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Seibu
Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Posts: 65
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 Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 3:39 am Post subject: The crazy world of Japanese work visas |
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I have a question concerning work visas and would appreciate some honest opinions and information.
I am currently in the process of trying to get myself back to Japan but am having some problems figuring out the best way to go about it.
I'm interested in getting a job with either a newspaper or Japanese company as a writer/copy editor, etc. I lived in Japan previously for 4 years working for a Japanese company. Unfortunately, I've allowed my work visa to expire.
I was just in Japan last month and interviewed with an employment agency. They seemed interested in hiring me but once they found out I didn't have a visa...told me there was nothing they could do. They do not sponsor employees.
They told me - unofficially - that the only way to get back into Japan was to get on with an English school (the big ones) and obtain a work visa that way. They weren't openly endorsing it...just saying 'if I were you'.
I don't really want to cheat an English school out of a work visa but am not really that pumped about teaching English.
Is there any way to get around this?
What would happen if I just arrived in Japan without a visa, started applying around and then just waited to get approved? Do you still have to leave the country?
How common is it for new recruits to simply not show up for their jobs at ECC, Aeon, etc? |
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JimDunlop2
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Posts: 2286
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:02 am Post subject: |
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I'd have alarm bells going off on this one. Of course they do not sponsor visas, because they CAN'T. They are not your employer -- they are merely pimping out to companies.....
This company that you are so enthused about is encouraging you (and others) to break Japanese law. They should actually be reported to the authorities. (AND to the big English schools whose employees they are actively being encouraging to hose the hand that feeds them in favour of another job).
First of all, if you are going to be doing a copy editing position or working for a newspaper, you cannot have the same work visa as the kind you get for working for one of the major English schools.
Second of all, you should consider applying to companies directly rather than going through a pimping agency. I don't even want to get into the myriad of reasons why it's better to do so, but employment agencies are generally BAD news, regardless of which country they are operating in. |
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Seibu
Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Posts: 65
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 7:27 am Post subject: |
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Jim,
Thanks for the reply.
I should point out, the company I am mainly interested in working for referred me to this employment agency. It seems the gaijin employees created a union a few years ago forcing the company to hire though this agency. This agency, by the way, is one of the largest and most reputable in Japan.
I'm under the impression this is a more common practice than one would think.
But again, I am more interested in arriving sans visa and landing one the legal way. Not sure how fruitful that approach would be. |
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c-way
Joined: 19 Nov 2004
Posts: 226
Location: Kyoto, Japan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 8:27 am Post subject: |
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I myself have done what you are contemplating and I also think you may run into some trouble.
I got my 'Specialist in Humanities Visa', being sponsored by a small crappy eikawa that treated me like an automaton. So I left them as soon as I could and found a job at a high school.
However, bc/ the type of work is technically different, I had to change the status of my visa from 'Specialist in Humanities' to an 'Instructor' visa.
The problem I think your going to have is that if your employment agency won't sponsor you for a visa, they might also be reluctant to sponsor you for a change of status. The reason I say this is because the process is basically the same, in that they will have to provide you with the same paperwork to take to the immigration bureau to obtain your change of status.
And I just want to mention, although if you have been here 4 years you probably know, that the idea of a company 'sponsoring' a foreigner for a visa is a bit of a misnomer. Really all a company is doing is vouching that the foreigner will have a steady and legitimate form of employment that will allow the foreigner to pay taxes and living expenses. If you have the contracts to show you are going to be teaching private lessons and those lessons will account for a certain amount of income, you can sponsor yourself (So, I've been told. If not correct, someone more experienced please post.)
Because of this, I have to wonder why a company that hires foreigners is not willig to 'sponsor' your visa. Could it be because they do not want to obligate themselves to hiring anyone.
And if I can hijack this thread a bit to ask other posters. Why are some companies so weary of going through the visa process? Not having one was a deal breaker at some companies I talked to, and when a company finally did give me 'sponsorship', they acted like it was a map to the holy grail. Any thoughts are appreciated. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 8:32 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| I'm interested in getting a job with either a newspaper or Japanese company as a writer/copy editor, etc. I lived in Japan previously for 4 years working for a Japanese company. |
Was this your previous company? I suspect not, so that is how I will treat this answer.
