Job Discussion Forums

[Michael In Tainan]

I recently returned to the US from a 4 year stint in Taiwan teaching English. I am starting a MA program in Linguistics with a TESL option. I plan on going back to Taiwan and get a university gig. However, I am toying with the idea of trying out the KSA. If this happens, it won't be for at least 2 more years.

I have read through most of the threads and gotten a general idea of teaching and living in KSA.

However some info has been kinda vague. Where do you think is the best place to find a decent gig in KSA? Also, how do single men deal with being single in KSA? Is having porn on your computer a stoning offense?

[Arab Strap]

"Is having porn on your computer a stoning offense?"

You're not serious are you?

Have you any idea about KSA at all?

[Michael In Tainan]

Yes, i am serious.

And no, I have no idea what the KSA is about. I have never been there. That's why I am asking

[Arab Strap]

Sorry one tends to forget that there are those out there who are not yet clued in on the Magic Kingdom.

Best bet would be not to bring a PC with you at all, your computer will be taken from you on entry and your hard disc will be thoroughly checked..................and that's just the start of it.

Saudi authorities are pretty arbitrary when it comes to deeming what is and what is not allowed in the country. For eg any magazines which include photos of couples kissing or female cleavage (bare neck) will be taken away. I could go on and on and on and on, check this forum and you'll find out more (one poster talks of a video of children's cartoons been put under scrutiny because there were some animated pigs sunbathing on a beach, I've also heard of Chritmas decorations being confiscated)

Suffice to say it's best to arrive with a change of underwear, a great deal of patience and an open mind................inshallah

[Stephen Jones]

They haven't got round to searching hard disks or pen disks yet.

CDs and DVDs are always sent to the back room though if they look like you've made the copy.

[Bebsi]

[Michael In Tainan]

Thanks for the info. I had a feeling that porn would not be allowed, but I wan't to make sure.
However, my question has not been answered: how do single men deal with being single in KSA?
And, what part of KSA is the best place to live/work? I know it is a subjective question, but i would like to hear some different opinions

Also, I understand that it is a different world and I am pretty able to cope with new and different environments. My main goals for checking out the KSA is the $$$ and the experience of living in a muslim country.

[Bebsi]

Fisrt thing: Read Stephen Jones excellent summary of the categories of jobs in KSA. You will find it under the thread "The Best of KSA".

Next item: It is impossible to advise on what it would be like as a single man in KSA. Your age, preferences and general dosposition would all have a bearing. How old are you? 25 or 55? Do you want a steady relationship with a girl and a quiet romantic nght in, or are you a party guy who wants to boogie every night and put himself about with the girls? Do you regularly use porn, or was your question born out of anticipation of a hermit-style existence?

Basically, you CAN meet women in KSA, but you should go either to Jeddah or to Dammam/Khobar/Dhahran, a conurbation on the east coast. Riyadh has a party scene too, but ONLY in select compounds.

Regarding what women are available, here is a summary. Forget the locals, they are out of bounds. Trying anything on could indeed have serious consequences. Western women are mosty married, so with the exception of maybe certain big-city compounds, forget that one.

There are many Asians in the Kingdom, especially Filipinas. Any single ones among them...and that is a lot, I believe...are not at all averse to having a western boyfriend. They are difficult to meet, but the two best ways are to either find an excuse to go to a hospital or clinic, where many of them work as nurses, or chat up some Filipino guys, and befriend them. They will then hopefully invite you to some of their private parties, where you will meet plenty nice girls. I haven't been involved in this scene myself (I'm not single), but friends who are single swear by it. Don't beat about the bush...be open with them. Tell them you'd like to meet some girls. They will understand your situation.

Indeed, so will the authorities, who will do nothing unless you are indiscreet. They are also human, and generally understand what it's like for a westerner in the country. If you don't make your activities obvious, there will be no problem. Force things out into the open, however, and they will have no choice but to act. The key is discretion: make sure all your activities are kept quiet, and always be respectful of local laws/customs. If you make no trouble, you will get none.

