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anarisil18
Joined: 10 Jun 2005
Posts: 4
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 Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 3:28 pm Post subject: CELTA w/o DEGREE? |
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Hi all,
Im a 22 year old from the US, and I'm seriously considering taking the IH CELTA course in Seville next year.
I've been reading lots of different things about getting a job afterwards... since I dont have a 4 year degree (I have a technical school certificate-audio engineering), it looks like I might have a tough time.
I've also been reading that its no problem, and if I look hard enough, especially in Asia and S. America, even in Eastern Europe, there shouldn't be a problem.
Any one have any advice? Or has been in the same boat?
Thanks!
Sara |
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JonnytheMann
Joined: 01 Dec 2004
Posts: 337
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 4:19 pm Post subject: Re: CELTA w/o DEGREE? |
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| In many countries in S. America, they are not going to check your references. Just put a fake 4-year university degree on your resume. Look and act the part, and you'll get a job. |
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anarisil18
Joined: 10 Jun 2005
Posts: 4
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 4:31 pm Post subject: |
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WOAH! That sounds like sneaky work! I don't think I ever would/could lie about having a degree!!!
Not only is it insulting to people who DO have degrees, but what if I got caught!!!!???
LOL... thanks anyway!
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JonnytheMann
Joined: 01 Dec 2004
Posts: 337
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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| anarisil18 wrote: |
WOAH! That sounds like sneaky work! I don't think I ever would/could lie about having a degree!!!
Not only is it insulting to people who DO have degrees, but what if I got caught!!!!???
LOL... thanks anyway!
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If the place actually did check your references, which they 99.9% won't, then I guess they just wouldn't call you back. You won't get into trouble. I don't see how it's an insult to people with a degree. I've got a B.S., and I wouldn't be insulted if I found out you pretended to have a 4-year degree to get a TEFL job in S. America. The vast majority of private language institutes in S. America are owned by business people. They don't care about educating people, they care about $$$. If you're a native speaker, you'll find a job. Might not be the best one, but if you're just gonna stay for a year or two, I say you should walk into the institutes with a fake resume and play the part! Trust me, you will not get caught. And if you were somehow "caught", they wouldn't care if you were doing a good job in your classes. Why rock the boat when a native speaker is bringing in money and making students happy? |
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Justin Trullinger
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 3110
Location: Seoul, South Korea and Myanmar for a bit
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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Please! Some of us in SA do check references. And Johnny's right, you wouldn't get in trouble...just wouldn't get the job. And of course, if I was feeling vindictive, I might make a few calls to the other English academies in town...make sure they knew, and make sure you didn�t get a good TEFL job in town. I probably wouldn't bother, bu toyu never know. Do you feel lucky?
Really, it's a stupid risk to take, because Jonnytheman is 100% right, that a degree isn't a requirement in a lot of places in South America. One of the best teachers I've ever worked with, and whom I'm currently working with, has what one might call an "alternative education." (Professional qualifications in interesting fields, but no degree.) So why bother lying? Just go in on the level, and you're likely to find a job, and have nothing to hide for as long as you're in it.
Regards,
Justin |
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JonnytheMann
Joined: 01 Dec 2004
Posts: 337
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 5:59 pm Post subject: Hey Justin |
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OP, the advice from Justin is very good. You don't even need to lie about having a degree as it's not necessary. If you're pretty, speak English as a native language, and are willing to work, you'll find a job regardless.
Justin, I am just curious. You said you would check out the references. Are you from Ecuador? |
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Ben Round de Bloc
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 1946
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 6:09 pm Post subject: False claims |
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[quote="JonnytheMann"]
| anarisil18 wrote: |
| The vast majority of private language institutes in S. America are owned by business people. They don't care about educating people, they care about $$$. If you're a native speaker, you'll find a job. Might not be the best one, but if you're just gonna stay for a year or two, I say you should walk into the institutes with a fake resume and play the part! Trust me, you will not get caught. And if you were somehow "caught", they wouldn't care if you were doing a good job in your classes. Why rock the boat when a native speaker is bringing in money and making students happy? |
I'm glad you qualified it as S. America rather than saying all of Latin America.
If someone falsely claims on his CV that he has a university degree, what does he do when his employer tells him he needs proof of his highest level of education as part of the paperwork to apply for his work visa as is common in Mexico?
