Job Discussion Forums

[NGP]

To make a long story short I started a job the beginning of this month and they didn't live up to their end of the bargain/contract. I resigned but in the meantime my Foreign Experts Certificate, Work Permit (Z visa) etc are in the works. They said they contacted the relevant departments and my permits will only be valid until the beginning of April (when I leave the school) as they will submit my contract along with the resignation letter.

When I get my Foreign Experts Certificate it will pretty much expire very soon after I leave the school. They said the work visa will also but I have never heard of a 2 month Z visa. They said that it depends on the officer that issues them. Furthmore they have mentioned they will honour me with the release letter.

Does all this sound ligitimate?

What do I do now to renew them and what are my timing restraints?

Also I have will have to pay for these when they come through so will I have to pay again when I get to another school?

Thanks

[tofuman]

NGP,

Sorry to hear about the disappointment, but I commend you for cutting your loses and resigning. Is there anything you can tell us about how you got into this job and why you left so soon.

These experiences can be useful to others trying to sail these treacherous seas.

[NGP]

Tofuman,

I found the job advertised on the internet. Basically I was lied to at the interview about a number of points. The hours, pay amongst other things. I dont want to post the schools name or anything else as they are being fair in this deal and giving me the release letter and even applying for the visa etc. when they know I will leave. Well they have to do this by law anyway.

Put it to you this way. In the end I was getting RMB 8000 per month. No bonus, no airfare, no nothing. Not even an apartment for 40 hours per week. What would you do?

[tofuman]

Too many unknowns for me to make a decision, but again, if you are uncomfortable, I congratulate for having the good sense to move on. None of came here to be exploited or abused.

[Voldermort]

First I should make one thing clear, a Z visa is not valid for 1 year. The Z visa is simply a permit for you to enter China and a permit which is required for you to apply for a Residence Permit. After entering China with a Z visa, it is only valid for a further 30 days, in this time you must apply for a residence permit which takes over from your Visa.

When a Z visa is issued within China, it is only issued as a formality. The dates on it are meaningless. Most of the time it will expire on the same day that your Resident Permit is issued.

When leaving a school (without the intention of finding a new one), your residence permit should either:

1. Be handed in at the border when leaving the country.
2. Be handed in to the PSB so that they can cancel it (in this case they issue a 7 day tourist visa with which you must leave the country.)

Though since the new permit is inside your passport, it must be pre approved by your school that you may seek alternate employment (completion letter). If this is not approved then the school is still legaly responsible for you until your permit expires.

The amount of time you have for changing jobs really depends on your relationship with the school and their relationship with the PSB. But in theory you should have 7 days to transfer your documents.

[NGP]

Thanks Voldermort that has cleared up a few things. So will I need a company to sponsor me to get the residents permit? If thats the case then I will have 30 days from when I get my work visa to find a new job right?

[Roger]

I am not sure what voldemort says is true; it depends, I think, on where you got your work visa: if inside the PR of C then obviously your work visa will be valid for the period mentioned on it, that is, one month or 6 months or one year. Yes, there are one-month work visas; at least years ago I saw a sign in a Shenzhen PSB listing all visas and their duration and costs, and a one-month work visa was listed among them. Why not?

If you got your work visa abroad, then, perhaps, voldemort is right in your case.

But it doesn't really matter. The PSB can cancel it at any given time. And they must invalidate it if you quit. You will need a new employer, and this means you have to go through the same loops again.

I don't believe they lied to you the way you claim; rather, they were not in the clear and misinformed you based on their own misunderstandings.
Liars don't usually cooperate so well with someone so clearly dissatisfied with them!

[NGP]

I did not get the visa from overseas hence me applying for it here now in China through this school. I am still on a L visa beleive it or not.
From what you say Roger its a waste of time and money for me to get it through this school.

[Voldermort]

Perhaps I didn't make something clear in my last post.

A visa is simply an entry and exit permit for a country. It is not a license to do anything within China, but there are laws regarding what you can and cannot do with certain visas. For example it is illegal to work or to seek work while holding a tourist L visa.

A Z visa is only valid for 30 days after you enter the country. If you obtain one while inside China it is only valid until the time your Residence permit has been issued and superseeds it. Which in most instances is the same day the Z visa claims to expire. In theory you are not permited to exit China after this 30 day period without either producing your Resident Permit or holding a Multi Entry Visa. But I have yet to hear about this being enforced.

The only reason this visa is issued within China is that it is required for you to obtain a Residence Permit and Work Permit. Other from this sole reason it serves no purpose (unless multi entry, but I won't go into that).

So, regardless of the dates on your Z visa, you must obtain a Residence Permit within 30 days of entering the country, or 30 days of being issued a Z visa from within China. In the later, you are issued both at the same time. (This is why a Z visa issued in China is valid for varying periods).

Now to contradict myself a little. It is nearly impossible to change a tourist (L) or business (F) into a work (Z) within China. Most schools will tell you that they can, that they have guanxi or even that little green pixies are printing them a new batch right now; but it's just not true.

[tom selleck]

Volder seems to be a well spring of knowledge. When I read V's posts, I actually understand. Usually, when I read posts about visas, contradictions abound. Something like "Yes you can; no you can't" usually follows.

V: I obtained my own F visa on an unfortunately necessary visa run to Hong Kong. It's dated March 5. Does this mean I have until April 5 to get my residence permit or until April 5 to start processing it?

Unfortunately, the police came knocking on my door and dragged me down to the station yesterday. I was there for 6 hours. My crime: Not registering my location of the residence with the police. An unrelated event, yes. But when all was said and done (700 kuai later, I might add)
As an aside, the police couldn't believe I still don't have a residence permit yet. I've asked twice. The school holds passports. Is a copy of a passport sufficient for processing a residence permit? I really don't want them to hold the passport longer than is necessary. They are already doing this to two other teachers.

[Roger]

VOldemort says a work visa is valid for 30 days only; this may or may not be true, I don't know but I believe it holds some water. Why I am a little confused is this reason: this seems to be a new regulation. Old standing practice has been - and my current visa bears this out! - that a work visa is valid throughout the period of your sojourn here. The newest regulation seems to force you to come here on a work visa, then obtain a residence permit and a work permit within the period of validity of your visa. A residence permit then takes care of your visa; thus, when you leave the country you will per force have to surrender your residence permit to the immigration official as you would otherwise be an overstayer, which would put you on a par with criminals.

As for business visas and residency - there is a widespread misunderstanding here: they are no different to tourist visas in terms of rights and duties. You have no right to work in China, and you have no right to live in premises other than designated places for foreign businesspeople, i.e. hotels, occasionally a flat in an estate.
You don't normally qualify for residence permits. If the PSB haul you to their station and charge you a fine for not having a residence permit, this means they are misinterpreting their own rules. However, it is better if they misinterpret the rule to mean that you have failed to obtain a residence permit in time rather than hauling you to their station to punish you for illegal working and staying in a tenement block. If you do get your residence permit, I guess you have now a relatively clean slate again.

[amandabarrick]

[millie]

[brsmith15]

Regarding the pasted-in residence permit.....Has anyone used it to leave and re-enter the country from an English-speaking country: Canada, US, UK, Australia, NZ? I've heard it functions as a multi-entry visa, but have yet to hear anyone using it for these countries.

[amandabarrick]

Millie,
ya, it was in February that I contacted my city PSB. I contacted the Jiangsu PSB last week just to make sure it was the law in the whole Province. I would encourage anyone to contact the PSB in their province as it may be different from place to place.
As far as the pasted in Residence Permit, I have not used it to re-enter, so I am not much help.
AB