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How much vacation time do you get a year?

 
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gregoryfromcali



Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Posts: 1207
Location: People's Republic of Shanghai

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 12:01 pm    Post subject: How much vacation time do you get a year? Reply with quote

Hey Everybody,

I was just wondering how much vacation time do you get year?

Is 30 days the standard for ESL Taiwan?
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Ki



Joined: 23 Jul 2004
Posts: 475

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2005 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I get 3 days paid holidays. I would think that on a contract position, one or two weeks is pretty standard here. I think that there has been a general decline in a lot of perks like paid holidays in salaried positions. In hourly positions you don't get any holidays at all but these are probably your best.

Oh sorry, do you mean paid or unpaid vacation time? I think you could swindle a couple of fortnight holidays in a year. I would think that most people have about a month off, unpaid, each year.

I don't have any first hand experience but I think University English teachers/lecturers get 4 months off paid.
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Sheep-Goats



Joined: 16 Apr 2004
Posts: 527

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2005 12:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I get one week plus national days, and that's pretty standard for language school work in Taiwan -- which is about all that's available someone without a MA TESOL, education certificate, or good contacts.

That week's in Chinese New Year, too -- the worst possible week to have vacation in due to any flight or bus being booked out.

I can request unpaid leave, but that's ain't holiday time, is it?
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Xenophobe



Joined: 11 Nov 2003
Posts: 163

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2005 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We always took 4 - 6 weeks every summer. It was unpaid for the most part, but we had enough savings plus our resigning bonuses to make it nice. Now that we are back in Taiwan we plan on taking more holidays, for shorter durations in the area, rather than going back home every year.
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ghost



Joined: 30 Jan 2003
Posts: 1693
Location: Saudi Arabia

PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:37 pm    Post subject: Holidays/Vacation Reply with quote

The school that offered me a contract has the following vacations.

1. 3 weeks paid vacation during the Chinese New Year (in Jan/Feb)

2. 7 weeks unpaid vacation between July 1, and August 25.

Result = 10 weeks vacation a year (2.5 months).

How does this compare with other places in Taiwan, and how much vacation time do people get who work in Universities?

By the way, other conditions.

1. $60.000 NT dollars a month.

2. Free accommodation (school provides), or subsidized accommodation (teacher pays about $40 a month) in an apartment close to school.

Your comments on the above perks would be most appreciated.

Please note that the school offers contracts only to teachers with formal educational quals. and teacher certification. In my case - B.A/B.Ed./ M.A./T.E.S.L.

Thanks for your input.
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clark.w.griswald



Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 2056

PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 1:06 am    Post subject: Re: Holidays/Vacation Reply with quote

ghost wrote:
The school that offered me a contract has the following vacations.

1. 3 weeks paid vacation during the Chinese New Year (in Jan/Feb)

2. 7 weeks unpaid vacation between July 1, and August 25.

Result = 10 weeks vacation a year (2.5 months).


Thats a lot of vacation time!

Is the summer vacation period compulsory or is it optional? It is pretty rough if it is compulsory and unpaid!

ghost wrote:
1. $60.000 NT dollars a month.


How many hours of work per month?

ghost wrote:
2. Free accommodation (school provides), or subsidized accommodation (teacher pays about $40 a month) in an apartment close to school.


Go for the subsidized accomodation as it gives you more freedom.
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Sheep-Goats



Joined: 16 Apr 2004
Posts: 527

PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 3:56 am    Post subject: Re: Holidays/Vacation Reply with quote

ghost wrote:
The school that offered me a contract has the following vacations.

1. 3 weeks paid vacation during the Chinese New Year (in Jan/Feb)

2. 7 weeks unpaid vacation between July 1, and August 25.

Result = 10 weeks vacation a year (2.5 months).

How does this compare with other places in Taiwan, and how much vacation time do people get who work in Universities?

By the way, other conditions.

3. $60.000 NT dollars a month.

4. Free accommodation (school provides), or subsidized accommodation (teacher pays about $40 a month) in an apartment close to school.