In the city where I live, few if any schools hire foreigners illegally (without a work visa.) Documentation has to be shown for any degrees, teacher training, and the like that applicants claim to have on their CVs. If a person claims to have a university degree on his CV but can only produce a high school diploma, then what? Try another school a few blocks away? As fast as word travels among people in the field of EFL in this city, the applicant had better be a world-class sprinter. |
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Justin Trullinger
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 3110
Location: Seoul, South Korea and Myanmar for a bit
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Justin, I am just curious. You said you would check out the references. Are you from Ecuador? |
Good heavens no! I'm from Iowa. But I've been here for a little while...
ANd you're right, Jonny, most people wouldn't check. (Maybe I only would if I felt some reason to be suspicious. or if I was bored.) But it still doesn't seem like a logical risk to take, especially when there are certainly possibilities around here for people without degrees.
And Mr "Round the Bloc" is right, as even a school that doesn't even require a degree may want a copy of it for the record, once you've said you have it.
Regards,
Justin |
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shamu
Joined: 09 Jun 2005
Posts: 3
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 6:44 pm Post subject: Re: Hey Jonny |
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| JonnytheMann wrote: |
| OP, the advice from Justin is very good. You don't even need to lie about having a degree as it's not necessary. If you're pretty, speak English as a native language, and are willing to work, you'll find a job regardless. |
So if you're not pretty, the possibilities are less? |
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Justin Trullinger
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 3110
Location: Seoul, South Korea and Myanmar for a bit
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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I didn't make the "pretty" comment, so I'm only speculating...maybe it depends on the "position" you're interested in? Tee hee.
But seriously, I would think that professional appearance and presentation would matter more than actual attractiveness. (I have done Ok in this field, in spite of being not very pretty at all.  )
Justin |
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JonnytheMann
Joined: 01 Dec 2004
Posts: 337
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:04 pm Post subject: Re: Hey Jonny |
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| shamu wrote: |
| So if you're not pretty, the possibilities are less? |
Sorry, I was just being kind of cynical and sarcastic with that one. There are always exceptions to the rule, but any cynic will tell you that the most qualified/certified non-white has no chance against an unqaulified white hottie when it comes to employment in most of Asia. It's a very unfair reality.
As far as S. America, all I will say is that if you are well-dressed, professional, and good-looking, you shouldn't have a problem finding a job. If you're well-qualified but make Roseanne Barr look like Miss Universe, well ...  |
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Ben Round de Bloc
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 1946
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Justin Trullinger wrote: |
Good heavens no! I'm from Iowa.
But it still doesn't seem like a logical risk to take, especially when there are certainly possibilities around here for people without degrees.
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I'm from Iowa, too. I wouldn't risk it either. Maybe those of us from "the land where the tall corn grows" are stuck forever with some of those ol' Midwestern ethics. |
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JonnytheMann
Joined: 01 Dec 2004
Posts: 337
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:17 pm Post subject: |
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Oh, it's totally unethical, I agree. I haven't done it.
But let's be honest. Several language institute owners are so unethical that they would probably help you get a fake diploma if the government really needed a copy. Some of them are in desperate need of native speakers to boost profits at their institutes.
If anarisil18 wants to make a career out of TEFLing, then she should get a degree and some certification. If she just wants a year or two of seeing the world, she should just go to South America. Someone is bound to give her a job ... diploma or not. |
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Ben Round de Bloc
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 1946
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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| JonnytheMann wrote: |
| But let's be honest. Several language institute owners are so unethical that they would probably help you get a fake diploma if the government really needed a copy. |
Not the type of employer that I'd recommend someone should work for.
| JonnytheMann wrote: |
| If she just wants a year or two of seeing the world, she should just go to South America. Someone is bound to give her a job ... diploma or not. |
That was one of my points. With her CELTA, even without a university degree, she should be able to find EFL teaching jobs -- legal jobs -- in many places. Why put the chances of getting legitimate jobs in jeopardy by falsely claiming to have a university degree? |
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JonnytheMann
Joined: 01 Dec 2004
Posts: 337
Location: USA
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:52 pm Post subject: |
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Why put the chances of getting legitimate jobs in jeopardy by falsely claiming to have a university degree?
Great point. |
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