| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Aussiegirl
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 19
Location: Currently Oz on route to China
|
 Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 5:19 am Post subject: urgent help needed. F Visa/pre approval letter/ PSB decoding |
 |
|
Hi All
I have been accepted by a school in Jiangxi Province. They sent me a formal invitation letter to apply for an F Visa for one month, saying they will convert later if both parties are happy. Terrific...BUT the Chinese consulate in Oz have knocked back my visa applic. stating they also need letter from FAO in China authorising my pending visit. The invitation was from the school FAO but apparently it is not sufficient because the embassy here is cracking down and insisting on official authorisation.
Checking the visa postings is hugely confusing. Now I'm not sure if I have explained to the school correctly about the FAO authorisation letter. Can someone please let me know the meaning of PSB? (Pardon my ignorance.) I read of it in one of the posts in relation to a pre-approval letter. Have done a quick search but seem to only come up with the acronym. Do you think a pre-approval letter from the PSB is what I need to ask my school to obtain for me.
All and any help will be most appreciated.
Aussiegirl |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
tw
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
Posts: 3898
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 6:11 am Post subject: Re: urgent help needed. F Visa/pre approval letter/ PSB deco |
|
|
| Aussiegirl wrote: |
| BUT the Chinese consulate in Oz have knocked back my visa applic. stating they also need letter from FAO in China authorising my pending visit. The invitation was from the school FAO but apparently it is not sufficient because the embassy here is cracking down and insisting on official authorisation. |
I think what you/they meant is authorization letter from the PSB. According to the Chinese consulate in Vancouver's web site:
| Quote: |
| 1) for business "F" visa(single or multiple): A: an official invitation from the competent Chinese government agencies or organizations, or companies that are authorized to request the Consulate-General to issue visa; B: photocopies of business license issued by the competent Chinese agency or contracts for those who have business or investments in China. |
| Quote: |
| Can someone please let me know the meaning of PSB? (Pardon my ignorance.) |
PSB = Public Security Bureau AKA the police. These people are the ones who issue such important documents as your RPF, and who you need to go to in order to renew your tourist visa. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Voldermort
Joined: 14 Apr 2004
Posts: 597
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 7:57 am Post subject: |
|
|
You are trying to apply for a 1 month business visa yet on your application form you have written that you intend to coe over to work. Due to these two quite contradictory reasons they have declined your visa.
You should do a little more research regarding your legal status in China before you attempt to come over. Don't just take the schools word for it.
To apply for an F (business) visa, yes you will need a formal letter for a company in China, you will also need a copy of their business license, though some consulates may wave the latter. For a Z (work) visa you will need a formal invitation letter from the FAO (Foreign affairs office) which is part of the government within your schools city.
This school is asking you to spend a lot of money and for you to put yourself into a very illegal position. Coming over to do a 1 month trial is not the way to do it. either the school gives you a contract for a stated period (1 - 12 months) accompanied with a letter from the FAO, with which you will gain a visa, or you look for a more reputable school.
It is however possible for the school to include a clause in your contract which states the 1 month trial, however they are still responsible for giving you the legal (Z visa) paperwork before you enter into such an agreement. If this is the case the school should also refund at least half of your air-fair in the event the contract is cancelled. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Aussiegirl
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 19
Location: Currently Oz on route to China
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 10:10 am Post subject: urgent help needed. F Visa/pre approval letter/ PSB decoding |
|
|
Thank you so much TW and Voldemort for your promt assistance.
I must admit, I was surprised and confused when the school wanted me to apply for a one month exchange scholar visa, because I've been studying the forums for months and thought Z visa was the legal and legitimate way to go. However, the school FAO insisted that there were new rules and so I applied for a 6 month visa because travel agent said best to put 6 months because I might want to be tourist after exchange - if we didn't extend into working teaching visa. This advice may have blown applic. out of water due to discrepancy between one month letter and 6 month stay). Travel agents also recommended that I'd be better to travel on a tourist visa and change over in China but most of the advice I've seen on the forums said that was a bad idea and that in some provinces you cannot change a tourist visa to a working visa.
I thought -going by the info below and because I had my letter of invitation I'd be accepted.
For type "F" (business, academic visit) visa, please present us your supporting documents like invitation from your Chinese counterpart, letter from your local employer, or , your company license issued by relevant Chinese authorities;
I never mentioned on my visa application that I was going to work; I listed PURPOSE OF VISIT" as visting scholar."
If this whole deal goes south, I will probably be unable to reapply to Chinese Consulate for a visa because I'll have to say that a previous application has been rejected and they'll certainly want to know why I'm now either a. applying to work or b. be a tourist.
