Job Discussion Forums

[MESL]

This is from a recent ad. Is all this true?








Things to Beware

It used to be very easy to get work in China and the government requirements for overseas teachers were very low. However, recently the government has made much stricter regulations about working here and in the last year the Chinese government has started to clamp down on illegal and improper workers (especially since the rumors that they caught quite a few smuggling drugs). We have heard of at least 30 or 40 cases of people being fined, deported, etc. for various reasons and that is just the few cases we�ve heard of. So, here are some things you should beware of before you come and work in China. Even if you don�t want to come and work with us I hope they are of some help.

1) Illegal Visas Many people are not aware that under Chinese law you are personally responsible for any illegal working, even if the company you work for arranged all your paperwork and you were unwittingly illegal. (Personally I have heard a number of stories of people thinking they are working legally then being fined because they were not and it also happened to me once at another school). Always make sure the company you work for can employ you as a Foreign Expert. Ask to see a copy of their permit to employ foreign experts and make sure the name on the permit matches the name of the school you are going to. Here are some points to beware about documentation.

--- You can only work at the company named on your documents. If a company employs you using their credentials then sends you to work at another private school you can be fined for working illegally. We have heard of a few cases where the fine was up to 5,000 Yuan (600 USD)

--- You can only be employed as a teacher if you get a foreign expert�s license. Some companies employ people using a different form of document called a work permit which is used for unskilled workers. Although you are permitted to work, it is still illegal to work as a teacher using a work permit and you can be fined for doing so.

--- Extended Tourist/Business Visas. Some companies work round the system by extending tourist or business visas to keep you in the country legally. However, it is very illegal to work on a tourist visa and they government has recently been quite hard on those they catch doing so, even if you didn�t know you were working illegally.

--- Working on a Student Visa. Some companies may get you a student visa for one year then send you to work on that. However, this is just the same as working illegally on a tourist visa and if you get caught you will not be able to study Chinese here if you decide later you want to.

2) Conflicting Messages on the Internet

Many people who have worked in China, but haven�t done so recently, may tell you how little the regulations are reinforced, not to worry about documentation processes etc. This was very true until August 2006 when the State Council passed an edict that new policies must be strictly enforced. The only places that may let you get away in bending the rules now are little backwater townships and counties that are in the middle of nowhere. Do not pay any attention to messages on the Internet from people who did their documentation before August 2006.

It also used to be true that recent graduates from university could come and work as teachers. This is no longer true, most cities insist on 3 years work experience while some insist on just 2 years.

3) Changing your Visa In-Country

It used to be possible to change a tourist or business visa into a work visa in country, which made it a lot less complicated to become employed here. However, this is NO LONGER POSSIBLE and work visas MUST be processed before arriving in China. Do not listen to any offer that tells you to come on a tourist visa and they will change it here, they are either doing something illegal or do not know the new policies and you are the person who will end up paying for it.

4) The Hong Kong Connection

It used to be possible to get a 6 or 12 month business visa in Hong Kong then people would work illegally in China using that. As of July 2006, this route is no longer possible. Do not listen to anyone who tells you to go to HK and get a business visa.

[WordUp]

Where is the add from? Please post a link.

Its pretty much true but not new news.. The reinforcements you are talking about also apply to schools as there are hefty fines to be paid for not following the appropriate application procedures for hiring foreign teachers and obtaining proper permissions and visas beforehand.

http://ChinaVisaService.org has a pretty good FAQ about just this..

[andrew_gz]

"It used to be possible to get a 6 or 12 month business visa in Hong Kong then people would work illegally in China using that. As of July 2006, this route is no longer possible. Do not listen to anyone who tells you to go to HK and get a business visa."

THIS would be new!
Is it true?

[no_exit]

Nothing new here.

Although it is somewhat misleading to state that you "MUST" get a visa before coming here. My school, for example, changes visas in country and is perfectly legal. Maybe it will become more difficult in the future, but for now we have no problem. We're not in a backwater little township either. Also misleading to say you HAVE to have 2 or 3 years of teaching experience to get a visa -- who verifies this "experience" afterall? Anyone can BS their resume ...

As has been said on this board again and again, "regulations" vary from province to province and even school to school. Take nothing as gospel, including this post.

[kev7161]

HOWEVER, don't come to China thinking everything is just easy as mooncake when it comes to paperwork, rules, and regulations. Don't come assuming your school will take care of everything and you can just lay back and wait for your job to begin. Check, double-check, ask questions, and don't take anything for granted. Even if the OP is not 100 percent, I would certainly think it has a lot of legitimacy.

[GS1981]

one thing I'm a bit confused about over the work visa: you have to get a 'state-approved' hospital to carry out the medical: so how can you get that done outside of China?

As for the minimum 2 years experience, I was told about that when I finished my TEFL course with Bell School earlier this year, but was also told this mainly applied to larger cities.

[andrew_gz]

I appreciate everyone's contributions.

I still maintain that the following would be "new". (if it were true)

"It used to be possible to get a 6 or 12 month business visa in Hong Kong then people would work illegally in China using that. As of July 2006, this route is no longer possible"

As most of you know, this is a "route" taken by many FTs (I am not suggesting this is right or wrong)

It has been routine for many years.
Specifically, has this changed or not?

[tw]

[GS1981]

tw> d'oh! thanks!

[MESL]

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Here's the link.

http://www.eslcafe.com/jobs/china/index.cgi?read=16458
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[Crippler]

Looks to me like Golden Apple is trying to pump their reputation and say they are the only ones in China following the rules......

[englishgibson]

OP, I'd say it's true...regulations haven't changed much...they've been enforced more than before...SAFEA employment agreements are also more often given out to FTs recently...without SAFEA there ain't no "foreign expert booklet" possible according to the regulations..

[andrew_gz]

Turns out the "route" is still open.