Job Discussion Forums

[Sekhmet]

Ok, so I've just been asked to teach 2 of my students privately. Which would be perfectly fine if their levels weren't so different! The older one is practically fluent (with a very heavy accent), whereas the younger can repeat what you say, but not much more.

The other problem I have is that their mother clearly seems to think I'm some kind of miracle worker - she wants me to make her children develop a western accent. Fairly typical, but high on impossible!

Does anyone have any suggestions of activities I can use? She wants me to concentrate on reading fluency and conversation. I only have 1 hour a week with them, so I need to make it count!

[fluffyhamster]

With only an hour a week I don't know how much you can attain, but one thing that may be impossible even given all the time in the world is changing the elder's accent. The younger might develop "better" (more native-like) pronunciation for what (little!) he or she can be taught in the hour, but it is unlikely the grammar will be picked up to the extent that the accent will become a feature of and helping fluent (as well as "accurate" sound-wise) speech.

In any case, even if the younger child could pick up the lexicogrammar quickly enough, no doubt the accent would start to slip, simply because in speaking in ever more-complex terms (as opposed to simply parroting simple words and phrases) there is obviously going to be less certainty, more individual creativity and venturing into the unknown involved, into which the L1 norms may creep and start to interfere (given the lack of a bilingual immersion environment).

You don't need to tell the mother all this (or you might find yourself out of a job), but you will probably need to tell her (once she's noticed that her kids aren't improving as much as she'd like) that "these things take time" (and lots of lovely money hahahahaha!). Then again, if the mother speaks hardly a word of English herself (and hardly ever to her kids in English), she may well believe whatever assurances you give to her that everything is going swimmingly.

"Reading fluency" would seem a good way to go about things and would form a good basis for short "conversations" (that is, questions and answers and perhaps limited "extensional" conversation based on what they've just read). If you don't connect the reading with speaking and have totally unconnected "Spoken English" classes, the speaking at least might not develop as well as you'd anticipated.

In connection to those "conversations", having such different learners in the same (right?) private class could create problems if the older and more able student objects to reading too easy books and sitting around whilst you concentrate on the younger, less able kid, using more basic English, and the younger kid will have little to do if the conversation gets interesting with the older. Of course, if they are both well-behaved and support each other then you can direct the elder to help the younger ("team-teach" with you), or the younger to listen carefully to you speaking to the older etc, so there are "opportunities" to be had from what might appear to be less-than-ideal circumstances...but it might well be easier for everyone concerned if two separate classes were formed. I guess you'll need to see...

I'm presuming a combined 2-student class will go OK (and is what the mother has requested, expects and can only afford), because you haven't mentioned any problems with these two students when they were in your larger (public) class(room), and the fact that you were approached to do private lessons with them suggests you and they were having or perceived to be having a fair amount of fun and success to begin with.

I'm sorry I don't have specifics beyond an "approach" level...

[lozwich]

Are you teaching them privately together? That sounds difficult!

One onestopenglish.com there's an exercise called the Deck of Conversations, where you use playing cards to ask questions. Might be good for one of the initial 'getting to know you' classes.

Also, with my more advanced 1-1 student, we sometimes do conversations sitting back to back so that he can't use lip reading to help his understanding. We've done exercises like "ringing up" a language school to make enquiries about summer courses and pretending to be at a convention and asking about his business' needs. Obviously, the subject matter won't suit your students if they're young, but I've found these to be good speaking activities.

Good luck!
Lozwich.

[dyak]

[Sekhmet]

Thanks for the advice guys. I'm working on the mother, trying to persuade her that having both kids together isn't going to work. However, like most rich people, spending money isn't a strong point for her. She's nice enough, and her English is very good, but I can't imagine that she'll be too interested in splitting the kids up and paying me double each week!!

Fluffy - a lot of nice ideas there. However, as you say, since she speaks good English (although with a heavy accent herself), she's going to realise early on that not much progress in the way of developing accents is going to happen. But to be honest, I don't really need any more private work at the moment - I only took it on because I like the kids so much. I'm just glad they work well together!

Lozwich - thanks, but as you say, probably not that good for an 8 and a 12 year old!! I'll definitely look at onestopenglish.com though. I've heard some very good things about it.

I'm going to keep working on the seperate classes idea - I might even try suggesting half an hour per student (even though I know full well it would be practically useless!). Hopefully something will work out!! Any further ideas on activities to help with these things?

[dyak]

[Sekhmet]

Good good!! I like the analogy...

I'm looking into finding some easy books - there is a series here called "reading for comprehension", and I think I'll work from that. The biggest problem I have is that the older boy loves to talk, whereas the younger I think is still a little shy of me (he shouldn't be - I've been teaching him for 9 months now!). So I'll definitely be pressing for split classes. I don't think the younger boy will get anything out of it if I try to teach them together. I'll work it out with the mother next time I see her.

Thanks for the advice guys - one more question though! Does anyone have a list of easy conversation topics that might interest children? I've looked at onestopenglish, and they all seem to be a bit more advanced - the younger child is only 7/8!!!

Cheers

[Girl Scout]

Converstion topics for young children are difficult. For the most part their world is rather limilted. If you notice everything is about them. You have to play to that idea. My 4-6 year olds will talk about...

family and what the family does.

food.

television. This one might be good if you can get the child to describe the
show without using sound effects.

cars and construction equipment. You would have to teach some vocab. but this one has worked in every class.

draw a picture and describe it.

retell their favorite story.

their room or any possesion it.

if you are in their house, what happens in each room of the house.

how do you. This can be anything the kids know how to do? Make a sandwich, get dressed, anything.