That's not your problem, of course, but I'm panicking because I've already paid and done the TESOL course, paid the airfare, my travel insurance, a Mandarin course not to mention the hundreds of hours I've spent on the research and yet, I've still messed up because when I was told that there were new rules and ways to do things in Jiangxi, I ignored all I'd learnt. After communications today with the school, I don't think they even know what the right protocols are and they certainly didn't sound as confident as I would have liked about obtaining the letter of authorisation. They're going to see if it is "possible." Great....
Meanwhile, thanks for listening to my rant. I'd heard this China business can be fraught and now I know why.
Hopefully all will be worked out and soon I'll be able to say, YIPPEE, I'm here. Fingers crossed.
Thanks again.
Aussiegirl |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Roger
Joined: 19 Jan 2003
Posts: 9138
|
| Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 11:47 am Post subject: |
|
|
I believe your would-be employer has muddled up things.
If they invite you formally to join their outfit then they must sponsor you for the intended period; I don't know of anyone who was ditched after one month because they failed the probation period!
Your employer ought to extend an invitation not for one month but for a whole term of employment!
Probation periods are not uncommon but they cannot be enforced on officially invited foreign nationals! They can be imposed if you come on a tourist visa, expecting it to be upgraded into a work visa/residence permit. The Chinese embassy no doubt wonders how you are going to return to Oz if you do not make it past the probation period!
If they insist on a probation period for you, they must seek an upgrade to your visa in their own jurisdiction; you cannot apply for a visa other than a tourist one.
Maybe you should simply apply for a tourist visa then! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tw
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
Posts: 3898
|
| Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 12:30 am Post subject: Re: urgent help needed. F Visa/pre approval letter/ PSB deco |
|
|
| Aussiegirl wrote: |
If this whole deal goes south, I will probably be unable to reapply to Chinese Consulate for a visa because I'll have to say that a previous application has been rejected and they'll certainly want to know why I'm now either a. applying to work or b. be a tourist.
That's not your problem, of course, but I'm panicking because I've already paid and done the TESOL course, paid the airfare, my travel insurance, a Mandarin course not to mention the hundreds of hours I've spent on the research and yet, I've still messed up because when I was told that there were new rules and ways to do things in Jiangxi, I ignored all I'd learnt. After communications today with the school, I don't think they even know what the right protocols are and they certainly didn't sound as confident as I would have liked about obtaining the letter of authorisation. They're going to see if it is "possible." Great.... |
Don't panic. China does need FT's badly and you WILL be teaching in China (maybe as soon as next month). Yes, for now there will be some financial losses but that's just because you are green and made some mistakes, e.g. paying for airfare and travel insurance BEFORE getting your visa. So you may not be able to work for this employer. But there will be plenty of employers available and many of them will know the proper procedures to get you to come here working legally. Sure, the location and/or salary may not be good as the first employer. But in the long run, you will probably look back and tell yourself that you are better off with the new employer.
Now, given the fact that Spring Festival starts in 3 weeks and most if not all public schools have gone on winter break, you will not be able to contact any public schools too easily (especially if you were to go through an agent). Believe it or not but three weeks to a month is really the amount of time (in my opinion) I think one needs to go from "securing" (there is really no security until you have all the needed documents in your hands to get your Z visa at the Chinese consulatre) a position to getting your Z visa. Depending on where you will be going, you need to get a medical exam done and possibly a police background check. The employer needs to get you the Work Permit, the Visa Notice, and a letter of invitation by taking your documents and presenting them to various government departments. Again, with the fact that Spring Festival is just around the corner, many employers will probably not bother until a week before the term begins. Then the cycle begins again: they are in a panic to have all the FT's so they will tell you to come with a L visa or a F visa. Don't fall for that again! Just wait patiently. Many FT's don't arrive until a month after classes have begun (in the case of teaching at public schools). It is a painfully slow process. I had to do it twice between May and August -- all because a job fell through due to my not having a university degree so the initial employer couldn't get me the Work Permit.
Again, just take a deep breath and everything will work out eventually. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Giantbudwiser
Joined: 19 Apr 2004
Posts: 138
Location: The wrong side of the world
|
| Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 4:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Just fly to Hong kong pay a little money to a travel agency there and u can get up to 1 year F visa within 24hrs no questions asked, then head into China. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
clark.w.griswald
Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 2056
|
| Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 4:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
Hopefully you are considering positions in other schools as this current school does not seem to be the most competant one!
