Job Discussion Forums

[JimDunlop2]

Unfortunately I don't think there is really an appropriate forum to voice this question, but perhaps I can find enough people here that have sufficient working knowledge of the Japanese language to answer a question for me.

I'm studying Japanese as best I can, and have recently come across the term: onegaishimasu which I translate as meaning "thank you" and something roughly similar as "o kudasai" but a bit more contextual.

My question is this. I've also been reading "Geisha of Gion" by Minkeo Iwasaki, and at one point in the book she refers to her dancing lessons where she had to follow a formal ritual prior to each lesson. She writes: "Holding the maiohgi with your right hand, lean forward and place it on the floor in front of your knees, like so and, keeping your back perfectly straight, bow, saying "Onegaishimasu." (Please honour my humble request to be taught.)"

Does the word really mean/imply all of that? Can someone comment a little more on its specific usage, particularily in light of this context?

Finally, is there such commonality in this and ritual in other Japanese teacher-student interaction, for instance in the case of martial arts?

Thanks for your input in advance!

JD

[azarashi sushi]

Jim... both onegaishimasu and kudasai essentially mean please... Onegaishimasu litterally translates as "do a favour" and kudasai literally translates as "give me". Yes, onegaishimasu can mean all of that... it is generally understood in each situation what favour is being asked.

A.S.

[guest of Japan]

The previous response is perfect. I might add that in my opinion "onegaishimasu" is far more useful than "o kudasai," as it can be used in more situations and is a bit more polite.

[tjpnz2000]

I'm no cunning linguest but here is my bit. By the way, anybody else hate romanji Japanese the way they hate katakana English? I certainly do.

`o kudasai` is the more formal and is more directly translatable as `Please`.

`onegaishimasu` is less formal and can have many broarder meanings dependent on the context of the conversation. I once had a japanese tell me that it can mean `Please favour me` for example.

I will try to put this into English, please bear with me,

`Please go to the door on your left`= `o kudasai`

`Go to the door on your left, thanks`= `onegaishimas`

(I am certain that the above is as clear as mud, sorry)

I use `onegaishimasu` for different things, for example:

1) To say thanks when someone does something for me as opposed to giving me something when I would say `arigato`
2) To end conversations politely, for example a formal introduction.
3) When formally greeting my aikido sensei before the begining of a lesson I will kneel, bow and say `onegaishimas`. My sensei, who will be kneeling reply in kind.

This forms `aisatsu`, formal greeting by which a student gives respect the thier teacher and the teacher recogises that the correct respect has been shown. This is probably what Minkeo Iwasaki was doing but I have not read the book.

Sorry if I have made things less clear not more.

[Guest]

I taught a lovely sixty year old lady who despite my protests bowed and said onegaishimasu every time she entered my classroom. Jim's original translation Please honour my humble request to be taught is pretty accurate in this case, but realistically would any native speaker actually say this? I eventually persuaded my pensioner to say Let's study English as she came through the door, which seemed like a good compromise as she was determined to say something. The bowing I didn't manage to stop.

[Wolf]

"Onegaishimasu" is the humble form of the verb "negau" or "negaishimasu."

"Negau" means literally "to ask."

"I humbly ask" is not quite right, though. It gets used when you ask for something, or when you ask someone to do something for you, and you want to appear humble and apologetic for causing trouble (there's lots of this. When you go into a house you say "ojamashimasu." "Jamasuru" means "to be an obsticale/be a problem.") In Anime you can see cute bishoujou chirp "Onegai! Onegai! Onegai!" when they want other characters to do something for them. It's a shortened, less formal form of the same word, and could be translated as "please, please, oh pretty please?"

The OP cited "Please honour my humble request," which is a good general translation.

It's not necessarily connected with teaching. A teaching situation is one example where it can be used though.

[nakanoalien2]

Katy - that's a great story. I've been there.

Totally agree with your point - translation is an art. Translate into something natural, preferably for your century. When is the last time you said, "I humbly ask..."? All I can think of is a guy running around in tights and a wig begging to be in his lord's presence.

[Sunpower]

[TokyoLiz]

Detarame

[lajzar]

tokyoliz, you might want to check your posts with the preview function before you submit. The legibility of your post was sub-optimal.

[fion]

The most useful example of this word I've come across is in the phrase 'ryoshisho onegaishemasu' where it means 'please give me an official-looking receipt for this so I can claim it off tax'.

[Munchen]

Can TokyoLiz's reply be removed here? It's messing up the whole forum here for printing!!

[TokyoLiz]

Dude, my apologies for not checking before posting. My message displayed fine on this machine (Japanese platform).

Please kill my message.

[Dr.J]

As far as I can see, it's one of those words so embedded in the culture that an accurate translation is not really possible without explaining the cultural background at the same time.

Like 'Otsukaresama desu' which can be translated as 'you are an honorable tired person' but is just a way of saying 'good job today buddy', which the Japanese say a lot more than westerners.

My 2yen is just, don't get hung up on translations, work more on getting a feel for the situations in which the word is used, and use it when they do.