How is your Japanese? To work for such places full-time, you are going to have to deal with Japanese staff. Also, what are your credentials? Any experience in doing this line of work? If not, don't expect many replies.
An employment agency probably won't be the most ideal outfit to go to in order to get a work visa sponsored, so I can understand their turning you down. Telling you to get a work visa for a different line of work, however, then changing jobs, is not something they know anything about. Work visas are issued for specific purposes, and the sponsor is usually your employer. Oh, sure, you can quit anytime and look for other work, but it has to be under the same line as the visa is sponsored for.
According to MOFA's visa web page, the Humanities Specialist work visa allows the following kind of work:
| Quote: |
| The applicant is to engage in translation, interpretation, language instruction, public relations, advertising, overseas transactions, fashion or interior design, product development, or other similar work. |
Nothing here about copy editing or journalism, but you might find a willing immigration officer who will use "other similar work" to fill the bill. It's a chance you have to take, so technically speaking, you can try to get this visa for an English teaching job, then bail out and work as a journalist/copy editor (if the employer thinks you are qualified). Risky.
If this part of the visa requirements don't get past immigration, then you will have to show 10 years of work experience, I think, whether for the same type of visa or a Skilled Labor work visa.
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| What would happen if I just arrived in Japan without a visa, started applying around and then just waited to get approved? Do you still have to leave the country? |
If an employer is willing to sponsor you for a work visa, he and you will file the paperwork, and if the preliminary examination by immigration is all right, you should get a temporary "visa pending" stamp in your passport that allows you to work. Slightly risky, but legal. When the visa finally arrives, you return to immigration, pay your 4000 yen for the stamp, and you are officially issued the visa. You don't have to leave the country. (Some cases of being required to leave might come up, but I have not heard of many in a couple of years.)
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| How common is it for new recruits to simply not show up for their jobs at ECC, Aeon, etc? |
Not common, but it happens. Those that do show up have an average lifespan of 6-8 months anyway. This is one reason one of the Big Four (AEON?) requires a deposit of a few hundred dollars before you get your visa. When you show up, it is refunded. |
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yamanote senbei
Joined: 28 Jun 2005
Posts: 435
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 10:27 am Post subject: |
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| Seibu wrote: |
| I should point out, the company I am mainly interested in working for referred me to this employment agency. It seems the gaijin employees created a union a few years ago forcing the company to hire though this agency. This agency, by the way, is one of the largest and most reputable in Japan. |
All three of these sentences are more than somewhat suspect. |
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taikibansei
Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Posts: 811
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:48 am Post subject: |
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| yamanote senbei wrote: |
| All three of these sentences are more than somewhat suspect. |
To expand upon yamanote senbei's comment above:
| Seibu wrote: |
| This agency, by the way, is one of the largest and most reputable in Japan. |
There is no such thing as a "reputable" employment\dispatch company in Japan. The fact that they ask you to do something unethical (cheat on the sponsoring eikaiwa) and illegal (try to get work not covered by the original visa) should be a red flag. Note as well that if they're not going to sponsor your visa, they're probably not going to help you change the visa later.
| Seibu wrote: |
| I should point out, the company I am mainly interested in working for referred me to this employment agency. It seems the gaijin employees created a union a few years ago forcing the company to hire though this agency. |
"Gaijin" ( ) employees in Japan almost invariably form unions as a last resort in response to exploitive working conditions. The fact that your dream company is trying to hire underqualified "scabs" illegally (wrong visa), at a lower salary, and without union protection or benefits reinforces this impression.
| Seibu wrote: |
| I'm interested in getting a job with either a newspaper or Japanese company as a writer/copy editor, etc. |
While there is a lot of freelance work available in these areas, you'll have a difficult time finding legitimate full-time employment unless you're extremely qualified. For example, most foreign journalists (and they're not too many) working in Japan are sent over by their sponsoring papers--i.e., they were hired overseas. The two foreigners I know hired in Japan who are working as full-time journalists both had ikkyu-level Japanese and 5+ years of experience as journalists in the States.
