Job Discussion Forums

[tw]

OK, I know International House recognizes CELTA and CELTA only (or is it Trinity). I am going to register for Oxford Seminar's 60-hour TEFL course next week just to give myself a little bit of competitive edge, and maybe I can learn something that I don't know yet. So the question to all of you who is TEFL/TESL certified: which course do you recommend, or it doesn't really make any difference in China (yet), i.e. do most employers recognize any and all TEFL certificates? I wouldn't take an online TEFL course even if the Chinese employers would recognizethem (did consider them until reading some warnings). But that's just the thing, I don't want to shell out about $500 USD on a 60-hour TEFL course and then being told that it's not good enough in China. I would take a longer course but money is extremely tight and so is time.

Thanks everyone!

[burnsie]

I have been teaching for about a year with no previous experience and will just about wrap up my contract. I have asked the management about TEFL and they will provide it to me because I have taught over 500 hours at the school. It doesn't cost you anything. I don't think all schools do this.

I have been lead to believe that it helps but really you don't need it if you have already a degree of some sort.

[tw]

Remember my post regarding FEC application? OK I will come straight out and tell everyone what happened 2 days ago. I was told by my FORMER next employer that my application for FEC was rejected -- even though both parties had signed the official SAFEA contract and I had passed my medical exam. The reason: no bachelor's degree, even though I was said to be a very good teacher at my last school. Nope, no exceptions -- even though this was only a different university in the same city. So OK, rules have changed and regulations have tightened. I can't just walk around screaming and yelling that hey I am experienced so I should be allowed to teach. I will bite the bullet and shell out the money if it means having a much better chance at getting a job. Hell, don't forget the fact that I have a yellow face so it's tough enough already.

[lowes13]

I�ve asked the same sort of question on this forum in the past, http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/job/viewtopic.php?t=25172&highlight=, and at that time I was unable to gain any input so I hope you fair much better.

My thoughts remain the same should you care to read them, good luck.

[tw]

[randerso]

Ok, I'm not really sure what tw's situation is. Are you trying to make up for the lack of a Bachelor's with a TEFL certificate? It seems to me that China is last in line for turning away people based on thier certification - but the trend is catching on. If you look at countries that have had a longer standing ESL market (like Korea or Japan) you'll find that the immigration agencies require Uni degrees (to do things the legal way, anyway). So these countries have started deciding between applicants by certification. On that note, it seems to be ANY certificate that is regarded with prestige. CELTA is, in my opinion, the best training you can get; but it is still reletively new in Asian markets. It's also really expensive and time intensive. If you are planning on staying in Asia (and out of Europe) I'd stick with a TEFL.

I am still confused as to how having a TEFL will help overcome having no Bachelors degree. I don't think that the gov't has changed the law requiring foreign teachers to have a Bachelors, but it may be a growing trend in the cut throat business that is ESL. As for International House - I'm not sure why you're interested in them. As far as I'm aware, there is only one IH is Asia right now. When I worked for IH last year in Europe, I did so with only an online TESOL course and 4 years in the classroom. It seems that just like anywhere else, schools will take what they think they can get. If you try to compete in Beijing or Shanghai, you may have a problem. But go into the boondocks, and you should be fine with or without TEFL.

And I hope I'm not overstepping my boundries here, but this sudden switch of policy from that school may also be a reaction to the 'yellow-skin' you spoke of. It's happened to several of my Asian-American friends that they meet all the written requirements for a school only to be told that they need something more when there is a face-to-face meet. If they don't have that other thing (degree, certificate, experience, etc) a different, white, foreigner is then hired who does not have that extra documentation that was demanded of the Asian-American. Sucks, yes, wrong, yes, but true and rampant in Asain countries.

[tw]

As you said, it's a cutthroat business. A few years ago (especially before it was known that Beijing would host the 2008 summer Olympics) it would've been fairly easy to get a teaching job in most parts of China. Consider the fact that in the West, one would have to have a Master's to be able to teach in a college, and PhD to teach in a university, China was quite easy to get a teaching job (Chinese university teachers need only a Bachelor's). But now, in part thanks to Olympics 2008, China is full of foreigners all claiming to be qualified ESL teachers. It's like any John and Jane Doe with a degree in anything can be classified as a Foreign Expert -- even if they'd just graduated from university 2 weeks ago and had never worked a day in their life. Of course, no EFL certificate can be seen as a make up for university degree. No, far from it. But having a EFL certificate at least will show that I have been trained and not some hack.

The problem here is that people in China keep thinking that anyone with a university degree can teach EFL. Not too many of them would go through a proper interview. OK, so you have a university degree? Good enough, welcome aboard. They don't consider maturity, relative experience, and English proficiency. I am not saying all this as a way to make myself look good. But you know something? Whereas we have been reading about all these bad schools and lousy FAO's, why don't we ask the Chinese to come in here and tell us about the bad FT's they've had? I am very sure they will have a field day. We are talking about the p*sstanks, the pedophiles, and the God-wannabes. During my 2 years in China (especially my first year), I watched and observed the FT's and there'd been times when I asked myself, "How did they ever get a teaching job working in China in the first place???" I would never have hired them myself if I had been an employer.

[tofuman]

tw,

What is your problem? Don't you understand that a bachelor's degree is the minimum educational qualification to legally teach in China? Why are you so intent on doing anything but what is required?

I have been offered several jobs here and am just finishing up my second year. No one ever asked me about a TEFL, CELTA, TESOL qualification.

It rarely pays to cut corners when getting an education. My academic qualifications are quite modest. You may get a job without a degree or an advanced degree, but you will not be respected. It will be just another reason for your employers to mistreat and abuse you.
[edit]
If you don't want to meet the minimum expectation, i.e., a bachelor's degree, get another line of work.

[tw]

Tofuman, I am doing what other people are also doing. In a recent corresponce with a DOS that individual revealed that he/she doesn't have a degree either but has a TEFL certificate. On a government recruiting web site, there were many FT's listed as being college graduate instead of university graduate. Heck, I still see ads from colleges and universities stating that a highschool diploma and TEFL is enough.

So, saying that I am not playing by the rules is just