Job Discussion Forums

[Grenouille]

Hi everybody,
I've just registered here and this is my first posting, although I've been reading these forums for at least the past 6 months. I've completed a TESOL course in Australia and I'm off to teach in either the Czech Republic or Russia, depending on what offer comes through first However, I really need some help with working in the Czech Republic, as a school there has offered me work, but not on contract. They are offering me their lawyer to organise a Zivnostensky list, so I will basically be working for myself, paying my own taxes etc. While I'm familiar with running a small business in Australia, I'm not sure how I'd go in the Czech Republic. I'm not really concerned about the lack of contract, I figure I will just move on if enough work doesn't come in. I'm an independent 40 year old woman who's not really afraid of much in life. So I would see it as a good challenge. I'm just looking for some advice about working this way as opposed to working within a contract.

I've also read somewhere that I would need an accountant to help me with my monthly taxation payments, social payments etc, but I have no idea of what this will cost, or if I could actually do this myself. If anyone can offer me some advice I would be extremely grateful as I would really like to make a decision soon so I can get on with planning my departure. Thank you all in advance.
Kind regards,
Grenouille

[spiral78]

I must say immediately that I �an't help substantially here - while I live half the year in the Czech Rep, I now work for a Canadian uni and I don't know about the rate of taxes and health care payments for a foreigner working as a private individual. I worked under contract in Prague for the two years I lived in the city.

Chris Westergard may have more apt info, hopefully he's in the office today?!

But two points that may be at least somewhat relevant:

Most importantly, while there is a strong supply of teachers in Prague, there is also work to be had, especially for those who appear (and prove to be) professional and responsible adults. The offer you've received sounds a bit shady to me.

First, it is not common to land any kind of job offer from outside the country. This is true throughout Europe. It's because so many employers were burned in the past, with staff who never showed up, or proved to have misrepresented themselves when they did. Normally, the better schools want to see you standing in their offices, nicely dressed, CV in hand, before you will get any serious consideration. So, it seems shady to me that a school would offer you a job without having first met you. Possibly it's all ok, but it's not really standard procedure.

Secondly, offering you work as a self-employed foreigner means that the school is not officially responsible for you in any way. It's not just working papers that you would need - you will also need some legal residency documents. It's all doable, but unless the job pays above the average, my personal opinion is that going through the hassle of getting all the paperwork sorted out yourself is not likely that feasible. Unless you speak Czech!! I think the language barrier would be a big stumbling block.

Usually, it's really best to just come to the country with some savings (count on living without pay for two to three months - language schools generally pay monthly, at the end of the month worked, and landlords usually want one month's rent in advance + one month as a deposit). You can then make the contacts you need to make for yourself and pick and choose a situation that will really work for you.

[Grenouille]

Thank you very much, spiral78, for taking the time to reply. What you've given me is extremely helpful. I'm in two minds about the offer, and the more info I can get will help me make the right decision. With regards to the residency document requirements, the school has said that they can 'assist' me with finding an apartment and obtaining the required residency documents. I don't think that the job pays above average, from the research that I've done over the past couple of months (250 crowns per 60 minutes lesson). And no, I don't speak Czech (yet!), but the school assures me that they will offer all assistance required.

I have no objection to coming to the country with some savings and attending the schools personally to be interviewed, and I'm starting to think that this will be the best option for me. Of course, I would then be needing help from someone in finding an apartment as I could not do this alone (I wouldn't know where to start).

Perhaps someone could tell me how practical it would be to do this in January, considering it's not the beginning of the school year. Will schools be willing to contract me for 6 months in this case? Anyone with anything to add will be most welcome

[spiral78]

January is not a bad time to start. There is always some percentage of teachers who don't show up again after the Christmas break.

You're right about the job not paying above average, and I still think it's rather shady that they are willing to hire from overseas; it could indicate that they are desperate for staff, and in Prague that would be a red light - there are a lot of teachers around.

All the better schools will offer Czech lessons, assistance in finding housing, and help with the official paperwork. This is standard. They should also pay for your city travel pass, as you'll be spending a lot of time traveling to your students, in most cases.

