Job Discussion Forums

[hangzhouvice]

How ye all?! I'm new to this forum, but I've been an avid reader for the last year. It's taken me till now to bother getting around to registering with Dave. But here i am.
Anyways, I've been observing with great dismay how most chinese universities are selling up their city-centre campuses and moving out to green zones or light industry zone outside the city where they've been constructing huge soulless campuses with very few amenities and insufficient transport systems. I think the poor students are getting the rawest deal here, as they're paying the same or higher tuition fees to live in what I described to a FAO in a recent email as a sort of hell.
Us teachers are not far behind, and I say to any of you who are taking up those positions in hell, to think about what you're doing, and that we should all boycott these jobs until salaries increase to reflect the utter undesirability and inconvienence of moving out to the suburbs.

Soon, the traditional campus of the city-centre will be a memory of the past, and I, for one, mourn this loss

[NateM]

I think that might be jumping the gun a little on the quick side. Are actions you described happening? Of course they are. However, in my experience it seems that many of the new campuses being built out in these industrial zones are actually new schools altogether.

[kev7161]

I remember last year visiting a campus in the NW corner of Hangzhou. To get there by bus was about an hour from the center of the city and there was NOTHING around - - restaurants, shops, etc. Certainly no entertainment for young adults on the weekend. You would think it would make more sense for the business minded to open up a shop or two around a college campus. A place where kids can hang out and drink coffee or tea, sing a little karaoke, do some light (cheap) shopping (these kids are on a strict budget from what I understand), etc. Then again, this campus had a library, several cafeterias, outdoor basketball and tennis courts and plenty of spacious areas for strolling with that special someone. Perhaps the idea is to keep students away from temptation and vice so many of them don't want to make that long bus journey into town.

However, enough of them do and that just adds to more traffic congestion with jam-packed buses every Fri-Sun.

[Voldermort]

There is an excellent university here in my city. I have heard nothing but good things from all the FT's working there. But heres the catch: they rely on Peace Core volunteers to work for them, giving them a mere 1000 yuan a month to survive. Yet these volunteers are very happy to this and often stay for more than 2 years at a time.

God help us all if the rest of China learns about this.

[Babala]

The schools here don't want the students to be surrounded by entertainment. If they are farther away from any distractions, the easier it will be for them to control them. Same rule applies to their FT's.

[Roger]

I learnt the truth just today!

I noticed a continuous line of trucks loading desks, computers and sewing machines.

Some of my colleagues received their marching orders at the beginning of this term; today, by sheer accident, I found out I was going to have to join our new campus in University Town, a purpose-built megacampus for a dozen universities and home to 30'000 students, (and still admitting new ones).

The old campus looks rather eerie these days, and the new one is loathed because of its isolation.

IT is the trend in this country! One univesity is not big enough, so it merges with a few others. Others set up branches - go to Zhuhai and see how many branches there are of "famous" universites such as Peking University, Dr SUn Yatsen University or Jinan University...

These new faculties are usually on relatively affordable land, not seldom former agriculturally-used terain. Downtown areas simply become concrete deserts fit for business and entertainment but inhospitable and sterile!

And, of course, it's easier to control a huge number of students clostered up in an academic island far out in the rural sea than the same number in a heavily-built up area with good transport and a lot of shopping malls, discotheques and hotels.

[chengdude]

Indeed, this phenomenon is definitely occurring in Nanjing and Chengdu, the two cities I have some experience with. Let's face it though, as the replies already indicate, this isn't the simplest of matters to explain away/gripe about. I'm not sure I buy into the "controlling students" theories, though. Other factors to consider would have to include:

-Soaring land prices in city centers; universities in choice urban locations are basically sitting on gold mines. If they have the control, why not sell out, build a new, larger campus, and possibly even have money left over? If they don't, I'm sure local governments have equally effective -if less draconian- measures for displacing universities as they do for restive farmers who would prefer to stay on their ancestral, soon-to-be-an-economic-development-zone plots of land. By way of example, Chengdu University sold their land, built a campus from scratch on the far northeastern edge of the city, and reportedly still had a bit of profit left over. The exceptions will probably be national key universities; for example, Nanjing University and Nanjing Normal University will keep their choice lands because of their ranking, collaborative projects with western universities, and high foreign student enrollments. See below for why the bulk of foreign teachers will never enjoy the attractions these locales offer.

-Soaring student enrollments; they just get bigger and bigger each year, so what to do with all of them? UESTC in Chengdu recently completed their new campus on the western edge of Chengdu to accommodate their growing student body. "Growing student body" means, of course, undergraduates, so foreign teachers can likely look forward to ever more postings to these suburban locations. Nanjing University's downtown campus is, I believe, primarily for graduate students, while undergrads are out in the 'burbs.

-Campus upgrades. There are actually universities engaged in research that move further and further out to build larger research labs and other slightly scary experimental facilities. Chinese nuclear physics lab next to your apartment, anyone? I spoke to a teacher here in Nanjing who is considering moving on as his university, already outside the city itself, is weighing whether to move even further out to build up their research capabilities.

The moral, obviously, is that new teachers wishing to experience the rich tapestry of urban life along with their teaching work need to do their homework more than ever. Jobs will always be described as being located in "XX famous city" (as mine was and yes, I failed to do my homework so I'm dealing with it), yet Chinese cities are often sprawling amalgams and the rules for describing their boundaries are fast and loose. My university is "Nanjing XXXXXX" but is located 20 kilometers out of the city center along a miserable stretch of highway.

[bdawg]

There are a couple of University 'Cities' in Nanjing. Shenling (pinyin?) and Jiangning. They are both out in the sticks (Jiangning in particular). Most of the undergrads spend their time out in these places. I know a few suburbanite teachers out in those places. Some like it, some don't.

But not all is lost, come 2010 there will be a metro line out to at least one of them.

[erinyes]

[NateM]

[cj750]

There are 6 levels of land ownership/use in China.....

Some farmers outright own land ..in a township along with others..that is why when traveling from one village ..alwasy a few of the houses are better equip than the others...

The trick with land ownership doesnt really play foul util the individual land owner..who has land leases for 70 yearz...runs out the lease..there is no provision as of yet for renewal...

Also a note for land contracts..such as a fower farmer I know near Sanya..(foreigner)..most contract for land use are not legal so the Chinese land owner/leaser can with draw the contract at any time...