Still, good luck. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 12:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| The two foreigners I know hired in Japan who are working as full-time journalists both had ikkyu-level Japanese and 5+ years of experience as journalists in the States. |
So much for my guess at needing 10 years of experience. Taikibansei, do you happen to know what sort of visa these people were on to get their jobs? |
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taikibansei
Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Posts: 811
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Glenski wrote: |
| So much for my guess at needing 10 years of experience. Taikibansei, do you happen to know what sort of visa these people were on to get their jobs? |
They're both married to Japanese, so probably spouse visas. Still, there is a journalist visa category as well. |
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Seibu
Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Posts: 65
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks very much for the helpful responses. I'll be adding tothis thread, I'm sure, as my efforts continue.
Just one thing, I found this comment rather funny....
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The two foreigners I know hired in Japan who are working as full-time journalists both had ikkyu-level Japanese and 5+ years of experience as journalists in the States.
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I have three very close friends working for two of the most recognizable newspapers in Japan and one for Associated Press. None of them can speak Japanese worth a flip....even after 10+ years in country.
But they can write like a son-of-a-gun.
We'll see how it goes. |
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taikibansei
Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Posts: 811
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2006 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Seibu wrote: |
| I have three very close friends working for two of the most recognizable newspapers in Japan and one for Associated Press. None of them can speak Japanese worth a flip....even after 10+ years in country. |
The Associated Press is not a Japanese news service (the equivalent company in Japan is Kyodo Tsushinsha--sometimes referred to as "Kyoudo Nyu-zu"). Hence, your friend working for AP (assuming he/she is full-time and sponsored) most likely falls under the "hired overseas" category I mentioned (and has a journalist visa). This, again as I explained quite clearly, is the most common type of non Japanese journalist in this country, and no, they wouldn't have to speak Japanese. (They do, however, need to be able to get hired full-time by a major overseas paper with a presence in Japan.)
The only "recognizable" newspapers in Japan are Japanese papers with no need for full-time, English-only staff. If you're talking about the tiny niche market of working for their English-language offshoots, outside of the Japan Times, these papers do not normally hire foreigners full-time with sponsorship. One reason for this is that, again outside of the Japan Times, there's very little need for someone who "can write like a son-of-a-gun" --over 90% of the text is either lifted directly from overseas papers or a translation of the Japanese parent paper done in-house by Japanese staff (and proofread by usually part-time foreign staff).
My friends work as reporters for Kyodo Tsushinsha and the Japan Times respectively. Both those places do hire full-time and sponsor, though the qualifications for being a writer and/or reporter are as I've stated. (They do sometimes hire English-only proofreaders part-time, who if they're lucky and good can become full-time and sponsored--is this what you're talking about?!)
Your only other options are to work part-time as a proofreader for one of the other places (e.g., Asahi Evening News) until one of the very few full-time slots become available. Good luck there. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 12:21 am Post subject: |
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taikibansei wrote:
| Quote: |
| They're both married to Japanese, so probably spouse visas. Still, there is a journalist visa category as well. |
Thanks. I was hoping they were on journalist visas because the MOFA site curiously doesn't state what sort of experience is needed for that one category. Sigh.
Gotta agree with what you wrote about wanting find that "niche" for English newspapers here. Not a heckuva lot of them. Even in The Japan Times, you have columns with contributions once a week by foreigners with original articles. I don't believe those are full-time jobs. Heck, one of them is by a university teacher, so I know it isn't.
Seibu wrote:
| Quote: |
I have three very close friends working for two of the most recognizable newspapers in Japan and one for Associated Press. None of them can speak Japanese worth a flip....even after 10+ years in country.
But they can write like a son-of-a-gun. |
And, just what is their visa status? More appropriately, what was it in order to get hired there? And, are they full-time? |
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yamanote senbei
Joined: 28 Jun 2005
Posts: 435
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| Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 2:08 am Post subject: |
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| Journalist status of residence is limited to those working for foreign journalistic organizations. |
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