Job Discussion Forums

[Nicky_McG]

From this forum it is pretty clear that Madrid is the best place to find work. However from what I have read it is apparently pretty hard to live on a teacher's wage. To be honest the wages being quoted on the forum look like something you could survive on in Glasgow which, with the exception of rent (in some areas at least), I would guess would be a more expensive city than Madrid(as Scotland is generally more expensive than Spain).

So am I missing something or do other people have more expensive tastes than me? I understand that start up costs are going to be a lot but after that surely you can survive? Would it perhaps be easier to survive in a city like Valencia (despite the fact that work would be harder to find there)?

[Moore]

You can survive, the money isn't all that bad: what happens is that people get wiped out by summer and Christmas. Basically if you don't work you don't get paid and so if the students aren't around you can't work, and schools do not pay you over summer as they don't need you to keep you on as they know somebody will be along to take your job if you don't come back.

Summer's the killer: there's not a lot of work in July, almost none in August and you don't get your next pay packet until the end of September (if you're classes all re-started then which is far from guaranteed.

Many teachers get sick of this and leave for a country where schools do pay over summer. Basically because there are so many people who want to come here and work, and there are lots of illegals who jump at the chance of being able to earn money in Europe whatever the conditions so there is a really high turnover of teacher here, even for this profession.

The only way to get around this is to become an "autonomo" which means that you're basically freelance self-employed: you pay a monthly payment of 236 euros and in return for this you have the right to social security (dole) after a years work, which is about two thirds of your average monthly salary. Also your pay rates are a bit higher than contract rates at schools as they don't have to pay your social security (they often don't anyway, or say you only work a few hours a week for a lot less than your actual wage, obviously none at all for illegals, that's all straight in their pockets), so you can earn about 20 euros an hour instead of 15. If you work a full month of 80 hours then this is well worth it, but the downside is that you have to pay every single month, however much you earn. If you want to stay here long-term this is definitely the way forward.

The hourly wage for teaching is not bad here, but has gone down in real terms over the last few years by basically remaining static: schools still pay about 15 euros an hour (never ever accept anything lower than that) but prices here have gone up noticeably just in the three years I've been here.

It's a really good place though, and well worth being a bit skint to live in the sunniest capital in Europe with truly laid-back friendly people.

[stoth1972]

Well, it isn't much money. Most teachers I knew who lived in Madrid shared a flat with 2, 3, and sometimes 4 other people. I lived outside of Madrid (about 45 away by bus/train) and worked part time in Madrid and part time in the Aranjuez. The money I paid for a 2 bedroom in Aranjuez was about what most of my colleagues paid to share a 3 bedroom in the city.

Have you considered finding a smaller language academy where they'll guarantee you a set rate? Sometimes you'll find a place that only needs one reliable teacher, and it's typically in the smaller towns. Lower rent (fewer choices of places to rent, too) and lower cost of living make life a little bit more comparable to what you're use to.

[Moore]

I think the thing to remember is that Spain's really not a place you come to to earn money: you can basically get your beer money and the odd weekend away, but nothing spectacular. It's a place to relax and get on with learning a bit of Spanish, but to survive any sort of time here you need a second source of income.

Of course there are some people who run around all over the place working every hour god sends, but if you're going to put in that much effort (and it's a very hot place to put in that much effort) then you're much better off doing the same thing in Asia and earning decent cash for the same hours along with paid holidays that you can take in the cheap neighbouring counties in that region.

It's really very hard to save up much here because, as I mentioned, you get wiped out financially every summer.

[stoth1972]

Too true-it's all about the experience. Survival is just an incidental. If you want to live well in Spain, ESL is not the suggested avenue.

[MAP Magazine]

Hey Moore,

I disagree with you. These days (at least THIS summer) the demand for English teachers is quite high. Academies, agencies, and private students are definitely taking classes all summer long. Perhaps some academies end their contract before the summer, but if you put up fliers or advertise in a classified ads services, you will fill up quickly with classes for sure.

Later gator,

Phil

[Moore]

quote: "Academies, agencies, and private students are definitely taking classes all summer long. Perhaps some academies end their contract before the summer, but if you put up fliers or advertise in a classified ads services, you will fill up quickly with classes for sure. "

-That's not entirely true Phil: it is possible for someone who's been here for a while and is already established to stretch out hours until the end of July with a lot of luck, but I defy anybody to get anything like the same number of hours in August as in the rest of the year. Maybe with a lot of messing about an enterprising person can get a few odd private lessons to slow down the money haemorrhage, but that's just August, then you've got to wait to the end of September for your first pay package: that's two months.

I'm not trying to prove a point here, and certainly don't want to discourage people, but I am just reporting what I see and have experienced. Forewarned is forearmed etc.