Your comments on the above perks would be most appreciated.

Please note that the school offers contracts only to teachers with formal educational quals. and teacher certification. In my case - B.A/B.Ed./ M.A./T.E.S.L.

Thanks for your input.


1. That's okay.
2. That sucks. If it isn't paid it isn't vacation in my book. Basically they get to secure your hours for that time and you don't get anything for it.
3. That's what people with no degree get offered.
4. Good plus, but definetly take subsidized as school accomodation always has some kind of drawback -- usually a social one.

If I had a BA, and a BEd, and a MA TESOL I'd laugh at that offer.

I know one guy who works at a uni here. He gets about five months off at 60k a month, all paid. One during the winter, the other four now. MA TESOL, years of EFL experience.

The only saving grace for that job offer for you would be if you were in the classroom for only, say, 12 hours a week or something and had the rest of your time to do as you pleased. But I bet it's in the 22 to 25 range, yeah?
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Aristotle



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Posts: 1388
Location: Taiwan

PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pay and benefits have been deteriorating island wide for some time now.
It is not just foreign teachers. The entire island is slipping into recession and the Taiwan government is incredibly incompetent at dealing with the problem. As usual they attempt to pretend it is not a problem and ignore the fact that pay is going down as prices are going up.
If you want a vacation you will most proably not be paid and teachers have lost their jobs for taking vacation or unpaid leave.

The labor laws of the Republic of China suggest that employers should give their employees paid vacations just like the law suggest that employers should pay overtime and respect the rights of foreign workers.
Unfortunately the few rights and benefits offered under Taiwan's toothless and widely ignored labor laws are nullified as soon as you sign a contract mandated by the government.
Welcome to Taiwan!
A.
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clark.w.griswald



Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 2056

PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 5:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aristotle wrote:
Pay and benefits have been deteriorating island wide for some time now.


You have never supplied any evidence of this Aristotle, and the reason that you have been unable to support this claim is because it is not true.

I have shown that wages are higher now than they have been in the past. If you wish to keep suggesting the above then you really should provide some evidence of it if you want any credibility.

Aristotle wrote:
If you want a vacation you will most proably not be paid and teachers have lost their jobs for taking vacation or unpaid leave.


I don't understand comments like this - sounds like a case of sour grapes to me.

When you negotiate your employment and sign a contract, the number and length of vacations is obviously understood and agreed to. It is up to you the teacher to decide what holiday arrangements you want. Some people prefer few holidays with pay, while others prefer long holidays even if they come without pay. Surely adults should be able to make this decision for ourselves. If you don't like the vacation arrangements at a certain school then find a deal with another school that you are happy with. This is what the OP is doing, and that is exactly the right thing to do. There seems little point to agreeing to terms and then complaining about them later.

As to the second half of what you say well I have never heard of anyone being let go for taking vacation time within the agreed allotment. Surely a school should have the right to let a teacher go who takes time above the agreed upon vacation time, with exceptions of course.

Aristotle wrote:
Unfortunately the few rights and benefits offered under Taiwan's toothless and widely ignored labor laws are nullified as soon as you sign a contract mandated by the government.


No they're not and it is pointless to suggest that they are.

No civil employment contract can override the law, and as such no contract can prohibit a teacher from taking the mandated holidays.

Labor Standards Law

Quote:
Article 38

Where a worker continues to work for one and the same employer or business entity for a certain period of time, he shall be granted special leave on an annual basis on the following scale:

1. seven days for the service of more than one year but less than three.
2. ten days for the service of more than three years but less than five.
3. fourteen days for the service of more than five years but less than ten.
4. one additional day for each year of service over ten years up to a maximum of thirty days.


According to the above, locals can expect to receive seven days leave in their first three years of employment, ten days for three to five years of employment and up from there.

The above may be either paid or unpaid depending upon whether or not the worker is full time or part time.

In comparison the majority of contracts with foreigner teachers offer between one and three weeks of vacation time in the first year of employment. Equal to or exceeding the government stipulation. Some teachers, as has been mentioned above, get a lot more holiday time than this, some paid, some not.