The other option is Bahrain, if you live in the eastern half of the country, and plan on getting a car. You can go there at weekends to drink as much booze as you want and meet plenty of girls, of all sorts of nationalities. You can also, while there, hire a "business-lady", as they are known, if you are particularly keen to have an "encounter" with a woman. One word of warning, however: you can only go to Bahrain on a regular basis if you have a multi-exit/re-entry visa. This must be approved by your sponsor (employer). Most of the reputable ones have no problem with this, e.g. KFUPM, JIC, and lately BAe/SDT. Not all sponsors are reputable however; indeed, many of them are far from such. These are the guys who generally have BIG objections to granting permission for the multi-visa. But then again, as they are the guys who also pay dreadful money and expect you to function in pretty appalling conditions, would you want to work for them anyway?

If you want any more info PM me. Please, however, give some more info about yourself and form specific questions, and I will attempt to answer them.

Before going to KSA, serious research is everything.

[EnglishBrian]

From a slightly unpromising start this has turned into a really useful thread. I may be over there myself in a few months and it's good to see some positive and helpful info on Saudi for potential new arrivals. Thanks everyone.

[scot47]

For a reasonable job in KSA you could try
BAE
SALTS
LOCKHEED
IPA
KFUPM
Jubail Industrial College

Avoid private language schools unless you REALLY need a job.

[Paul in Saudi]

I have found the customs checks to have become more and more pro forma. I have no trouble bringing in DVDs in my pockets and I have uncensored internet via an illegal satellite hookup.

Girls? Most Ethiopians here in Jeddah. Some Western nurses. Where there is a will there is a way.

I would say the party scene is collapsing as numbers go down. It seems everyone locks themselves in at night nowadays.

Computer seized at the frontier? News to me. I come and go with my laptop and have never had problems.

[Michael In Tainan]

Wow, I am pleasantly suprised with the amount of feed back and information. It seems that KSA is more multicultural than I had thought.

Thank you very much for the info. It will not be for at least a couple of years before I head out there. But this does give me more to think about.

Peace,
Michael

[Cleopatra]

[Bebsi]

My own experiences have been quite different to what Cleopatra says vis-a-vis getting invited to Saudi homes. I have made a number of Saudi friends and have been invited to the homes of quite a few of them, and they are without exception excellent hosts. On occasions indeed, when "whitey"is coming around to dinner, many other of their friends get invited too to meet the special guest. Invariably, their curiosity is good-natured and they ask lots of questions about our culture...I have even had Islamic clerics ask me lots of questions about Christianity and its practices. This was far from bigoted or hostile...they were genuinely fascinated and wanted to learn more. Intelligent conversation usually follows, with teh host or another guest doing the translations where necessary.

Frequently, if inviting a male guest to their home is impractical due to space, a majority of female family members etc, he will get invited instead to one of those gardens where they will entertain with Cardammom coffee, dates, tea, and a large meal.

It is true, however, that getting invited doesn't happen immediately...it takes time to win their trust and confidence. Many of my Saudi friends have asked me why westerners are so unfriendly and sometimes hostile to their culture. Certainly, their culture is very different and takes some getting used-to. Tragically, nowhere is the culture gap wider than in KSA. Many westerners, possibly as a result of bad experiences at the hands of a minority, distrust the locals and have become hostile. Some are, sadly, just bigoted and I will not question their motives for the hostility...it may be very personal or psychological.

It is also the case that women in KSA will find it much harder to get invited to a Saudi home...and if so, ONLY by ladies, and they will not get to meet the menfolk, any more than male guests get to meet the womenfolk. There are exceptions (including in my own experience), but the rule is as Cleopatra has described it. It is, as she says, not a religious thing as much as a Saudi cultural thing, shared to varying extents by other Gulf Arab states.

Essentially, I would say that the lack of cultural interaction owes a lot to unnecessary distrust and mutual wariness. This is a pity, as KSA can indeed be a fascinating cultural experience.

[Cleopatra]

Yes, bebsi, you are right about men - at least those who display the right attitude, I should stress - having some opportunity to make friends with local men and socialise with them. As a woman it is much more difficult, due to the fact that Saudi women's movements are limited, and their actions strictly monitored. I have been to many Saudi weddings - a fascinating experience - but in my three years here have only received ONE invite to a Saudi home, and that by a comparitively liberal young woman raised in the US.

Even so, however, while I do know of many ex-pat men who have socialised with their male colleagues or students, most of the time they met at cafes, or on picnics in the desert (or even at the side of the road!) rather than in people's homes, though I have occasionally heard of this happening too. Also, many better-off Saudis have homes or "farms" in the desert, and an invite to such places is a possibility. If you're male, that is!