[MAP Magazine]

Fair enough. I have been living in Spain for five years now, and I have taught throughout August. I'm am definitely enterprising, but I don't know how much that has to do with it. I don't think it's such a big effort to hang up some fliers or scan classified ads looking for work.

One good idea is to rent someone's office space for the month of August, and offer your own one-month intensive course.

Just some ideas from personal experience.

Later gators,

Phil

[LitlMina]

I don't think it's difficult for a single person to live on a teacher's salary in Madrid. Can you buy new clothes every two weeks? Probably not... Go out to eat every night? Maybe not...
I really enjoyed teaching because what you make is directly related to how much you work. I only worked 4 days a week, so I didn't make as much money as I could have made if I had worked Fridays and occasional Saturdays, but I enjoyed all my three-day weekends. If you want to have more spending money, just pick up an extra class, it's that easy.
With student loans to worry about, money was a big concern for me, especially after dropping all that money for a TEFL course. But after the first month (ie, as soon as I started to get paid) I was completely financially independent from my US accounts - no credit cards, no debit cards, nothing.
You can make it in Madrid on just a teacher's salary, don't sweat it.

[HollyC]

My advice is to find a good school that pays well. I was there for a year from last year to this year March and when I first worked...the hours were really good...then came summer and the school was closed in August, which I didn't know that schools closed in August because when I got hired, nothing was mentioned. Thank goodness I saved up money..but then the school decided to close in Sept. as well. that was hard. I basically had enough money to pay rent and bills, but I didn't go out at all. Once in a while I could go out to small tapas bars, but no heavy partying. It was a great cultural experience though. Not partying was no big deal to me so I guess it depends on what you want to get out your experience there. Good Luck.

[-Stu-]

Can someone give me a breakdown of the cost of living in Madrid? We're a couple looking for a fairly nice apartment, in a good area, but generally live life pretty frugally. Any info is appreciated.

[Moore]

This is part of what I wrote in a thread sometime last year: someone had written in asking about the prices of a (rather odd) selection of things in Madrid...

Cable or satellite TV: 49/month cable TV inlcuding 1 mega internet

WiFi:

Toothpaste: 2 euros

Dental cleaning: not a big European thing

Bottle of wine: 3 euros and up for very acceptable Rioja

A pound of bananas: (no idea how pounds work)

A jar of peanut butter: never seen it here, best bring some

Loaf of bread: 2 euros

Pound of pork chops: 4 medium size around 4 euros

Bag of flour: never use it

Bottle of Extra Virgin Olive Oil: 3 euros

Pack of generic cigarettes: 2 euros for cheapo, 2.80 for brands

15" TV: 100 euros


Probably should include some more useful categories...

Months rent in shared flat: 350 plus bills

Spirit plus mixer in bar: 6 euros

Months metro pass (Madrid, zone A): 35 euros-ish

Night in cheapo private room in hostal, no bath: 20 euros

Lunchtime restaurant menu (inc. wine): 10-12 euros

Evening meal with wine: 20 euros and up

Very small studio flat (Madrid): 700 euros/month

Averaged out shopping basket (Champion supermarket): roughly 1 euro per item

Mobile phone (pay as you go): 60 euros, usually inlcuding a bit of credit

Monthly mobile phone bill: around fifty euros (mine averages out at 120 though)

Can of Coke etc.: 80 cents

Bottle of beer ("Forty"): 1.20

Airline ticket to London (return): 150 euros if you look around

[-Stu-]

Thanks for that. It seems that accomodation is really expensive.

[tim hortons man]

Generally speaking living on a teachers salary (1200 or so a month) means a flat share. You won't find anything much under a 1000 or month. I just finished (yeah) my TEFL at Ttmadrid and every teacher I've talked to is in a flat share. Rates are around 30 to 400 a month so it leaves you enough to live on but it means living with strangers. On the other hand the next group to do the TEFL were 3 americians planning on sharing an appartment (boy girl freined and friend) so for them they can rent a place between them.

Generally speaking after living in Germany for 7 years I find (outsie of housing) the cost of living to be about 30% lower. Metro is dirt cheap food and utilties are much cheaper. The only two things that are more expensive are rent and parking tickets (a major ouch at 90 euros!!!!)

[jonniboy]

To be honest I really don't know why people bother to make the trek to Madrid given those salaries and rents. When I worked in Valencia last year a flat share cost between 100 and 150 euros a month, own flat available from 350 euros. Teachers salary was lower than in Madrid about 1000 a month but factor in the lower rent, smaller city meaning less metro journeys, cheaper food and drink (1.50 a beer, 6 euro for a menu del dia) and teachers probably come out better. That's even before you consider the other advantages like better weather, beach and less tourists.