I don't know that you need to be too concerned about the fact that you were knocked back for the visa as far as applying again. Yes technically you will need to tick the box next time to indicate this fact, and therefore your application will meet greater scrutiny, but considering that yours was an administrative oversight I doubt that it will affect any future applications.
I would advise finding an alternative school and using the knowledge that you have now gained to do things properly. You may also be able to salvage the air ticket etc.
On the air ticket matter, sometimes visa offices will want to see that you have a ticket. Just ask your travel agent for a print out of the itinerary as this is generally enough for the visa office and allows you to process your visa prior to paying for the ticket. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
erinyes
Joined: 02 Oct 2005
Posts: 272
Location: GuangDong, GaoZhou
|
| Posted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 9:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
| If all else fails, go to Shenzhen on a tourist visa. Find a job and then travel 1/2 an hour to HK to get your Z visa. Simple. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Aussiegirl
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 19
Location: Currently Oz on route to China
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 12:00 am Post subject: urgent help needed. F Visa/pre approval letter/ PSB decoding |
|
|
Thanks everyone for your encouragement and advice.
The school have now told me they can't get government authorisation until I am there, contract signed and then FEB process and authorise.
Most unwisely as it turns out, I stopped considering other schools some time ago and set my heart on this one where I now know a couple of people already working there. This visa thing was one area where I didn't expect any problems. My travel agent insists that all the Australian foreign teachers she's sent to China have gone on a tourist visa and had them converted in China, though apparently before this new controller my invitation letter would have passed their requirements.
I know coming on a tourist visa is not usually the recommended route, but providing the school can get the tourist visa converted, I think this is my best option if I want to go to this school. The school is checking if this is possible.
[/b] Has anyone had this done successfully in Jiangxi province or know of anyone who has please?
I know the obvious is to find a new school, but if things can work out at this one on a tourist visa I'd really like to try.
Many thanks again
Aussiegirl
PS: Enjoy your holidays |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Voldermort
Joined: 14 Apr 2004
Posts: 597
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 1:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
There are many schools spread across China these days that insist us foreigners go against everything the Chinese authorities say, and come here with a tourist visa.
Yes it is true that there may be a chance of having this converted to a work visa after entering the country. But you must bear in mind that there has been a big shake up of the 'in country' visa conversions last year. You should ask the school when is the last time they performed this type of conversion, and can they provide you with a guarantee that they can do it again for you?
It is simple bull *beep* that they cannot get government authorisation before you come over. They are being like most Chinese, lazy! They are worried that if they go through the effort of picking up the phone and sending a few faxes, that you won't show up.
If your heart is set on going to that school, get it in writing from them that they will cover all your expenses regardless of the length of time you stay. If they can't get a visa, they should pay up, if they are not happy after your probation period, they should pay up. Get it in writing.
It is possible for you to come here with a tourist visa. You will need to show the consulate your airline ticket or itinerary, in and out of china, before they will issue you with one. Get an open return ticket for say 2 months, if you stay then change the date after your school has arranged your visa. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tw
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
Posts: 3898
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 1:21 am Post subject: Re: urgent help needed. F Visa/pre approval letter/ PSB deco |
|
|
| Aussiegirl wrote: |
| The school have now told me they can't get government authorisation until I am there, contract signed and then FEB process and authorise. |
Yes, I forgot about that. I had to sign a contract with the employer who I mentioned that I was initially going to be working for, and my current employer just so they could get me the necessary documents needed for my Z visa. I think the authorities want to make sure that the foreigner is going to work for the employer and (1) not going to jump ship or (2) the employer is not trying to use another employer's name in order to get the foreigner to work somewhere that is not legally allowed to have FT's. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ger
Joined: 25 Feb 2004
Posts: 334
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Super Mario
Joined: 27 May 2005
Posts: 1022
Location: Australia, previously China
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 4:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| Someone wrote that you can get a Z visa in Hong Kong to work in Jiangsu. Can you really? |
Unless things have changed, you can get a Z visa for most parts of China [leave out Tibet] in countries that have diplomatic relations with China [so they have an embassy] as long as you have the necessary papers.
I believe HK counts as "non-China" in this case.
Legions of FT's go on "visa runs" to HK.
Actually, you can get a Z visa within China now in more than a few places: Shanghai is one. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Roger
Joined: 19 Jan 2003
Posts: 9138
|
| Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 5:06 am Post subject: |
|
|
For the issuance of a work visa in Hong Kong, you have to go to the Chinese Visa Section of the Chinese Government in the Chinese Resources BUilding, Wanchai, 26, Harbour Road.
They do issue such visas but I don't have personal experience; it's other posters that mentioned they got their work visa from this office.
You can safely rule out any travel agent as a go-between! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
