Job Discussion Forums

[fluff]

I know that it gets asked a lot if you can work legally in China without a degree, but I definately seem to be coming across many more job avertisements requesting that you have one. I even saw one advertisement, for a job in Guangzhou, stating that the immigration laws had changed and that it is now an absolute requirement. I don't have a degree and am planning on coming to China soon to look for work. Will I be wasting my time? Please someone tell me that it is not so.

[journeyeast]

Visa laws have changed, its in your best interest to obtain the Z visa before you go to China whenever possible.

Just ask for references of existing teachers from the schools that offer you a job, make it clear that you do not have a degree, and illustrate the strengths of what you do have that they will find interesting. You could also go about using a recruiting agent that is LOCAL to your area and country, that has a liability and gaurantee to provide you with a safe and legal employement in China.. Ask them for business license information and google their name around before taking the next step.

Most people here would argue you should not have to pay a fee to recruiters.. But in your situation your options are limited. There's a small element of risk which ever you decide. Just ask the school to fax you a copy of the provincial permission to host foreign teachers, have it verified by someone who can read Chinese, , ask the school to send you an invitation letter that you can take to the Consulate for a Z visa.. BEFORE you depart.

Basically, if they cannot provide the documentation for you to obtain your Z visa before you go.. You should be wary that they would be able to do this after you arrive.. So get it before you leave.. Otherwise use an agent that is in your country that can be liable to you according to your countries laws if they fail in their services.

One last note, I wouldnt try to forge a degree; FAOs and education ministry is getting wise to the fakes.. Another reason why visa laws are changing. Another thing that works quite well, is if you have any college experience whatsoever, provide the school with your unofficial Univ or High School transcripts on Univ. Letterhead, with at least two personal and business reference letters. (Again on company or University letterhead)

Prepare before hand and you should be fine. Good luck!

Keith

[amandabarrick]

My humble opinion is that you get your degree before coming to China to look for work.
Having said that, there is nothing illegal about coming to China on a tourist visa and "looking at schools", then changing the tourist visa to the Z visa BEFORE you start work. There is dispute as to whether a school has the ability and can legally convert your Tourist visa to a Z visa while you are in China, but as Keith said if a school can't get you a Z visa before coming they can't get you one while you are here. It is up to the teacher if they want to make the trip at their expense just to check out schools before starting to work. The authorities in my province told me it absolutely legal and fair for a tourist visa to be changed to a Z visa while in the province, If the school has the proper status to employ foreigners, etc... AND if the foreigner has a degree. Aparently in my province a degree is required to get a Z visa. Some provinces may be different and won't convert a Tourist visa to Z visa. This will require the teacher to leave the country, secure the Z visa outside China, and re-enter with the new Visa.
But back to your question, I have never found a school that will legally employ a FT who does not have a degree. Legally meaning the Z visa. It is possible to do what you are asking and come to China and look for work without a degree, but it will be extremely difficult to find a job that will provide you with legal status to work, ie. the Z visa. Like I said it is possible, but not legal. Is it a waste of time? I guess that depends on how important it is to you that you work in China legally. You could (illegally) come here without a degree, find a job and work on a Business Visa or a Tourist Visa. The schools may even help you secure a business Visa, but the schools that hire teachers who work on anything other than a Z visa are not the best. And you are playing roullete and the risks are many. If you want to take the chance and come to China without a degree and find work I am sure you can find a job, but keep in mind 1) If it is not illegal at least it is very difficult to secure the Z visa without the degree, 2) working without the Z, although done often, is not legal, however it is not strictly enforced from what I hear.
AB

[Leondys]

But bare in mind that only some provinces can change an L-visa to a Z-visa without you leaving the country to cancel the visa.

For example, Hubei province does not change L-visas to any other type of Visa, but Guangdong does let you change L-visas to other types of Visa.

[fluff]

So does anybody know which other provinces, besides Guangdong, would be able to change my visa for a "Z" visa, if I can get one? I was thinking of getting a business visa in Hong Kong and looking for work in country as I am currently in Cambodia and already have a flight to H.K. Would it be a good option to apply through a company such as English First or AES initially? What about these so called "language mills", what kind of qualifications do they require? I am a level 2 TESOL cert. holder. Would I be better off looking in Vietnam? Oh, what to do

[amandabarrick]

Jiangsu Province will convert to a Z visa. Without a degree i don't know if they will or not.
The school also has to have the proper status.
AB