Job Discussion Forums

[elliewelliesj]

Just running this by you, maybe someone knows the legal status but also is this normal practice?
I was sick a while back, went to the doc for medication to kick it..actually before i took time off, but ended up needing to take time off. Faxed all the info from the doc to the head office so that they knew what was going on, and that it was legit. (i know some people take days off for hangovers but i cant afford that)

Have now found out that my employer called the doc and discussed me and my condition, behind my back .... and then he just told me now in quite a sly way...first asking me about how i was now, then casually sitting down and pulling out the papers i sent him (which his little kid had drawn flowers all over) and telling me how he had a nice conversation with the doc.

Now i have nothing to hide, it was all truth so i am not guilty. But i feel totally shocked and upset that my privacy was so brutally invaded. Maybe i have it out of perspective... maybe i shouldn't judge this by my western standards. But is this normal? can the doctor discuss private details?

What do you think? do i have right to make a formal complaint? In my own country I would.

Thanks for your thoughts....

[Sherri]

Where I used to work (Tokyo in the 1990s) our company paid for us to take a yearly medical. The results would be sent to the office, opened by the secretariat, who read and digested (and discussed) the results before passing them on to the teachers. The notion of confidentiality was not in existance. Some teachers complained and later results were placed in envelopes with promises of privacy, but who knows if that really happened.

[gonzarelli]

There is no such thing as privacy in Japan, especially for foreigners. Sorry.

[GambateBingBangBOOM]

If you ever need to see a doctor about something you do not want your employer (and the entire town in the case of a small town) to find out about (including just tests) then you need to go to a place pretty far away- like in a different prefecture. For example, there are STD clinics that run as cash based businesses because Japanese people don't want their employer finding out they got tested (the theory being that you don't get tested unless symptoms show There is a general ignorance of STDs in this country- many Japanese people with university educations still think of AIDS and HIV as the same thing and think that it's a 'gay' disease).

Doctors officially do not/ cannot discuss your conditions with other people. But that is waved for employers. The nurses at the doctors office don't have rules like that and so can and will discuss anything that they are told by a foreigner to their friends as soon as work is finished.

[J.]

GBBBoom; this is just a nightmare. Combined with the story over on the general discussion about the teacher you worked with as an ALT, it's a wonder you haven't been driven to commit murder.

I sure hope you gave your Internet provider and your university a blast about releasing information without your authority. If it were me, I would contact them all and tell them not to release any information without your signature (or hanko).

Snooping by bosses or colleagues of this kind leaves a very bad taste in my mouth. Even if it's the norm here we have to protest, I think.

I have experienced something I didn't like; when I took a friend to the hospital to help translate they were discussing my case with her, much beyond what translation required, so I was getting annoyed. Now I go alone and we muddle through. At least they are forced to deal with me directly.

I briefly considered starting a formal business here, but the person assisting me became over-invested in things, to the point of starting to speak for me, so that I decided it wasn't worth the hassle. That and the fact that there was obvious prejudice at play, with the word gaijin being bandied about a bit too much. It just gave me a taste of what I would have to swallow and "like it" if I decided to go forward.

If I have gotten help from students with translation, then the person or entity we are dealing with (for example a health club) has had no qualms about discussing my affairs with that person on the phone or when I am not there. Totally out of line, as far as I am concerned.

[J.]

I also wanted to comment to the OP. I think this might be practice here just because traditionally bosses have had all but the power of life or death over employees. But that's no reason that it should still be happening today. You would be well advised to tell your Doctor that you will be the one to provide your boss with any papers/information he needs to have and instruct him that he is to keep your information strictly confidential unless you authorize him to release it either in person or in writing.

What he did was definitely ethically wrong, whether he /she knows it or not and maybe it's up to us patients to educate the medical profession about that. You could of course complain to his superior if he works at a hospital, but if he is the owner of his own clinic then your only recourse is to speak to him directly. Unfortunately he/she probably doesn't even realize what he did is wrong, or if so just thinks he can get away with it.

[ironopolis]

To the OP,
I totally agree with the sentiments others have expressed above and share those frustrations about invasions of privacy.

