Job Discussion Forums

[Cleopatra]

Reading a recent post about how so many departing Saudi expats attempt to sell (yes, sell!) grubby items like used chopping boards, shoes and (thankfully, unused) razor blades reminds me of why I think I've failed to find too many soulmates among the Saudi ex-pat 'community'. Have these people no shame? More to the point, have they no friends?

OK, I know we're all here in large part for the money, but that's no excuse to close your eyes to the culture around you. So many people I've met here seem to expect that everything should be just like it is back home, and when they find that of course it isn't, they blame it on the Saudis rather than on their own ignorance. OK, plenty of nasty stuff goes on here but it's not like their own countries are perfect. If they were, why did they leave them?

Another thing I've found is that "Westerners" seem to have a real sense of entitlement here. By that I mean that they think that having a "Western" passport entitles them to be treated like demigods. When this doesn't happen, they go around moaning about people being "anti-Western". Did it never occur to them that they might just be "anti-Saudi" or "anti-non Western" in general?

Having said all this, I must add that I've met plenty of open-minded, tolerant people here. But I have to say, they're in the minority. Maybe I've just been unlucy? Or is it the case that, more and more, KSA is attracting 'losers' who just couldn't cut it at home and feel that they are somehow superior here?

[johnslat]

Dear Cleopatra,
I'm back in the States now, at my sister's place in Boston. Now. regarding your question:
" Or is it the case that, more and more, KSA is attracting 'losers' who just couldn't cut it at home and feel that they are somehow superior here? "

Not me, of course - I feel superior EVERYWHERE ( and that's a purely objective evaluation ).
Hey, it's good to be back - but darn it, there are some things ( such as cheap cigarettes ) that I miss already.
Regards,
John

[khmerhit]

yeah sorry

[veiledsentiments]

First off I have to get over my shock that Mr Physical Fitness of KSA smokes cigarettes?? Gasp!! Time to break that last bad addiction John!!

As to Cleopatras accurate analysis of Saudi expats, I would generalize that description to the whole Gulf region. I too was always amazed at some of the things they try to 'sell.' I restricted selling to my car and furniture (in places that it was mine to sell, of course). But, I always gave away the little stuff to the various maids, gardeners, guards, and/or friends.

Anyway, the type of people you describe have been all around the Gulf for the whole time that I was there. Perhaps it just feels like more to you because it is one of those things that bothers you more and more the longer you watch it.

VS
(the news articles appeared as I was typing - they seem to be a change of topic, but do report the current situation for the two major groups of expats. They should have perhaps been given a new thread?)

[Mark100]

There was a lady in Aramco selling used Xmas cards for 5 riyals each...

yes true story!!!!

[Cleopatra]

I know Xmas cards can be hard to find here but ... there is a limit, isn't there?
By the way, if you're interested in used kiddies clothes, a colleague of mine would love to sell you some!
VS, is it really the same scene in the UAE? Oh dear, I'm planning to go there once I get my Masters and was somehow hoping that there'd be a smaller percentage of saddos there. I suppose at least in the UAE you're not so cloistered as you are here, and have more control over the people you befriend.
Insh'allah ...

[veiledsentiments]

Hi Cleo

Well, since I've never been to KSA (ilhamdulilah!) I couldn't say if it is exactly the same. But I have certainly encountered this situation in the other Gulf countries. I suspect that it has something to do with the fact that there is a huge underclass of poor workers who provide a market for what most of us consider junk. In Oman there were weekend meets where people sold things out of the trunks of their cars. I would expect that if one went to many yard/garage sales in the US, you would find people trying to sell similar junk and finding a similar market. Like you, I still find it strange and disconcertingly greedy.

VS
(loved the used Christmas card story ---)

[Cleopatra]

Dear VS,

In my experience, the market for ma'asalama sales are not the thrid World workers, but fellow "Western" expats. For example, an Australian colleague of mine recently left and sold her used bedsheets (!!!) to a new arrival. Other people I know have a bit more perspective and give the stuff away, either to their friends or to the cleaner. But there's still way too much of the 'come-and-get-a-used-plastic-strainer-for-5-rials" stuff.

When I asked about UAE expats, I was thinking of the whole deal, not just the maassalama sales. As I wrote in my post, I find too many expats here to be, wage slaves who feel that having white skin somehow makes them superior to everyone else, incl. - no, especially - the people who pay them so well. They take no interest in the country or people and just lock themselves up in their sad little expat world, where they can moan about how awful it is to be a "Westerner". Yeah, right. In fact, KSA is the only country I know of where "Westerners" officially get paid more than locals for doing the same job.

Please say it's not so bad in the UAE ...!

[veiledsentiments]

Good News Cleo,

I can honestly say that it is not as bad in the UAE!! Isn't that a relief for you?

Of course you will find many people just there for the money. Probably lots of those people of the type who sell used sheets were on their way to the UAE. You will find too many with the white skin superiority complex, but since the expat community is large and not compressed onto compounds, you can avoid them if you wish. The UAE has got plenty of like-minded people - whatever kind of 'mind' you may have.

I'm speaking here of Dubai and Abu Dhabi mostly - where the expat community is large.

VS

[Bebsi]

I was just reading back over old postings, and found this one by Cleopatra...still, IMO, highly relevant.

