Job Discussion Forums

[wilburnixon]

I have 5 years experience teaching ESL in Japan, am a single male and wanting to teaching in the Middle East. I am looking for general advice on obtaining a job in Saudi Arabia. It is safe to not live on a compound? What is the average length of vacation for language schools? Thank you in advance.

[Cleopatra]

Another of those posts which are too general to answer.

You don't give us any information on your qualifications, which makes it difficult to give you any specifics. If you don't have an MA in TESOL or Applied Linguistics, you are looking at one of the lousier jobs in a language school, where the pay and benefits wont' make it worth your while to relocate to KSA.

Yes, it's safe to live off-compound, but if you're working for a language school, the accomodation allowance is likely to be too paltry for you to afford anything decent. As for holidays, don't expect the 60-day summer breaks you'll get in tertiary institutions.

I suggest you do a search on this page. Language schools in KSA have been discussed several times before, and the consensus is fairly strong: avoid if at all possible.

[The_Prodiigy]

Extremely different life from living in Japan. In almost all areas to the detriment of your lifestyle, particularly as you are a single male.

Everything is segregated. Fraternization with females is strictly against the law, there are no cinemas and doing business during prayer times is suppressed.

Students' motivation is poor. Business organisation, planning and co-operation are woeful compared to Japan.

Average salaries are comparable to those available for first-timers in Japan but fewer possibilities to boost income from private lessons as socialising is considerable more restrictive in The Desert.

An exit visa is required to leave the country; employers frequently retain teachers' passports whilst issuing a local ID card.

There is a lot of sand.

[lionbrian]

I know it is very hard to make a decision like yours. What I can tell you is as follows:

Relocating from Japan to the Gulf area ain't a picnic. You will definitely go through a massive cultural shock. How long will it last? Only God knows? What I recommend is try to apply to jobs in the UAE, QATAR & OMAN where there are less restrictions and leave Saudi for next time, do your interviews, and if offered a decent job, DO A "FAMILIARIZATION TRIP" or a "GO & SEE TRIP�. Then decide.

Nobody can really help you out about your decision because we are all different, have different lifestyles and our objectives vary form one teacher to another. Factors like: Age, civil status, professionalism, character and so forth play important roles in any teacher's decision.

One thing I can tell you for sure is: In the Far East (Japan, South Korea & Taiwan), English teachers work mostly with westerners who usually are respected and given priorities (SPOILED). In the Gulf, you will be working with teachers from Sub-continents who really have a different vision about teaching. For instance, these teachers will do whatever it takes to keep their jobs due to the insecurity and the so called �native versus non-native syndrome�. In general, working with these people is not pleasant at all since they really create a �VERY HOSTILE ENVIRONMENT�. The other thing is �lifestyle�. In Japan or South Korea, for instance, Saki or Soju bars, restaurants are everywhere and there is always something & at anytime to do outside your home (Karaoke, social gathering with locals), whereas here life is limited. Then again, if you are a family man, a head-down teacher, a laid back one or simple a homey person, the Gulf may suit you, otherwise look for a job in South Korea, Taiwan, and Malaysia just for a change!

As in your case, a single man who is living in Japan for a long time, I am pretty sure that �the yellow fever effect� will seriously finish you off once in the Gulf unless you are not attracted to the beautiful, sexy and obedient Japanese & Korean girls. Here in the Gulf, the Asian women that you meet (Philippines, Thai, Chinese) are far less attractive that the Japanese and the Koreans. Also, the Japanese & Korean females are very independent, civilized, proud and drunk in their own culture and they are not interested in getting �WHITE VISAS� since they are wealthy in their home countries.

I do know that living in the Far East for a long time gets on you and you need a change! BUT what change? Moving from Japan to Saudi, in my opinion, ain�t a good idea!

JUST HELPING & REVEALING THE REALITY IN THE GULF!

[Cleopatra]

While I unfortunately can't comment on the unsolicited advice the last poster gave you on the availability (or otherwise) of suitably desperate, docile and "sexy" "yellow" women, something leads me to believe he is not terribly familiar with working in KSA.

[veiledsentiments]

I fear that Lionbrian is assuming that his experience at QP in Qatar is the 'usual' all over the Gulf, and it most definitely is NOT.

Few of my fellow EFL teachers were from the subcontinent, and those that were, were as often professionals as my fellow Westerners. (Or not...) Over the years, I have worked with many hard working dedicated teachers and professors who just happened to hold passports from India, Pakistan and Sri Lanka. And when they or Arabs or Egyptians get into positions of power, the same as the Brits or Americans or Aussies or whatever, they tend to give preference to their own. Is there racism in the Gulf? you bet... just like there is everywhere else in the world and from all sides.

But, I think Lionbrian has included some good advice to teachers coming from the other side of Asia. They need to know that they are stepping into a VERY different lifestyle. A visit first would be a good idea, but not exactly even in the realm of possibility for KSA.

VS

[lionbrian]

1) Dear Veil,

QP isn't my first experience in the Gulf, in fact, it was the last one (Just for your information!).

I do have friends (Westerners) who taught & are still teaching in the KSA, UAE, and Bahrain and roughly they all describe teaching English along with non-natives as BAD NEWS! For example, I know 2 or 3 who are presently teaching at KFUPM, ARAMCO, BAE and honestly they are super-happy. Why? These institutions (especially KFUPM) have a very strict policy NOT TO HIRE NON-NATIVE English teachers (You can double-check it with KSA long timers).

In the UAE (UAEU, HCT), it�s a mixed bag: Natives with Natives who have Arab ethnic background, fair enough!. In Oman, it is different since they can�t really attract natives with their low salaries; therefore they complete their lists with non-natives. But this in Oman is changing and most of the institutions (MoHE, HCT...) these days are requesting natives. All in all, there are places in the Gulf where they hire non-natives WITH REALLY LOWER SALARIES (KSA/UAE). Qatar is an exception since the EFL/ESL industry has just started, give to the Qataris a couple of years, and the hiring practice will be similar to their cousins in the KSA & UAE.

I am not against hiring non-native teachers at all if they teach subjects other than English! My point is leave English teaching jobs to people who are natives, lived and were educated in English speaking countries rather than hiring those who never been to these countries, graduated from their local universities. Teaching pronunciation/ conversation/ idioms/expressions/TOEFL/IELTS and the list goes on, in my opinion could be taught better by natives than non-natives .For example, in the case of TOEFL, I�d prefer to hire an American since the content of this test is typical American, IELTS: a European since this test is very British.

To conclude, I am not a racist!

2) Dear Cleopatra,

Please read my comments first before replying!

What I meant by doing a �go & see trip� NOT TO THE KSA since I am aware that this country doesn�t deliver tourist visas. I was talking about those countries which give to westerners� 3-month/ One month/21 day and 14 day -visit visa on arrival, for example, UAE/Oman/Qatar/Bahrain. As for my advice, I�d rather do a �familiarization trip� to these countries, test the water then decide rather than relocate & regret it later!

Again, this is only my opinion!

[Queen of Sheba]

[Stephen Jones]

I don't know if it is the girls, but we have never had anybody come to Saudi from Japan and stay.

[scot47]

As with Stephen I have not come across many with Japanese expereince who have stuck it in Saudi. One or two but not many. I know lots of people with Thai connections(residence, family etc) who have come to KSA and stayed long term.

[Bebsi]

[Van Norden]