So what is your complaint based upon Aristotle?

It's not based upon the legislation as the legislation doesn't support your claims.

It's not based upon the experiences of foreign teachers, as these don't support your claims either.

So that leaves only your personal agenda of attempting to discourage teachers from coming to Taiwan. Well you are not succeeding in this endeavor as there are more foreign teachers in Taiwan now than there ever has been.
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ghost



Joined: 30 Jan 2003
Posts: 1693
Location: Saudi Arabia

PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 2:18 pm    Post subject: reality Reply with quote

Quote:
Thats a lot of vacation time!

Is the summer vacation period compulsory or is it optional? It is pretty rough if it is compulsory and unpaid!


Reality check.

In Canada - even when you work in the Public school system, the summer vacations are not paid in the true sense of the word.

What the school boards do is to pay their teachers 10 months salary -spaced out over 12 months [/i]- this is for convenience, and because, humans, being humans, tend to overspend when they don't need to, hence the ten months salary spaced out over 12 months.

Point two: Yes, the qualifications possessed (B.A./B.Ed./ M.A./ Post Graduate Cert. in T.E.S.L.) are more than adequate, but just because you have those quals. does not mean that you can jump into a lucrative/cushy Uni. job right away.

Point three: No - the summer vacation is not compulsory, as many teachers stay on and work for the summer school section, but in my case, having free time and being able to travel is more important, and that is ok, and once again, look at the 10 months salary as being largely adequate to fund summer vacation r & r, if you live a normal life throughout the year, without undue extravagence.

Being prepared to serve an apprenticeship in a High school (as will be the case for me) will serve me well, should the decision be taken to stay on in Taiwan.

Also being quite a few years older than your average TEFLER makes one take job offers a lot more seriously compared with someone who is in the prime age group bracket.

Yes - having July and August off is a lot, but think of it this way - during the other 10 months of the year, one can save enough to make plans and take vacation time during that time.

Think of it this way. How many jobs in the States or in Canada, would you be able to save $1000 dollars a month net or more? Not very many - and certainly not for most people, who have mortgage payments, car payments and a host of other things to pay on a monthly basis.



Feedback appreciated.
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clark.w.griswald



Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 2056

PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 2:43 pm    Post subject: Re: reality Reply with quote

ghost wrote:
Quote:
Thats a lot of vacation time!

Is the summer vacation period compulsory or is it optional? It is pretty rough if it is compulsory and unpaid!


Reality check.

In Canada - even when you work in the Public school system, the summer vacations are not paid in the true sense of the word.


That might be true.

The problem in the Taiwan context is that NTD60,000 is an average monthly wage that I doubt takes into consideration the two months off. So in the case of Taiwan they are not spreading twelve months pay over ten months, they are just paying for ten months and expecting the teacher to be available for twelve months.

A teacher in almost any other school in Taiwan would probably work the full 12 months of the year and earn a lot more this way.
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Xenophobe



Joined: 11 Nov 2003
Posts: 163

PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 2:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Currently, I am working on Kinmen and the contract with the MOE and local board of education stipulates that we work the full twelve months. The summer schedule at the school is relaxed, but I am still at school by 8 AM and exp stay until 4:30, Monday to Thursday. The classes are taught between 1:30 and 4:30, the rest of time being administrative, but I am able to run any personal errands I need to during this time. I have 10 working days off in the summer and 10 at Chinese New Year. The pay is approximately $NT 80 000 a month, which includes a rental subsidy. I can't complain.
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Ki



Joined: 23 Jul 2004
Posts: 475

PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have the opposite problem. If I do want to take an unpaid vacation, even for one day, I have to find and supply my school with a suitable replacement to be paid at a substandard rate of pay.
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Xenophobe



Joined: 11 Nov 2003
Posts: 163

PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's BS, because your replacement is essentially breaking the law by working at your school without a visa. Are there any other teachers at your school who can cover yoor classes? You are entitled to time off under Taiwanese law. If they don't like it, find another school.
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