As I wrote in my post, I find too many expats here to be, wage slaves who feel that having white skin somehow makes them superior to everyone else, incl. - no, especially - the people who pay them so well. They take no interest in the country or people and just lock themselves up in their sad little expat world, where they can moan about how awful it is to be a "Westerner". Yeah, right. In fact, KSA is the only country I know of where "Westerners" officially get paid more than locals for doing the same job.

The Bold typeface is my own adition, BTW.

However, what's wrong with trying to save some money? We are all here for the money, right, we are here to save it and not to spend it in such wasteful activities as "enjoying life" as many might put it. Some would criticise us for being parsimonious in KSA, but what they fail to realise is that back home in the west we also understand the vital importance of not wasting money on nonsense like food, furniture, socialising, transport etc.

Here are some highly useful tips for saving money:

-Items like toilet paper are very expensive, and can be easily acquired free in the workplace or other peoples' houses. Not only are they free this way, but you can make some money when finally leaving KSA by selling accumulated stocks at the Massalamah sale.

-Similarly, bottled water is a way of saving money. Bring a load of plastic water bottles wherever you go, and fill up from those fountains. Some may be inconvenienced by having to wait in the queue behind you, but forget about them, they are just waiting to get a tiny drink. It helps to tell them to go away. You save them a lot of time this way, as by the time you fill all your bottles, there won't be enough water left for them anyway. There are fountains elsewhere, let them go there instead.

-Holidays are a serious expense. Why go on them? If you are living in KSA and you have X number of weeks' vacation, use them to stay in the Kingdom. If for example you live in an out-of-the-way place and feel you need a vacation, you could be wrong! You could explore the desert, find your own favourite spot and return there again and again. Not too far tho, as you might have to spend money on sundries like transport.

-Speaking of transport, it appears that many expats purchase vehicles, and others rent. They are costly, as is taking taxis. Forget about running a car or taking expensive cabs; walk to the supermarket and to work. By not having a vehicle, you will find that you are tempted to venture out a lot less. Ditto with taxis: by following an anti-taxi policy, your desire to remain at home will increase.
Some may balk at the thought of walking distances in extreme heat. However, do not let this deter you. Discomfort will be experienced at first, but then you will get used to it. In any event, you're not in Saudi for comfort, you are here TO SAVE MONEY!! Remember your goal.
If you DO wish to go somewhere some distance away, you can always seek a favour. Some will frown on this and refer to it as "bumming rides", but that's their opinion. Most people, even if they are not excessively keen on carrying you in their car, will acquiesce out of politeness and a desire to not cause acrimony, perhaps. . A few of them, of a materialistic bent, may insist on "petrol money". Refuse to pay, turn their materialism back on them, make them feel guilty. If they still insist, and refuse to provide travel in their vehicle, forget about them. Such people are of very little practical use anyway, so you don't need them!

-For entertainment, I would suggest finding another group of like-minded westpats. They will help you to while away, at no cost, many happy hours discussing teh misery of life in Saudi, and generally criticising everything possible about the Saudis. Like you, they will not have wasted time roaming about exploring the country, wasting money on nebulous concepts such as "fun", "enjoyment' or "happiness". Many of them indeed, will have been in the Kingdom for over twenty years, and will have lots of stories to tell about life behind closed compound doors, and indeed, lots of advice on how to save money. These are people who understand the really important things in life.

-If you have the choice, sharing accommodation can be a really useful pay to avoid spending money. If you are lucky enough to find yourself with generous individuals, who do not mind sharing their food with you, count your blessings. They will also not mind taking responsibility for boring, mundane chores, such as providing the house/apartment with cleaning materials, and common-kitchen staples such as tea, coffee, milk etc.
While some object to taking these responsilities seriously, and through their parsimoniousness, expect YOU to pay out also, just dismiss them. The technique of shaking your head in a combination of surprise and resigned sadness, will make them feel guilty and realise their fault. You can also get revenge...and save some money too...by helping yourself to their fridge stores. Biscuits, cheese, drinks...just help yourself. Those petty-minded whiners deserve it.

If any of our readers have any further suggestions, the rest of us would love to hear. All suggestions would be most welcome, and indeed taken very seriously if they help to further one's financial aims.

[veiledsentiments]

Oh Bebsi... you're killing me with these tales... first the driving rules and now this.

You must be having an even more boring summer than me!!

Thanks for the laughs...

VS

[shadowfax]

I would that I shared VS's penchant for very prolix and prosaic humour.
Trust Bebsi to attempt a revival of this old malignant chestnut of the execrable expat in Saudi. Actually, many of us do a sometimes stressful job with as much expertise, patience, and sensitivity as we may muster.
I advise that Bebsi take up some established reading of a satirical nature to see how the real wits work! I suggest The Way of all Flesh by Samuel Butler, or Tristram Shandy by Laurence Sterne. I intend to variegate my own humorism with the latter during the vacation. Has anybody ever managed to finish it yet? I started last vacation but failed miserably. I may bring it back to the Blest Araby to finish it there: it is it one of the chief virtues of that land to focus the mind on texts one might otherwise be distracted from.

[Bebsi]

VS,

You wouldn't believe what a busy summer I am having here, but I manage to find a few seconds to scribble my thoughts on (virtual) paper. I humbly extend my thanks for your kind words of praise...one endeavours to do one's best!!

[Bebsi]

An addendum to my earlier posting:

[veiledsentiments]