One option would be to come to the city with a temporary apartment lined up (I will try to find a contact for you in the next day or two - the apartments I mean are privately owned, and used as holiday rentals. but if you come in an off season, you can sometimes get one at a reasonable rate for two to four weeks, and it's nice because you can line this up in advance. the 'reasonable rate' is, of course, more than an English teacher is going to be able to afford long-term, but much cheaper than a hotel and nicer than a hostel). I don't have a contact handy here, but I think I may be able to find one, and if so, I'll post it for you. I did this myself three years ago, over January and February, and while it wasn't cheap, it wasn't prohibitive either, and it gave me time to look around for something appropriate.

[Grenouille]

Thanks again, spiral78. Although I think I may have misled you by ommission. The school in question isn't in Prague, it's in Plzen. I'm not sure if that will make any difference to the whole situation but I'm guessing not. And yes, I do believe that they are desperate for teachers. I just don't think I can justify paying a lot of money for the Zivnostensky list (possibly up to 19000 CZK for everthing organised by the lawyer, according to the school), and still not having a guarantee of anything, including a job !

Having a temporary apartment in Prague would be fantastic for my arrival and the first couple of weeks. If you are able to offer me a contact there I will be eternally grateful to you. If it helps, I plan to land in Prague in the first week in January. I've started sending off my CV to schools there, and have received a couple of invitations to attend interviews once I'm actually there, so I have some hope that I'll succeed in finding work.

Thanks again for your interest in my situation, and for your advice. Keep in touch.
Grenouille

[spiral78]

I wasn't aware of the current cost of the list - but that's extremely shady!! Unless the school is going to pick up the tab, I would certainly decline on that basis alone. They're quite likely trying to scam you, assuming that because you are far away, you don't know that you have no need to pay for this paperwork at all to live and work here. In fact, now that I think of it, I wonder how much of that cost is lawyer's fees, and what connections the school and lawyer have - but again, this may be totally innocent. The sure thing is that it's not the best approach for a newbie to the country.

I have friends who work independently. The paperwork process is pretty intensive. It is worth it if you are going to work directly for some company (or companies) - these positions are generally higher-paid because there is no language school in the middle. But the fact is that to get positions like this, you need connections and contacts and local references. Your SECOND year in the CR, if you like it here, this MIGHT prove to be a feasible approach. But it's just not the best way to come and start.

Will try to post contact for apartments in the next few days. cau

[Chris Westergaard]

19,000 seems about right to have everything done for you. If they are actually paying you to get this done then that is great. For some reason it seems very strange though. One, it takes about 5 months or so to get a Zivno and I really can't think of the motivation for a school to do it all for you. I can understand getting a visa, but the Zivno seems strange. If they are actually doing it, then I would for sure accept.

In regards to taxes and health care, to have a Zivno (to actual complete the process) requires you to have health insurance. So most likely the school in question will have to help you with that. I don't know if you need a monthly accountant, but for the most part, it should not be much money at all to hire one. I think you will be fine, but make sure the school will actually do this.

[spiral78]

I have been assuming that Grenoille would be obliged to pay the 19,000., not the school.

[Grenouille]

spiral78, thanks again for your input. No, the school is not picking up the tab, all costs are payable in full by me. They've given me a breakdown of the costs, including the lawyers cut, and I've compared this to a similar service someone offers (I found on a website somewhere), and it compares well. I've been told that the lawyer is a friend of someone at the school, and because of this I am getting a good deal (which I'm not really because the quote from the website I found was pretty much the same). I agree with you that it's probably best to work on contract for the first year or so, as there's always the chance that I won't like it there (slim, but a possibility). All in all, it's a lot of money to be 'behind' before I've even started working.

Chris, welcome and thanks for your advice, too. As I've just replied to spiral78, no, they're not paying for it, I am (potentially ). If they were paying, the decision would be easier to make. They've said it would take 2-3 months to get it all organised, so by the time I arrive in January everything should just about have been taken care of. They've stated that they have more than enough work (they've just taken on a new teacher from the States and I'm waiting to hear back from them for his contact details because I want to ask him some questions about his experience with all this before I commit to anything). They did say that they could put me in touch with a tax adviser, but I have no idea at what cost to me (I guess it would be a monthly expense). She said that the tax and health insurance are all tied in together, or maybe I just misunderstood that part of it.

On the one hand, it sounds ok, except for parting with a large amount of money before I even get there. If the new teacher will agree to contacting me I will be able to get some feedback from him. The school's given me contact details for 2 teachers that have been working there for a longer period of time, and I will email them tonight with some questions.

On the other hand, if I can go in January and find a contract to work in Prague, or Brno, or somewhere else in the country, without forking out my hard earned dollars before I even get there, then that would probably be the best course of action.

