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Katemarsh
Joined: 16 Feb 2007
Posts: 20
Location: USA
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 Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 12:49 am Post subject: Opportunities and Happiness |
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Im reposting half of my question because I think I was confusing and it hasnt been addressed.
Is it possible to teach at a University if you have a Masters degree outside of the field of education?
Also, is this a rewarding path to take-I sense high stress levels and a lot of negativity-is this a general undertone or are most people happy with their decision? I would assume a general love for life among people who seek careers that incorporate travel and working in schools but I am getting a very different perception from this site. Any thoughts? |
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movinaround
Joined: 08 Jun 2006
Posts: 202
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 1:04 am Post subject: Re: Opportunities and Happiness |
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Where? There is a big difference between Japan and China for example.
Also remember, you won't find most of the people who are happy posting about it. The same goes with everything in life. |
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Katemarsh
Joined: 16 Feb 2007
Posts: 20
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 1:07 am Post subject: |
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| I guess in general-just looking to hear from people in various countries to share the knowledge they have in a particular area. This is the information I would use to narrow my current search which is quite broad. |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 1:56 am Post subject: |
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| European universities usually require MAs in TESL/TEFL, Applied Linguistics, or something else closely related. |
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denise
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Posts: 3419
Location: finally home-ish
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:44 am Post subject: |
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I've read your other posts but haven't replied because I really don't have any useful information for you. But, as to this question... yes, it is possible to be happy in this job! I've taught in several places, and while each place has had its quirks and things that annoyed me, I have always made good friends, seen the country, learned a lot about teaching, and come away with many more good memories than bad.
And yes, you can work in a uni (I'm referring to teaching, though, not counseling, which I think you mentioned) with a non-teaching MA. I'm speaking only from limited experiences, though--some of my colleagues in Japan had their MAs in other fields, and I believe that some of my current colleagues in Oman do as well. Oman might actually be a decent place for you to consider since you'll be bringing a husband and baby along.
d |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 4:04 am Post subject: |
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The short answer for Japan is yes. My own master's is not in education, and I work full-time at a university.
The long answer is much more on the "no" side.
And, there is more to getting a university job than just having a master's degree.
Read the links on this link to understand the situation in Japan more.
http://www.palewiki.org/wiki/index.php?title=Preparing_to_Search |
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GambateBingBangBOOM
Joined: 04 Nov 2003
Posts: 2021
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 11:05 am Post subject: Re: Opportunities and Happiness |
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| Katemarsh wrote: |
Also, is this a rewarding path to take-I sense high stress levels and a lot of negativity-is this a general undertone or are most people happy with their decision? I would assume a general love for life among people who seek careers that incorporate travel and working in schools but I am getting a very different perception from this site. Any thoughts? |
Most people aren't overseas for more than a few years. A lot of them are recent university graduates without much home country experience.
Most people are generally happy with their lives (I hope), but websites such as this one are used to blow off steam that builds up from culture fatigue/ slow moving idiots who don't get out of your way so you miss trains etc.
Some people worry a lot about what others think of them, and teaching English overseas is often viewed as a stop gap sort of thing to do while you figure out what you really want out of life. This applies even for those who have tonnes of qualifications and experience in teaching the language- "Why don't you become a real teacher?" is a common question from family members, as is "Are you a real teacher" amongst English teachers themselves. (To a lot of people, a "real teacher" seems to mean only people who work in the k~12 sector, and only in the geographic area in which the person in question grew up). |
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coffeedrinker
Joined: 30 Jul 2006
Posts: 149
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 11:24 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
used to blow off steam that builds up from culture fatigue/ slow moving idiots who don't get out of your way so you miss trains etc.
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Ha! You get them over there too?
I don't have a Master's Degree so I may not really be qualified to answer...but while there are certainly frustrations in efl (maybe less when you have an MA or just of a different kind?) there's usually something equivalent at home, or there would be.
I think a lot of people - certainly not just efl teachers - look to a job to bring happiness. My cheesy insight is that this is not how it works. A job - any job - may have an influence on things, and efl teachers are probably in more of a position to get into extreme situations - but it's more than just the nature of the job that determines a person's satisfaction.
