Job Discussion Forums

[foreignertobe]

I was told many months ago by a Chinese teacher at my school that the students needed repetition, not explanation. This was referring to a class where I was trying to give examples filled with gestures and simple English to explain why one uses the past tense (they didn't seem to understand why they were being taught what the Chinese teachers called "verbs 1,2 and 3" ((preterite and past participle)) ). I was told today by the HEAD TEACHER that "it is not our job to make sure the students understand; they just need practice." This makes sense to them somehow. Am I missing something?

[Taylor]

Dear foreignertobe,

It sounds like you are no longer a foreigner to be....you ARE a foreigner! Welcome to Taiwan!

Thanks for posting. I wish this board had more posts like yours.

Regarding any issues on "how to teach English" I believe that 3 major elements must be considered:

(1) The age of students
(2) The English level of students
(3) The number of students in class

Basically, I believe that our students should be doing 70 to 80% of the talking in class (in English, that is!). Perhaps your explanation/dramatization should have included more chances for the students to repeat after you....or to create more sentences on their own.

Some grammar points are inherently difficult for ESL/EFL learners. This keeps us employed, by the way!!! Certainly, there is no way to perfectly teach this to people of any nationality--especially those of Asian backgrounds.

Best wishes!

Taylor
Kaohsiung

P.S. Could you tell us a bit more about the classes you are teaching...?

[matchstick_man]

In many ways the HEAD teacher is right. If you get single young students to do actions for the continuous present tense and ask the class what the student is doing they will remember especially if it is done a number of times. I can see past tense being a lot more difficult although the concept does exist in Chinese. 'Le' is often used for completed actions.

Taylor's questions are important factors. Age is a factor because adults are unwilling to do things that are easy to get children to do.

[foreignertobe]

The case with the past tense was a while ago, so I don't remember it well enough to comment on it accurately now. I do remember it was a time when I was using the past tense with the kids after they had been studying and using it for a long time and I realized that they had no idea when it was, so then I digressed. The kids, by the way, were mostly fine with it. I think it was the teacher being offended, feeling like she hadn't taught something. Still, for the comment to come out that it's not our job to make them understand, I don't get that.

The issue the other day happened with a class of 8-10 year olds. They have been studying English for over two years now. Some are MUCH better than others, so I try to accomodate that. I had tot teach them "What does your ______ tell you not to do?" versus "What doesn't your _______ want you to do?" I wrote the sentences on the board, using red ink to show where the "not" changed places. After explaining a couple of times slowly (less than a minute it must have taken), then we practiced from the pictures in the book. When they hadn't gotten it, I reminded them of the structure, pointing to the sentences I had put on the board. That happened a few times, since the slower students didn't seem to get it as quickly. If you're imagining some new foreign teacher describing some esoteric grammar point to a class of 3 year olds for an hour, that was NOT the case.

The head teacher's version of explanation would have been "Okay, so you say 'tell' so you say 'What does your mother tell you not to do?' and you say 'want' so you say "What doesn't your mother want you to do?" These are the sorts of recommendations that she has provided me with before. Simply put, the children can handle more, and NEED more. I'm concerned that they don't see the value in understanding something instead of just repeating it. The small amount of work that goes into it up front pays off exponentially once they understand it. I have a degree in languages and have learned a few myself. I am just coming to resent the fact that as soon as there is a pause in the classroom because the students have to think about an answer, the Chinese teacher seems to think there is something wrong. Of course, there's never a pause when they're shouting at the students playing constant games and asking only that they mimic what they say...

[Taylor]

Dear Readers,

As I mentioned earlier, the past tense is inherently difficult for ESL/EFL learners. Therefore, let's move on to the other issue raised by the original poster...

This sentence pattern is a bit unusual, in my opinion. (I don't think this is a question that is commonly asked of kids in America--in a normal conversation....)

Also, it is a bit confusing since it is worded negatively. It is well-known that children are very concrete thinkers. Even adults have some difficulty in this area.

What if I say to you:

Please do not remain seated!

It will take you a second or two to finally stand up, right?

Perhaps a direct statement such as: You shouldn't play with your food! might have been more appropriate--as opposed to the Q&A involving the word 'not'.

My wife needs the computer, so I'll close for now!

Best wishes!

Taylor
Kaohsiung

[foreignertobe]

I didn't have a choice to teach them anything else. Those were the two sentence structures assigned for the grammar part of the class. That is what was to be taught. The problem is that ANY explanation is looked down upon. I am being told to look at the sentences in the book and repeat, simply that. No explanation. They apparently will pick up the patterns on their own. That being said, they don't. How is that fixed? More practice, not explanation. It is wrong.

And no one else reponded to this message after I had the last time, so I'm not too sure whom you are counseling to "move on" concerning the past tense.

[Dr_Zoidberg]

Foreignertobe, you're right. It is wrong. The real question here is, "What are you going to do about it?"

Here are your choices:

1. Cave in to your laoban's demands. This will result in lots of mindless repetition, job disatisfaction, and your students still won't have learned a thing.

2. Stick to your guns, and continue to explain the grammar point to your students. This will result in you being on the other side of the door as soon as a foreigner who is willing to do the laoban's bidding walks in off the street. You will be on your way to Hong Kong, the new teacher will do the mindless repetition, and your now former students still won't have learned a thing.

Trying to get the Taiwanese to take the proper approach to English is like the story about the man who persitantly banged his head against the wall. When his friend asked why he did it he replied, "Because it feels so good when I stop."