One thing that I haven't mentioned, is that I'm sure that they haven't contacted my referees, and she hasn't asked for a copy of my TESOL certificate. And that's what's worrying me the most. It may be a wonderful school, but I think it's weird to employ me from the other side of the world without any checks made to confirm what I'm telling her about myself.

Any more advice will, of course, be gratefully received. And if you know of any schools hiring in January......

[Chris Westergaard]

There is no reason for you not to be able to find contract work within the city. Having a Zivno is great and getting someone to do it for you is great too. You have to decide whether it is worth it to get one. If you are worried about finding work - don't. If you know your stuff and can interview well, schools will hire you. If you don't know your stuff - you still can find work. Paying 19,000 out of your own pocket is a lot. I encourage my TEFL students to get a Zivno - but I certainly do not encourage them to pay 19,000. There are a lot of people who for a much smaller fee can help you get it. You will most likely have to run all over the place, but it all depends on how badly you want it.

My opinion - its a great thing to have if you can market yourself. If you are simply working through a school, I don't see much of a point.

[Grenouille]

Thank you both again for your input, Chris and spiral78. I've taken note of everything you've had to say, and I've decided not to take the Zivno path at this early point in my career. If I don't have a contract in hand before I'm ready to leave Australia, I'll be in Prague in January looking for work. Maybe, as you have said, after a year or two it might be the way to go, but for the moment I think I'll go for the benefits of working within a contract.

All the best to you both.

Grenouille

[spiral78]

Best of luck to you in Prague, as well. cau

[maryfrances]

The dialog you guys just went through should be required reading for all "independent" people like me. I was a journalist for many years, so I shudda known better.

DO NOT GO FOR THESE SHADY OFFERS!

Shady is really sleazy. I am currently working for the sleaziest in a town just outside Prague. I too went through all the promises you have been made. I too am older, very well-qualified and perhaps too smart for my own good.

I must go back to New York to the Czech Consulate to correct the mess. My tourist visa is expired, and after 3 months I still have no work visa. The costs involved in coming here have been staggering: ordinary moving costs, plus 40,000CZK in rent and security deposit, plus a minimum of 22,000CZK for the 6 months medical insurance required by law, plus supporting myself, transport, food, clothing and so on, from the end of August until now. And an accountant just to help me do all the paperwork in order to pay taxes and eventually get my trade license.

What the hell has the language school done for me?

Language schools do not pay you until the month later. Why? Getting an Earnings Statement depends on the shame the lawyers can inflict.

Why live like a wetback, illegal immigrant, hiding from the immigration and tax police? Why can your school provide a flat? The work visa? Insurance? Because it would add to their costs. Yet you ARE their business.

[maryfrances]

[quote="spiral78"]January is not a bad time to start. There is always some percentage of teachers who don't show up again after the Christmas break.

You're right about the job not paying above average, and I still think it's rather shady that they are willing to hire from overseas; it could indicate that they are desperate for staff, and in Prague that would be a red light - there are a lot of teachers around.

All the better schools will offer Czech lessons, assistance in finding housing, and help with the official paperwork. This is standard. They should also pay for your city travel pass, as you'll be spending a lot of time traveling to your students, in most cases.

One option would be to come to the city with a temporary apartment lined up (I will try to find a contact for you in the next day or two - the apartments I mean are privately owned, and used as holiday rentals. but if you come in an off season, you can sometimes get one at a reasonable rate for two to four weeks, and it's nice because you can line this up in advance. the 'reasonable rate' is, of course, more than an English teacher is going to be able to afford long-term, but much cheaper than a hotel and nicer than a hostel). I don't have a contact handy here, but I think I may be able to find one, and if so, I'll post it for you. I did this myself three years ago, over January and February, and while it wasn't cheap, it wasn't prohibitive either, and it gave me time to look around for something appropriate.[/quote][quote]

Can you pelase contact me? I am looking for a 1v to 2 vmonths apartment in Prague while I get straightened out. I desperate aout the visa and licensw, although I worked in the CZ for 2 years or so ago and had no trouble. But I worked for a university.
At Christmas I must go back to the U.S. -- and the Czech Consulate, inshallah, and then I must live in Prague. I am in a small town ouside the city now.
My email is: [email protected].
Many, many thanks if you can help with a flat. Oh, yeah, I have a small, sweet cat too.
[/quote]