Job Discussion Forums

[elegantlywaisted]

I'm sorry to post something so similar to other posts in the forum, but I am desperate for advice based on me, personally.
I am 20 years old with no university experience at all, let alone a degree. I am interested in teaching English overseas, as is evident from my decision to join this forum. I am interested in finding a teaching job in Europe, specifically Germany. Later I hope to change countries, possibly Thailand after a year of two in Europe.
I am looking into getting started with training, but am confused as to what to look for and which courses are actually beneficial. There seem to be a lot of conflicting opinions throughout the forum and I am left slightly less confused (but still quite so) than when I began reading.
Just for a bit of background, and possibly more specific help, here is a little bit about myself:
I am from Canada and lack the desire to stay in one place for very long (at this point anyhow). I originally wanted to be an anthropologist/archaeologist, but for lack of extremely high grades in high school my chances of entering university at any point in the near future are very slim. I am not interested in most courses that are offered in colleges and thus I have chosen to steer clear of that option. I am an artist, writer, and an extremely enthusiastic person, but the idea of working a mediocre job (which is all I am qualified for at this point) with no excitement or challenge seems horrible to me.
When the idea of teaching overseas was brought to my attention by a neighbor it seemed like something too good to be true, I had never heard of it before. I love history, culture and language and take any chance I can to learn about them. Through my research thus far I have found that it has been a mostly positive experience for people and it seems like the 'thing' for me.

So now all I need to figure out is which course of action to take. Currently I am looking into the CELTA program that is being offered in a city nearby, but I am wondering if it would be best to take a course through a college, or perhaps a different program altogether (although I cannot afford to train in another country, nor can I afford to travel in order to find a job). I am not looking for the quick and easy training method, but something that will guarantee that I will find work where ever I may choose to go.
I apologize for the long... introduction, I suppose. I appreciate any help that anyone can offer, and I have been browsing the rest of the forum, but I am looking for more specific advice. Thanks so much.

[ls650]

[elegantlywaisted]

I am not talking about teaching without certification or a degree. I am looking for advice about it.

[eslstudies]

I don't think Canadians qualify for a European work visa, unless there's some working holiday deal for young people.
In terms of the base-level qualification you're talking about, I'm aware of a CELTA run in Thailand that actually works out cheaper than doing it at home, as well as giving you in country EFL teaching experience.
As stated earlier, China is tightening up, but there are still plenty of advertised positions not demanding a degree. Teaching is a demanding job: more so if you don't know what you're about!

[spiral78]

As the previous poster mentioned, you are very unlikely to get a work visa for Germany. They have recently tightened restrictions on non-EU citizens, and even experienced teachers with advanced qualifications and fluent German have been unable to get working permission. Check the Germany forum for more info on this.

You would be legally eligible for work permits in the 'new' EU member states, such as the Czech Rep and Poland. However, you should bear in mind that there are many newbie teachers in these regions (one reason being that non-EU citizens CAN get work permits) and most have university degrees and in-country certifications. While there are jobs around, you should bear in mind that you would be competing with degree holders.

A good basic course is optimally done in-country, should be 100+ hours on site, and include at least 6 hours of supervised teaching practice from a qualified teacher trainer. While there are both generic and name-brand courses out there, this is the basic format required by good language schools in Europe (speaking generally, obviously).

[Jetgirly]

I personally think that doing a CELTA would be a waste of time if you're focusing your job search on Europe. Enough people want to work there that employers can be picky, and a CELTA without a degree would probably be useless.

I have dual Canadian/German citizenship and can assure you that without UK citizenship there is no way you'll get work in Germany. Not a chance. No way. Why would a company in Germany hire a Canadian without a work permit and without a university degree when they could have their pick of UK applicants (and dual citizens like me) who can work legally and have a university degree?

I suggest you get realistic and research jobs in Asia. Find out what employers are looking for (100-hour TEFL certs) and get what you need. CELTA is a big name in Europe but not so much in Asia- you could probably save some money by doing a TEFL course that uses the same format but under a different name.

[denise]

A couple of posters have mentioned getting certified in another country, one in which you'd like to teach. I agree that it's a good idea, not only because it will give you time to get settled in, learn your way around, make contacts (I had interviews and job offers before my course had even ended), but because it can actually be as affordable as doing it at home.

