take the job until they are rectified. Either that or threaten to report him once you get a job with them.
He is hoping you wont know Japanese customs or the laws in Japan and don't know any better. You can show him that you have the law on your side and that you are not intimidated by his threats and fines. |
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SamVilde
Joined: 23 Jan 2005
Posts: 2
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| Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2005 1:49 pm Post subject: |
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| ... well if everyone's on the same page here ... Glad I asked about these things; it feels better than turning down the job just because I got a bad feeling from them. You've all been really helpful. Thanks a lot. |
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AndyH
Joined: 30 Sep 2004
Posts: 417
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| Posted: Thu Jan 27, 2005 2:58 am Post subject: |
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| Just out of curiosity, do you mind telling us the name of the school? |
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