Job Discussion Forums

[DNK]

Suppose I'll ask specifically about this company, because I've heard some fairly negative things about them (much of which is from a single source, though, which has duplicated itself on a couple web pages, and is mostly concerned with the man at the head office; so I think it is just a disgruntled ex-employee).

I'm going through the application process, and want to know if I should sign on. Job duties include assisting with recruitment, maintaining student numbers, and any other activities either the head office or the branch location wants me to do. I've heard stories of teachers effectively running the location. Now, on the one hand, it's probably good for a resume to say, "I was in charge of daily operations during the supervisor's absence," BUT I'm not particularly interested in management, especially not at this point in my career.

Either way these are probably very extreme cases, but I haven't heard these things about larger schools with more teachers (and hence more probability of hearing about them, were they to exist). The information is disconcerting at best, though... But I've heard a number of people with no complaints. So the internet has proven to be a PITA yet again



At this point, I am stuck with either WinBe (accepted), GEOS (need to be interviewed at the end of April), NOVA and ECC (which I haven't applied to yet), and another small school which I haven't started applying for because I'm still waiting on a couple letters of recommendation. My options are a bit limited. I thought I applied to AEON, but they never got back to me. I'm thinking I might have forgotten to actually send the application in; so I'm going to retry that, since I can't find any means of contacting them.

So I have until the 12th in Japan (whenever that is, lovely time zones) to come up with an answer on WinBe. Suggestions, even if they be general in nature?

[Glenski]

I can tell you that on gaijinpot.com there were a lot of threads with negative comments about WinBe. Since they are a paid advertiser, they probably complained, and the site deleted the threads. Strong hint.

There are quite a few threads out that refer to a WinBe union, but every one I checked out had a dead link. Even so, the fact that WinBe teachers felt strongly enough to form a union raises another red flag. This thread mentions that it is part of a bigger union, but I don't see that the WinBe branch exists there anymore.
http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/job/viewtopic.php?t=34568&highlight=winbe

Have you read these?
http://www.freewebs.com/winbe/index.htm
http://www.eslcafe.com/forums/job/viewtopic.php?t=9186&highlight=winbe
http://www.winbenet.com/.

[earthmonkey]

I worked for them from 2002-4 as my first job in Japan. I believe I was working for them at the time the "union" was formed. I think that was about an illegal clause in the contract requiring the teacher to pay �60K if they quit without 60 days notice. I think it was removed.

WinBe sends native English teachers to Juku (cram schools). Some of them are operated by the parent company, Tact, and some are franchises. So, anyone who operates a cram school can become a WinBe school. As you can imagine, the work environment varies greatly. It depends entirely on the owner/manager of your school.

I worked for a different section which is now gone, and was working directly for WinBe. I was paid on time and received visa sponsorship and all of my promised bonuses. We parted on good terms. So, I don't have anything extremely negative to say about the company. When I worked for them and people asked me how my job was, I told them "It probably sucks less than a lot of other eikaiwa companies".

One thing to consider is that you will probably be the only non-Japanese staff at your location. That was fine for me, but you may feel isolated or lonely depending on your personality.

If I knew that your experience would be similar to mine, I'd say go for it, it's not that bad. However, as I said above, your experience will depend upon where you end up being sent. I met quite happy Winbe teachers, and quite disgruntled ones. It depended largely on the location.

Feel free to PM me if you want. But, remember that my info is not very new.

[DNK]

Thanks.

I've seen those links, and another that's a duplicate of the first one. The 60K thing has been taken out of the contract, but in its place is a warning that legal proceedings may be filed for a hasty resignation. I don't know if this is standard in Japan or not.

I think I heard you say something similar (or someone did), on a thread I found. I'm not sure... Normally I'd say 'no', but I've only got a few other choices (the big three, sans NOVA). Most of the info on WinBe is fairly old and fairly negative, at least that I found (here, GaijinPot, and Google). More negative than that of NOVA even, which is a bit scary.

I'm also put off, because I believe in the interview I was told I would have a good amount of leeway in designing my own lessons and using my own materials, yet the contract says that I have to report to head office any materials outside the set I'm given beforehand. Don't know if that's standard fare or not, though.

Also, don't know if I mentioned this, but in my off time I'm to be developing school curriculum or trying to attract students, and there's a lot in the contract about my role as salesman, etc, which I dislike. Again, not sure if this is standard, but I want to teach not spend my time in sales or whatever.



So, I guess my question is whether any of the three things I mentioned is normal or just throws up more red flags for you guys. I'd normally pass, but I only have probably four other chances at work anytime soon, save a lucky find in the classifieds.

[Glenski]

"any other activities" covers a wide ground. Could be nothing. Could be a back-breaker. If you can't talk to a current teacher or two, you'll just have to let this one ride and judge based on other criteria.

I think the fact that deleted posts were all negative in nature should stand out more than anything.

[DNK]

Yeah, I know it's not the internet's fault. It's more the process of getting information that's a PITA in general. The internet's problem is the anonymity and ability to just delete information like that. That and the fact that there's a tendency for information to be skewed to the negative side. I suppose that's an issue in a lot of places, but still.

I have a few hours left to figure this one out, and although it's a job, the amount of warning signs are really putting me off.

[earthmonkey]

I hope my previous post didn't come across as too negative. I have a negative view of the whole Eikaiwa industry. When I said my job with them "sucked less", I meant it. I'd rather work for them than those other companies that you mentioned.

As for selling, the sales that I did consisted entirely of trying to have an interesting "demo lesson", so the prospective student would join. I was motivated to do this by the fact that the bonuses were tied to enrollment. There was no selling of books or videos to the students to try to milk them for more cash(Geos).

Whatever you decide, good luck.

[DNK]

Thanks for the help. Funnily enough, I saw "Glenski" in a lot of the threads I researched on this. Quite a helpful guy, apparently.

Anyway, I decided to decline. It was a tough decision, but although there was a good chance it would be better than working for GEOS, etc, there was also a good chance it would be far worse. The majority of posts were negative, if not blasting the company, and the few good ones (save these two) were mixed at best. Too many red flags.

To anyone researching them in the future that happens upon this thread. Good luck finding information. I found some of the most informative stuff buried ten pages deep in Google, much was deleted or quite old. Most was people just asking about the company without any response, or saying they were going to be working for the company soon.

Well, back to the job search. There's already some new postings here... they don't look bad at all.