Job Discussion Forums

NorbertRadd · Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2006 5:09 pm Post subject: SZIIT bait&switch

I left the Shenzhen Institute of Information Technology being owed RMB2000 and another FT RMB1000. I know that another teacher was less than unhappy. The FAO staff are liars and cheats. There's no cable TV and wages are RMB2000 below that of the RMB8000 standard in Shenzhen. Through incompetence, they held a teacher's passport and had him overstay his visa. The classes are chaos and there's constant last minute scheduling and the accomodation is full of fungus and mildew

tw · Joined: 04 Jun 2005 Posts: 3898

NorbertRadd · Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 4:33 am Post subject:

I came there from henan and took the first job i got, another teacher had just returned to china. the 3rd had his first job teaching adults and he recruited 4,5. i had planned to stay indefinitely and thought the situation would improve. never did

Lobster · Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 8:40 am Post subject:

Norbert:

Please be specific!

How did they cheat you?
What lies did they tell you?

And please, no complaints about last-minutes schedules, disorganized classes, old buildings or no cable TV. Please include something beyond SOP for China. The only valid point was that you are still owed 2,000 rmb. Please elaborate.

RED

NorbertRadd · Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 1:18 pm Post subject:

I was told my salary RMB6000, and USD1000 or a plane ticket at the end of a year and shown the accomodation. Some of the uni's here are very organized. SZIIT ain't and gives everyone a pass regardless if they show up for class. Please excuse me for not being specific

Lobster · Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2006 3:49 pm Post subject:

Eh? Still not clear.

They were supposed to pay you 6K a month but didn't? How much did they short you each month?

They didn't give you the airfare? Did they give you anything?

They showed you one apt. and then gave you another?

They didn't tell you they'd change grades? Did you discuss pass/fails?

What items in the contract you signed were not honoured?

RED

NorbertRadd · Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 3:13 am Post subject:

i left them being owed RMB2000. 4 of 5 teachers are dissatisfied.
don't work at the school.
if the word gets out on the bad schools, they'll have no workers and have to modify their behaviors.
lobster,you're not a troll, are you?

Lobster · Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2006 3:46 am Post subject:

No, Lobsters don't troll. If you want to come to a public forum and criticize a school by name and warn us about shady practices, it's important that you provide details about how your contract was broken. This is only fair.

I understand that you're unhappy, but why exactly? Many teachers complain about schools, and in some cases it's not the school's conduct, but the teachers' expectations, that are at the root of the problem. I am not saying that this is true in your case.

My questions are honest and simple, don't you think? If you really want to help your fellow FTs, you'll provide precise information for us to base our decisions on. And please just stick to your personal experiences.

RED

NorbertRadd · Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 12:11 am Post subject:

troll.
Teachers were underpaid and not paid.
visa overstayed through FAO negligence
troll.
or last word freak?

SheZook · Joined: 31 Jan 2006 Posts: 187

I'm sorry Norbert but I have to defend Lobster here - he is no troll! Certainly not in this case anyway. His questions were legitimate as your posts were not entirely clear. All he wanted was more information to try and understand your point of view - this is not trolling. Trolling would be more along the lines of calling someone a troll without just cause. Mad

Sgt Killjoy · Joined: 26 Jun 2004 Posts: 438

Teachers were cheated out of money, this is wrong. It's good enough for me and it sure is clear on how the contract was breached.

If you don't pay me, you have breached my contract or maybe Lobster is interested in working for free?

movinaround · Joined: 08 Jun 2006 Posts: 202

NorbertRadd · Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 4:31 am Post subject:

In Internet Forums
A person who enters unknown forums who bashes and insults forum members with unfounded arguments, or anyone that enters any sort of internet community for the sole purpose of harassing others is often referred to as a troll.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_trolls

Ger · Joined: 25 Feb 2004 Posts: 334

To the OP, it seems that you are experiencing "Chinese culture" first hand...

(see the last entry of the link cited below)
http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/job/viewtopic.php?p=429559#429559

you are also experiencing little help in addressing your problem by writing about it on this forum.

I wish there was something I could do for you, but there isn't. You will have to think of a way to get your salary from the school and execute the plan, otherwise you may have to put it down to loss.

I am glad that you posted the name of the school/college on this forum for the rest of us to see, so that we may be aware of the problem as you have experienced it and avoid the school if we so choose.

However, schools and colleges of the cheating sort are very sophisticated these days, as they use "agents" to hire teachers for them, and teachers are not told the name of the school until after they have signed a contract.

Therefore, in my view, blacklisting schools/colleges has only limited affect.

I hope I am not accused of "trolling".

Lobster · Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 6:19 am Post subject:

If you consider someone asking you for details of your complaint trolling, that doesn't even fit your Wikipedia definition. If you don't want to make any explanatory statements, and just condemn your school, that's ok too. My questions were simple, direct and easy enough to answer, and you chose to lambast me rather than answering them. This is a discussion forum, not a personal blog.

What do you want here Norbert? Sympathy? Advice? A place to vent? The opportunity to warn fellow FTs about a poor school? Whatever your objective, lashing out instead of giving an honest answer will not help you achieve it. There are usually two players in the problem scenarios that evolve here. One is the two-faced, double-crossing school that exploits and cheats hapless FTs, and the other is the culture-biased and difficult FT who cannot be pleased and has a fly-by-night, fly by the seat of the pants attitude.

Some, like Sgt. Killjoy, will accept your complaints at face value because you're a fellow foreigner and he's maybe ready to believe, perhaps due to personal experience, that schools are semi-criminal enterprises. Other people would like a little more information before they place a school on their personal blacklist.

So again I ask you to just quickly answer the relevant questions. Your answers will be the last word. I am not asking you to provide any proof, just clarification. You could also clarify whether your fellow teacher had to pay any fines as a result of the expired visa, and if so, how much was paid. Sorry if I'm disturbing you, as I'm sure you're not in the best frame of mind after the disappointing experience with this school.

If you look at the BIBS Beanstalk post here on this forum, you will se a very good example of how to post a complaint against a school.

RED