Hope these can help.

About teaching two kids at different levels. You can have the better student help explain to the other student. Sometimes kids learn faster from other kids. Letting the higher level students present examples and help teach will get one student talking more and maybe be less intimidating for the other.

[Glenski]

Sekhmet,

Take dyak's advice and teach them separately. You are only asking for trouble. Besides, if the mother IS rich, as you say, she can afford it.

My Japanese wife was a student in this situation. Her partner was her best girlfriend, much lower in level. Some jerk (my professional opinion) knew their different levels, yet boasted he could teach them simultaneously. They quit after 2 lessons because he obviously couldn't.

I beg you to reconsider. Explain that it's NOT for the money. It's for the education of each student. Educators around the world will tell you the same.

[fluffyhamster]

I know it's the teacher's "job" to say what would be "best" for the students, but when that advice means more money is involved the teacher is then in the rather difficult and unsavoury position of appearing to be a money-grubbing hellfiend. Although the analogy with two bunged-up non-flushing toilets may not be entirely appropriate when it comes to some students, the fact is that two people can be physically put into the same room together, and the person paying may well resent being told "it's not for the money" when asked to consider separating the two; then, there are the feelings of the students themselves to consider.

Would your girlfriend and her "best girlfriend" (the lesbians! You lucky s*d!) have preferred it if this "jerk" had immediately pried them from each other's embrace and locked them in separate cells, Glenski? Maybe he was trying to do them a favour (and save them some money) and it all just went a bit pear-shaped (the "boasting" could've simply been something along the lines of: 'Do you two girls want to be in the same class? Yes? OK, that shouldn't be (too much of) a problem (at all)...', and it's not like teachers never have to put up with this sort of thing in their regular classes. I mean, was this guy was acting like Gilderoy Lockheart or something?).

So, as I say, a teacher who doesn't want the money and is just trying to be helpful or agreeable is a bit stuck - he or she is going to get it in the neck either way (whether the two classes are formed, or the one class is unsuccessful). Of course, the best thing would be if the person paying had a better grasp of the situation beyond the financial aspect and volunteered the idea of two classes from the very start, but as we all know, that rarely if never happens. Perhaps the easiest thing would be to just make up an excuse about being busy and turn down the job(s) if it seems like it might be or become too much of a challenge!

[dyak]

[fluffyhamster]

True, Dyak, very true, but unfortunately there isn't a bad language school (bad in the sense of not having much business sense, let alone educational sense!) here doing the "placement", but the (direct) customer herself, and to her, value for money seems to be the primary concern. Anyway, even good language schools may sometimes "need" to put more able and less able students into the same class if there simply aren't enough other students around to make a large enough, economically-viable group class, which is a different thing entirely from very small private class (paired siblings or friends, at somebody's specific request).

I worked for a school that was neither good nor bad, just ailing with the economic downturn in Japan, and they put two 6-year old girls and one 12-year old boy in the same class (one of the girls was the sister of the boy; the other girl was the sister's friend). Every teacher though it was an impossible class to teach (the boy was very boisterous, and if it weren't for him the girls might have been able to learn something), but obviously the school wasn't going to tell the parents (who found the arrangement convenient too) to come back next term (and the next...) or until such a time as there were enough children to make perfectly composed classes.

I let it slip to the parents that I didn't think much could be expected, and that they didn't seem to have learnt much after almost a year (with their previous teachers! I'd only had them a month or so!), the parents reported what I'd said to my boss, and the boss then grilled me about what I'd do "seeing as I seemed to think I was the expert"...of course, I said "split them into two classes for a start", but that just was "not possible". Of course, I didn't stay at that school for long, but I could see my boss's point that to be honest or turn students away might ultimately mean I'd be doing myself out of a job (if the school couldn't make enough money to pay me)...difficult eh...schools should do what is right (it might attract more students if they did all they could to ensure success!), but often they can't and options are limited until student numbers increase...

Anyway, after that long ramble down memory lane, Sekhmet is in this instance working for him or herself and it's his/her call. Overall the advice on offer seems to be, do it if the mother's way if you really like the kids and don't mind a challenge, but seeing as you don't need the money and could probably do without the hassle (i.e. personal frustration, if not possible accusations that you're a bad teacher if things aren't working, as you well suspected they might not etc), it might be best if you just walk away if the mother isn't prepared to budge on the issue of separating the kids into two private classes.

[dyak]

It's the classic tefl dilemma - most schools are not run by educators but by businessmen. Businessmen make compromises to make money. However, in a language school it's the teachers that bear the brunt of those compromises. Hell, we're not even as important as the receptionists!

I've been put in too many of those situations by schools that wouldn't split classes. My favourite was a 'grammar' class with an elementary, an intermediate and an upper-intermediate, all thinking they'd paid for a level specific extra grammar class...

I had a situation like Sekhmet's not too long ago. Due to the legacy of the previous private teacher, the (by no means) poor mother expected me to teach 3 kids of different ages and levels at the same time. This made it virtually impossible for her to consider the logic of what I was saying.

If I were Sekhmet I wouldn't even consider it unless they were separated. Why compromise, when for once, you have the choice not to?

[fluffyhamster]

[Stephen Jones]

Teach one of the kids for a few minutes, set her some work, teach the other one for a few minutes, set her some work and go back to the first one.