It's hard to write more on this without even more cheesiness, but I really do think this. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 11:34 am Post subject: |
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Sorry for padding my post count with another reply. My server at work is flukey and makes it hard to post on Dave's. Sometimes it works, but a microsecond later (like today) it won't let me on to add anything. So I have to do this from home.
| Quote: |
| Also, is this a rewarding path to take-I sense high stress levels and a lot of negativity-is this a general undertone or are most people happy with their decision? |
At first glance, I was wondering if you meant whether university work was rewarding, but is that what you really meant, or is it more like is all of TEFL rewarding?
I'll assume the latter, but incorporate some of the former.
Universities in Japan hire mostly on 3-year contracts. They may get renewed once. In any case, your lifespan is short, and then you are out. Competition is high, so it's not a breeze to float to the next job, and if your contract is not renewed, imagine working at a place for just 3 years. First year, you get used to the surroundings and curriculum Second year, you might have a chance to polish your syllabuses and do something more constructive. Third year, you are barely aware of your classes and are focusing more on job hunting. But, a couple of good points about uni work:
1. Pay is usually pretty good.
2. Paid vacations are also good.
3. Course load is much smaller than FT work in high school (5-6 classes per week, 15 classes per semester).
4. Private office and phone.
5. Research fund for various supplies.
6. Housing allowance.
Is it "rewarding"? Depends on what you want to get out of it, and what you are willing to put into it. I could tell you about the Gwen Gallagher case, where she worked for a dozen years or more at a uni here, then was fired because she was considered "not foreign enough" anymore. How rewarding is that? Plenty of cases like hers here, too, so learn as much as you can about the situation in Japan if you intend to stick it out.
Is TEFL itself rewarding? Again, same answer. I've been at it for almost 9 years. Got married to a wonderful Japanese woman and have had a kid here. Great in-laws. Comfortable enough life for us all. Before I got my uni job, though, I was working my butt off in HS 10-12 hours/day, and usually half of the Saturdays in a week. Curriculum changed every year, so I was making lessons every week for years. My co-workers were marvelous people, though, and I think you have to look to people like them for solace and support and camaraderie. Ignore the complainers and those who are here just to make a buck. (The latter won't have time for you anyway.) You will always have to be on top of things around you in order to survive until you find something relatively stable (and that's pretty rare). Establish yourself over a couple of years, continue to improve yourself, and network like crazy so you can enjoy that camaraderie I mentioned. Going it alone (or just with your spouse) is a very lonely way to go it here. You are going to be a foreigner here always, and there is discrimination lurking below the surface, so the more you know, the better off you will be. Lastly, learn the language as much as possible as soon as possible. You may not use it in the classroom (it is often prohibited anyway), but it will enhance your life everywhere else.
| Quote: |
| I would assume a general love for life among people who seek careers that incorporate travel and working in schools |
I don't consider my job to incorporate travel and working. Couldn't tell you what percentage of EFL teachers migrate from country to country and what percentage settle in just one place (like me). In Japan, your vacation time will be limited most of the time, so you just have to fit it in and deal with it. Develop a thick hide for some things; this is not your home country. See as much of it as you can, though. I've lived on Hokkaido all of those past 8-9 years and seen a lot of it, but nothing else. Now that I'm in a uni job, I hope to have enough free time to spend it in other parts of the country (or outside Japan), even if on a business trip. I like what I'm doing, but life is more than just work. I got into this from another career, so I've been learning this as I go along, and that's part of the fun, but it reaches a limit. I don't live to work; I work to live, and after all this time, I may finally have time to do that. It's been a long haul, but yes, it's been worth it.
If you have more personal questions to ask about life in Japan, feel free to PM me. |
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southofreality
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Posts: 579
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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It would be hard for me to move to a country without having first developed some kind of interest in it. The country's language, food, culture, etc... have to be appealing to me. Of course, the general quality of daily life can vary from place to place within a country so it's also important to me to find a city there that suits my ideals.
I did a lot of research (on the internet and elsewhere) before I came to Japan and thought long and hard about all the places in which I was interested in living, all the places I wanted to visit, and all the things I wanted to do while living here.