BUT, and a big but....think carefully before you make any kind of big complaint about it. It would be nice if the result of doing so was a welcome realization of how we felt about such invasions of privacy, along the lines of "ah, I see...they like to keep these things private; let's bear that in mind for next time"
However, the reality is very often quite different as the likely reaction to someone complaining about this would be to assume that you're only making a fuss because you have something to hide.

I do feel your pain, OP, as the ridiculously hasty conclusions people jump to here is one of the things that irritates me most about living in Japan. I'm rarely off sick and I've found quite offensive the assumptions people have made that I must have been just hungover, when I was actually off sick. So I'm not saying you shouldn't complain about this - but just be wary of what the effect might be if you do.

To be honest, gambatebingbang's advice is good; bear this experience in mind for next time and, if possible, try to make sure there isn't any contact between the doctors you see and your employer, unless this is completely unavoidable. Perhaps avoid sending any info about medical treatment etc to your employer unless they really insist on having it, and even then just give them the minimum you can get away with.

[User N. Ame]

[elliewelliesj]

Thanks for everyone's measured adviced - it really has helped me put it all in perspective and feel less upset. And will certainly change how I handle it.... although it still feels like a violation of privacy I understand that I cant judge it by my Western feelings now... this was not something I had thought about before coming here, but can now put it down to another cultural experience! and perhaps decide if i like it or not...!
I was scared about posting on here as some people can be so brutal, but its nice to have had such good advice from all viewpoints. Thank you again, you have really helped.

[J.]

The "we are in Japan so we have to follow cultural rules thing" is getting really old. For one thing, it's really no different if you live in a small town in Canada, except that when doctors talk out of turn, people COMPLAIN, and over time this makes the doctors aware that it's not in their best interests to do this kind of thing.

Not one thing gets changed if no one complains.

Anyway we are not Japanese and will never really be accepted as such, so it stands to reason that some differences in behaviour will be expected. One thing that happens when people of different cultures live together is that they learn from each other. We probably learn to be far more accepting of community thinking living here, but it won't hurt doctors and bosses to learn that there is more than one way of doing things, and that the status quo offends some people. If they want workers from other countries then THEY have to deal with it.

Just to reiterate, I recommended that the OP complain to his/her Doctor, _not_ the Boss. The relationship of privilege is between Doctor-patient but should not extend to an employer. You need to make that clear to your Doctor.

[User N. Ame]

[J.]

Okay, UserN, if you want the gloves off, here goes.

Your remark about maturity being evidenced by a person who accepts cultural "rules" without trying to change them "because they can't be changed" is totally fallacious. It's your definition, not mine. I don't live by your definitions, but by my own sense of what's right.

I also don't believe that human beings are so narrowly defined by their culture as you seem to. I DO believe that they are capable of changing based on their experiences. One experience that might cause a change would be an encounter with another viewpoint. Not everyone will react by dismissing it out of hand and badmouthing the person offering it. It takes a spectacularly closed mind to assume that every case can be predicted on this basis.

You assume that when people from different cultures (or with different perspectives) live together that all the adapting must come from one side. If you assume that we are capable of adapting and changing (and I agree that we are to a large extent) then why don't you recognize that the learning is /can be mutual?

There are many benefits to be had in a multicultural society, but none can occur without some willingness to compromise. It's a two-way street.

[User N. Ame]

[Sherri]

Well, I just talked to my husband about this topic. He worked in the Japanese pharmaceutical industry for about 20 years and had to have a yearly physical for his company. He said the information is absolutely confidential. It was delivered in a sealed envelope and the results--no matter what--were not communicated to his supervisors or co-workers. He said it would have been illegal to do so.

[J.]

to you UserN.

If I have an agressive tone it's because you've managed to fill your posts with insults ( ie you don't agree with me so I must be: immature, intolerant, unable to adapt to the culture and for good measure I should go home.)

I'm not agressive about the culture, though I do have frustrations, and as such have as much right to speak about them as you have to say there is no problem, I'm agressive because you have been insulting and patronizing to me for the past few posts.

The reason I mentioned gloves is because you made me feel like a punching bag. Denying it makes not one whit of difference. The one who is aggressive here (albeit hiding in a passive persona ) is you.

I still don't agree with you about the "guests" thing. Since when are tax-payers and workers guests? That's just more semantics to dress up a far different reality and to justify poor treatment of migrant workers.

I never told YOU to go home. Until now.