Job Discussion Forums

[sheeba]

Do you have Gay students who open up in class - talk about boyfriends/girlfriends and so on. I'm not sure if a couple of my students are getting the gender case wrong or that they are feeling fine about talking about their sexuality. It's cool to me . In fact the students that keep talking about their boyfriends are very talkative in class- probably my best students. Just wondered if you experienced this too ?

[Shan-Shan]

I had a 16 year student who was certainly gay, though did not say so directly. The obvious indicators were:

* his overt fondness of Tom Cruise, and musings about what it would be like to kiss him


* while doing a "Crime Scene Re-enactment" performance, the student surmised that the murder victim, male, died because he was caught in bed with another man by his boyfriend. You can imagine how the scene was played out with another male student in class much to the amusement of the shy, straight classmates


One of the better students I've had the pleasure of teaching.

[daodejing]

Chinese often confuse he and she (his & her, him & her), because they're the same pronunciation in Chinese. Boy & girl, or boyfriend & girlfriend, are harder to confuse, though.

[cj750]

[KarenB]

Yes, "ta" is the Chinese word for both he and she, so it's hard for them to remember that it's 2 different words in English.

My gay students never talk about their sexuality in class (although I've only had 2 that I know of). One was still in the closet and only spoke about it privately in his journal (which he gave me to read) and the other had such terrible English she never expressed herself on anything in English, but I'm pretty sure she didn't discuss it in Chinese either -- even though she was pretty out.

[patsy]

There are a lot of gay women at the hunan women's college. One girl came over to my house and showed me her "favorite" video on her mp3 player which was some music video with dozens of naked women. Then she asked me if I thought she made a good "boy". Then she wanted to know if gays could marry in the states. Then she told me there are many like her at this school.. What's really wild is that she lives most of the time with a teacher who she's in love with. After being in Qinghai for so long, I was really surprised at the openess here. Actually she was really friendly, but I think maybe she thought i was gay, when I told her I wasn't , she stopped coming over.

[Hendahu]

Yeah, don't let the pronouns fool you. Even good english speakers here still have problems with He and She. If you alert them, they will correct it...i.e....You said she, do you have a girlfriend?.....That will give you a better understanding. The kissing thing is not so clear either. Many of my students use sexually confusing language due to their inexperience and affection expression is very different here than the states, so the language is not the best barometer of sexuality.

[Steppenwolf]

I don't think it is helpful for us to know that Chinese confuse "he" with "she" due to these pronouns being perfectly homophonous in Chinese; the true reason is that these English speakers don't master ENGLISH well enough as to dispense with translating from their mother tongue.

As for homosexuality, appearances can be deceiving. I have seen gays meeting in public parks in Shanghai but I do not believe any two members of the same gender holding hands or fondling each other are by necessity homo; in fact it is very common for Chinese to even share beds with members of their own gender without so much as wasting a single thought on carnal pleasures.

[tofuman]

Those of you who think your gaydar is so wonderful, it might be malfunctioning. Body language, etc. here is often very misleading. Unless you have caught your "gay" students abominating one another, I doubt that you know much about their sexuality.

[Leon Purvis]

I find this a bizarre topic for professional teachers. How and why would anyone become involved in discussions about the sexuality of his students WITH his students?

If a female student were to try to discuss her heterosexual desires/challenges/problems/whatever with me, I would discourage it, and I am sure that any sane discourse on ethical and professional behavior would support my stance.

I am equally sure that it would support the same stance toward homosexual students.

Unless one is a clinical psychologist and is hired to counsel students, he should stay the h*ll away from such discussions with students. It crosses the line of propriety in America and it is WAY out of bounds in China.

[kev7161]

I disagree . . . to a degree. Often a teacher's role is many and varied: parent, doctor, disciplinarian, and even psychologist. Sure, some kids could be trying to "come on" to their teacher, esp. if he/she were a young, good-looking westerner. But the more likely scenario is that these kids may feel that their western teacher is the only one they CAN talk to without fear of ridicule or reprisal. I"m fairly certain that a majority can't or won't talk to their parents about it and it's also quite likely they won't confide in their friends. In American high schools, a teacher can be a good sounding board for a lot of adolescent problems and worries. Just because the discussion is about homoSEXUALity does not mean it's sexual in nature.

I wanted to add a couple more comments if you'd be so kind as to indulge me: If a student (male or female) comes to you as a confidant with any sort of sexual-related problems: a communicable disease, unwanted pregnancy, a "crush" on a certain boy or girl, etc. you, as the teacher, have a certain amount of responsibility, even in China. If it's a MAJOR issue, such as a pregnancy, for example, then you need to reassure the troubled teen, then hotfoot it to your FAO or someone for advice of your own. You'll want to be discreet, of course, but this is probably something beyond your capabilities. If it's something more "simple", such as sexual identity, then most capable, professional, intelligent adults can offer some sort of comforting words of wisdom. If you, as your own personal beliefs, are opposed to homosexuality, then I think you can surely extricate yourself from the conversation without crushing the other's spirit.

AND, if you are a reasonably intelligent adult, if/when you feel a student is coming on to you, you should be able to nip that in the bud fairly quickly. THEY are the ones with raging hormones, not you. You can control yourself, right?

[sheeba]

[Leon Purvis]

Sheba,

I'm not seeing gay students (or hetero students for that matter) "opening up" at all where I am, and I am far from the sticks. To allow any conversation (classroom or otherwise) to veer into sexual territory is unthinkable. If a teacher allows a student to "open up" sexually to him, he is asking for trouble, whether the teacher is a man or a woman, regardless of the students' sex and gender orientation.

The subject header of your post certainly suggests more than a teacher's casual observation of students' behavior. How would a teacher be able to answer the question you pose, "How are your gay students doing?" unless he were to engage in, to allow or to encourage such a discussion?

But then, maybe I should be a little more open-minded. Perhaps I should encourage my male students to open up about their culturally-enforced celibate lives. They deserve equal sympathy. What do you think?

[sheeba]

Hey Leon,

When a student (boy) starts talking about his boyfriend to another student (is what happened in my class) then there is little I can do . I'm not going to say 'Stop' as if they are doing something that isn't allowed in my class. It was brief and I don't actually think anybody in my class gave a hoot - most of them didn't even understand. He talked about his previos failures with girls and introduced his new partner(verbally) .

Another male student talks to me (not other students) about his boyfriend but he cares less of everyone around him clocking what he is talking about .

I don't pass judgement, I don't stop them from talking in my class. It's a bit like a drugs argument I have had on the general discussion board some time back. Some teachers want to stamp out these subjects in class but if dealt with sensitively I don't see any problem with letting students express their feelings. I just carefully listen and move things on if appropriate.

I don't need to encourage my students to talk about the subject to know that they are gay and I have my own feelings about all of my students whatever their sexuality is. I have only made the observation that those that I know are gay are two of the best English speakers that I have come accross this semester.[/quote]

[Leon Purvis]

Sheeba,

Good luck.