I didn't start out here with the ideal job, nor did I live in the ideal city for me. I had to change jobs a few times and move around the country a bit to get to the place where I am now. I'm happy, but I'm still working on landing myself in the ideal situation here.
I guess my advice to anyone interested in going to a foreign country and starting out a life there would be to make sure you have a real interest in many things related to that place and be prepared to start out with a less-than-ideal job. Then, while you work your way into the job you really want, enjoy life in that country for all it has to offer. But, if you can start off with the right job for you in the right location there, more power to you.
Last edited by southofreality on Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:36 am; edited 1 time in total |
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MamaOaxaca
Joined: 03 Jan 2007
Posts: 201
Location: Mixteca, Oaxaca
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| Posted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 7:43 pm Post subject: Re: Opportunities and Happiness |
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| Katemarsh wrote: |
| Is it possible to teach at a University if you have a Masters degree outside of the field of education? |
One thing that I think has made it difficult for people to give clear useful answers is you don't say teach what. Is is possible to teach English at a university if you have an Masters degree outside of the field of education? Is that what you want to know, or do you want to know if it is possible to teach in the field of your MA?
Over the past decade in Mexico there has been a push for universities to hire more professors with advanced degrees. Yes, there are many that had few professors with advanced degrees. So some may hire you to teach English, even though you have no training in teaching of English. But remember that on this board you are talking to people who do have training in teaching of English. Many of us know far more about second language aquistion, the history of English, syntax, semantics, pragmatics, stylistics and psycholinguistics than is necessiary to give an English as a Foreign Language class. We have books on our selves with titles like Learner English: A Teacher's Guide to Interference and other Problems and The Phonology of English as an International Language. Is it unusual for us to be grumpy when someone from another field comes in and says, surely I'm just as qualified to do your job? I personally would never dream of apply for a job as a school counselor just because I have an unrelated MA and speak the language.
| Katemarsh wrote: |
| I would assume a general love for life among people who seek careers that incorporate travel and working in schools but I am getting a very different perception from this site. Any thoughts? |
I'm very happy with the direction my life has taken. I've been overseas the majority of my adult life. I've lived and worked in 4 different countries and have been in Mexico for the past 9 years. I really don't travel much anymore, I've settled down, just not in my birth country. Many people on this forum don't "work in schools" They work at businesses, language institutes that sell English classes where the bottom line is staying in business not education. I think that if you are looking for peers who love life you will find some in any field, just as you will find people who do not love life in any field. I don't think the two things are related. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 2:17 am Post subject: |
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| Of course many Chinese universities don't even require MA's!!! |
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Katemarsh
Joined: 16 Feb 2007
Posts: 20
Location: USA
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 2:19 am Post subject: |
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| That is a very good point-and well taken I might add. I certainly wouldn't want to take a job that I didn't think I would be succeed in and I wasn't implying that I would be more or equally qualified than someone like yourself. Just exploring different avenues. This may account for the hostile tones of some responses-good insight. |
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JZer
Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 2:26 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Most people aren't overseas for more than a few years. A lot of them are recent university graduates without much home country experience. |
This is probably true but on the General Discussion forum there seems to be some continuity. People like Glenski, tedkarma, denise, etc have been teach TEFL for a long time. I am on my second year and will stay here until I can buy my first house. I will probably continue after that but in a different country unless the thing happens that usually stops further travel plans (marriage!!!!)
I will say that I did not come to Korea because I loved the culture. I like Korea but had no idea what I was getting into when I came. Of course the 12 weeks vacation and the opportunity to travel are nice.
Last edited by JZer on Thu Feb 22, 2007 5:16 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Jizzo T. Clown
Joined: 28 Apr 2005
Posts: 668
Location: performing in a classroom near you!
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| Posted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 7:38 pm Post subject: |
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I will probably continue after that but in a different country unless the thing happens that usually stops peoples further travel plans (marriage!!!!)
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True, that's the one thing folks at home keep pressuring me into. They really want me to stay, but in the end you just have to follow your instincts.
As for me, I work in a university right now but plan on leaving either mid-summer or this fall. One person's achievement is another one's dream. |
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