Job Discussion Forums

[kev7161]

After reading another, uh, locked thread, this brought questions to mind about contracts that we've all signed and whether or not your school upholds their end of the bargain regularly every month? And, on the other hand, do you? (come on - - this is a mostly anonymous website; you can be honest with us)

My contract agreements are MOSTLY followed except for a couple of cases that sometimes gets my goat:

1. I had them insert a clause that states that a school administrator would visit and observe my class at least 2X a month, then give me feedback on their observations - - negative or positive. This was to protect me against unreasonable feedback from a parent or even a student. It wasn't that I feared I'm not doing my job properly, just that I know what COULD happen should the program I'm involved with go belly-up or they happen to find someone that would do my job for a lesser amount of money. To date this school year, I've been "visited" once. Last year it was a total of about 5 times in the whole school year, mostly at the beginning. Then everyone got "busy". As long as the pay packets keep rolling in, then I'm not worried, but it was a CYA clause.

2. My contract states "25 working hours" (same as last year). When I found myself actually working about 35 hours a week due to the nature of the job, then I asked them about this. "25 CONTACT hours is what we meant," I was told, "Extra class prep time will vary depending on the teacher." I said fine but that should be explained better in the contract. My job gives me several perks and my pay is very nice, so I didn't worry too much about it. This year I signed a new contract and I glossed right over that part for some reason (I'm usually more careful) and now I'm generally pushing 40 hours. Again, I'm not TOO concerned because I now make a higher salary than before and still have some nice extras but, IF I were to sign a 3rd contract, I'll make sure to "fix" that so we are both satisfied with it.

Overall though, the school holds up their end by paying me on time, providing housing and other services they said they would, etc. They mostly stay out of my hair, which is fine, although I'd stil appreciate those twice-monthly visits, but a minor quibble. On my end, I feel like I more than service my end of the contract with the work I do and the hours I put in.

So, not trying to start a flame-war here (but I know it will happen!), how are YOU doing?

[joesgonnago]

Kev,

I have been in China now for 6 months and while that isn't long I have been to 4 schools. No, I'm not a job hopper but I came and did a summer camp and through them I was at 2 schools. After that, I went to Hangzhou and worked at a language school in Zhejiang University for 1 month before starting my 10 month gig. The contract stated that I have 25 teaching hours and complete a 40 hour work week. That meant I had to sit in the office, prepare my lessons, do interviews with new students, and play on the internet. Now, because I was only there a month, they didn't enforce it too strictly. However, the other teachers were required to and had to punch a timecard. After the month was up I was surprised to know that while I received a room on campus for free that my electric wasn't covered. I ended up paying 186rmb for the month and this was after they gave me an allowance of 150rmb. My contract never said anything about utilities. I didn't make too much of a fuss because the school was good and possibly I want to return during breaks or next summer. I mean, have you ever been to Hangzhou? It's China's most beautiful city!
With my current school (a public senior middle) I've had some tough times. First, they didn't want to compensate me for my travel to Hong Kong. Though it clearly states in my contract that they are to "pay for the visa expenses, travel pay, and certain parts of travel expenses." I was told that it was a translation error and that I was responsible for all expenses to get my Z visa. The school was responsible for getting me my Resident Permit and anything I needed after arriving with a valid 1 year visa. I ended up reminding them that I had a 30 day out clause in the contract and would exercise it if I wasn't reimbursed. We ended up "compromising" and they gave me the money, but out of my 8000rmb for roundtrip airfare. (I have a return ticket already provided by the summer camp)
The next issue was my accommodations. After a month of normalcy, I noticed that there was no running water in the mornings. I often had to go without a shower and even was forced to purchase bottled water to wash my face and brush my teeth. I asked several people- several times about it and was told "it's a water pressure problem" for over a month. I was then told that "I think they turn it off." Well, I was upset and getting mad at this point. After all was said and done, it turns out that in order to save the lifespan of a pump; they admitted that they turn the water off at 8:00am everyday. Now, I have one class -one day that starts at 8:30am. All others begin at 10:00am or later. I asked "what can I do?" and was told to wake up early and take a shower or take a shower at night. WHAT?? I asked "what time do you wake up?" "Oh 6:30am, well from now on wake up at 4:30am to take a shower. Sound reasonable?"
This is getting long so I'll get to my point. I had several other issues that weren't being addressed as well. I asked some fellow teachers that I know and was advised to give them a deadline and then to stop going to class. I cringed at the idea. I teach for the students - not the money- not the school, but felt I had no choice. After 2 days and 10 missed lessons, the school now leaves the water on until I start class and 2 of my later classes were moved up in the morning.

The lesson learned is this: In any situation, in any country, people will only do to you what you let them.

btw: I'm the first FT for my school and feel an obligation to be fair and responsible but firm.

Joewent and Margorie is hot!

[NathanRahl]

You will find that most chinese schools and companies break their contract obligations at some point if you look closely enough. In many cases you don't have to look close at all.

The chinese just don't take contracts, or their idea, very seriously really, except where it applies to your duties and responsibilities. When it comes to their obligations, thats where the lack of serious consideration comes in.

The truth is, you need to look at contracts in china ffrom a relative point of view. Guage them not on whether they breach it or not in some way, which they almost always will, but look more at what is breached, and how often.

Some of the best places worked in china seem to be the ones that breach a contract the least, not the places that don't breach them at all, a rarity it seems.