You say that you don't have enough money to go somewhere else to do it, though. That caught my eye because you'll need a bit of money not only for the course but also to get started in your new country. If you're really lucky you'll get a place that covers airfare and housing, but if not, you've got to cover those things plus at least a month (more like two or three) of living expenses until you get your first paycheck. You need at least a few thousand dollars to get started.

d

[GambateBingBangBOOM]

[cmp45]

Hi,
My advice would be to look into volunteer programs. try ...goabroad.com they cater to young people. I think or do a search on the net.
There are general internships such as humanitarian work / etc. that are offered to young adults ...this would be a possible way to gain some experience abroad as well to see if it is something you would like to do long term. Also it would give you some concrete conections.
Unfortunately as many have stated, with out a degree you will be limited to where you can teach and the quality of the place.
Keep researching and eventually you will come accross something that fits your needs and wants.
Good luck

[elegantlywaisted]

[GambateBingBangBOOM]

I realize you think I was too negative in my last post. The thing is that although the private TESOL courses will tell you that all you need to know to teach English is to be a native speaker of the language, it's just not really true. In order to progress in this field, you need to acquire credentials. This means academic credentials- normally an MA in Applied Linguistics or TEFL/TESL SLA (Second Language Acquisition) etc. Without at least an undergraduate degree, you will be very, very limited in your options.

Also, I don't think you should write yourself off as not being able to think like they need you to in university. The manner in which a person thinks changes over time, and people who worked really really hard to pull off C's in first year of university may later find that first year courses are ridiculously easy (this is what I found, at least). The point of university is actually to train you to think- and it's proof that you can think and you can stick with something even if it's unpleasant long enough to get it done. Next, the cutoff for Lakehead is 70% or 72%. That's not high, and as I mentioned community colleges have university preparation years that probably would work for you (I actually just looked at Humber College's prep year site- at twenty you now don't even need an OSD to get into their programme because you can apply as a mature student. You can then use the grades from Humber instead of your grades from high school to apply to university again in the future).

As others have mentioned with the costs required for setting yourself up overseas, you should also be aware that you should definately have a some set aside to get yourself back. A lot of people without degrees have found themselves 'trapped' overseas because they simply aren't making enough money to be able to save enough to get home again.

Without a degree, you could look into China, Thailand etc by going to each country's board. Research as much as you can before applying to jobs to go there. Without an EU passport Germany may not be feasible. Good luck.

[gstieglit]

I am sorry, but it seems down right silly that you would persue a teaching job without any desire to go get an education yourself.

[Glenski]

No university degree usually means no work visa. Think about it. Whether you can " learn the way that you are require to learn in schools" or not is moot. How do you think your students are going to feel, if a miracle happens and you land a job without a degree and teach to them? Don't give us the story that they'll consider it a success story, either. Remember, I called it a miracle. That means hypothetically. Your long-term career options are severely limited without a degree, and even more so if you consider that the higher-paying jobs require master's degrees, not just a vanilla BA.

[red dog]

Well, I don't think the OP should be pressured into going to university right away if s/he's not ready for it and hasn't set any long-term goals. Universities will still be there in a few years, and so will college programs for mature students. It sounds as if this person might qualify for a working holiday visa for Japan, and I think s/he should take advantage of it while s/he's still young. I admit I don't know how easy it is for a young foreigner to find work without a degree, but don't Nova and Gaba sometimes hire people with just a working holiday visa? I know I see a lot of ads specifically targeting people who don't require sponsorship ... so the working holiday visa sounds like a good option to consider. As others have said, even a "vanilla BA" doesn't qualify you for a top-tier job; but some people just want to practice their English with a native speaker and don't care about your qualifications.

Also, I've heard of people finding work in China and completing distance degrees while working. Athabasca University in Alberta has an "open" admission policy and offers distance degrees ... I've never been to China and haven't looked into this in depth, but if you want to stay overseas long-term it might be another viable option.

[GambateBingBangBOOM]

All very true. But being able to get a working holiday visa and getting a job are two different things. In order to get a job at Nova etc from overseas, you need an undergraduate degree. The OP would have to show up in Japan and start knocking on doors. There are lots of jobs for people that don't need sponsorship- usually they are taken by people who are in the middle of a three year instructor or humanities visa. The OP certainly could come to Japan and apply, but should be aware of the competition that will be faced.

Athabasca U is an option. But if you aren't from Alberta it's crazy, crazy expensive.

I agree that people shouldn't be pushed into doing post secondary education if they aren't ready. But that doesn't mean that teaching overseas is necessarily going to be a good option, especially if the goal not a gap year, but a career- which is what the OP is suggesting he/she wants to do.