All in all, you will find the teachers here in china are far more honorable in regards to sticking to the conditions of their contracts then the chinese, this is common. Once you can accept this, and realise that dissembling and outright dishonesty are quite common among chinese employers, you will more accurately be able to judge their quality in the current atmosphere.

[Steppenwolf]

I will state categorically that while I have had my unfair share in unfriendly treatment at the hand of unscrupulous employers, I have little reason to believe it's a systemic problem.
My public employers have kept their part of the deal - except one. That exception was a provincial college that had embarked on an expansion programme that allowed them to hire FTs.
They were new to the game and excelled mainly through procrastination, making false promises, changing my timetable weekly and even modifying my workload weekly, resulting in wildly fluctuating income levels.
Since they were so terribly disorganised I couldn't get them to procure my visa; all problems combined made my position there untenable in the long run and so I bailed out.

That was the only time I did that. I have had 5 public employers and have not been cheated by any of them although I have had gripes and was the object of an unfair dismissal.

On the other hand, training centres and agents seldom live up to their engagements. Most of my experience has been as a parttimer; in that capacity you are quite likely to experience unpleasant ups and downs though you are somewhat safer than if you depend for your livelihood on your private business boss.

They deal with a different segment of the market, one that's unpredictable. Their enrolment numbers fluctuate wildly while their overheads remain more or less the same. No wonder many of these operators try to make you pay for their occasional losses.

[no_exit]

Contracts work mostly on an honor system in China, for all intents and purposes. A teacher at my school recently told me that he wouldn't take an extra class, even though he was still well under his contracted teaching hours (16). I told him that while I couldn't force him to teach the class, and while I wasn't prepared to fire him over two hours a week (which he told me interfered with his preparations to take the HSK), he should keep in mind that if he didn't honor certain parts of his contract, our Chinese end might feel compelled to take liberties as well. Once a contract has been broken by one party, it becomes pretty useless. Were we to deny this teacher his bonus or something, he wouldn't have any legal or ethical recourse because he already broke the contract himself. In the end we compromised, and I told him we wouldn't push the issue of the extra classes until after the HSK, and he was satisfied with that. Most disputes over the contract can be resolved this way, and it seems to that the majority of FTs simply want to know that their concerns are heard and there is still room for compromise even once the contract is signed.

My Chinese associates are all about fairness. If the teacher upholds their end, we uphold ours. The general manager here is very picky about sticking to the contract, and does indeed see it as a legally binding document, even though there isn't much a school can actually do if a teacher decides, say, to just pick up and run away. Even in the past, I have never worked for a school that presented me with a contract that they had no intention of upholding, and maybe I've been lucky, but I've always been given everything that was promised to me in writing.

One bit of advice that I think is very important for newbies is the need to examine the English AND the Chinese versions of the contract very carefully, and find out which version will take precedence if there is a dispute. Sometimes there are legitimate translation errors which will appear in contracts that change the meaning entirely. Chinglish can also be very vague -- for example "certain parts of travel expenses" in joesgonnago's post below. What does that mean? I wouldn't sign the contract without an addition outlining exactly which parts of the travel expenses are covered. If your contract is vague in any way, you can almost guarantee that you and your employer will interpret it differently and there will be problems if you ever have an issue over that part of the contract.

[Shan-Shan]

[Leon Purvis]

I've had NO problems with my FAO upholding its end of the contract. If there have been any variations in the contract, they have manifested themselves as unexpected perks such as two months' paid vacation in the summer at FULL pay scale. In addition, I was given work opportunities to make more money during the summer.

As I look back at the year and read about all of the problems which other posters have had, I consider myself VERY fortunate.

[vikdk]

steppenwolf writes -

[johnchina]

Let's be sure to include foreign organisations in this. The IELTS examiners working for the British Council have to sign fluid contracts that can be changed at anytime without notification by the BC! I've never had that from a Chinese employer.

The only issues I've had with Chinese schools is that sometimes the pay isn't on time, but I know of other people who've had their contracts broken by their employers AND I know some teachers who've broken their contracts.

[AussieGuyInChina]

[cj750]

As the administrative authority under the State Council in
charge of labor and social security related issues in china, the Ministry of Labor and Social Security is
responsible to the Employment Contract Law.....

This is a point to remember when signing those contracts....especially with headhunters or agencies...so if your hired through a agency..make sure what kind of agency your are employed by..it make the difference as to what a company is responsible for as to contract obligations...



Labor dispatch agencies differ from employment agencies and headhunting firms. Such agencies employ and enter into employment contracts with laborers themselves, dispatching the laborers to enterprises in need of the laborers. The enterprises where the laborers actually work only need to pay the labor dispatch agency a commission and do not have an obligation to pay the laborers� wages, or contribute to the laborers� social security or housing funds. Rather, these obligations are fulfilled by the labor dispatch agencies themselves. Employment agencies and headhunting firms do not establish contractual labor relation with the employees, nor do they contribute to laborers� social security or housing funds.
In many cases where the school hires through an agency, they feel they have no responsibility to the employee....and in many cases a FT is signing with a dispatch agency when they think they are singing with an agent or headhunter...first thing is to discover who actually holds your contract...

[clark.w.griswald]

Interesting thread so far - mostly!

[vikdk]

[Steppenwolf]

[danielb]

AussieblokeinChina, the doctrine of estoppel is applied in China and this is a valid point.