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My students are driving me NUTS!!!
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feisty-red



Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 12:16 pm    Post subject: My students are driving me NUTS!!! Reply with quote

That felt good to get out. Smile

I've been in Japan two months so far and I am privy to some of the cultural differences here. Such as students won't talk in front of the class but will talk in pairs if assigned.

Getting some students to speak and respond in a way so as to mimic/resemble natural conversation is tough. But not impossible.

But what drives me berserk is when they look things up in their electronic dictionaries (often times a poor translation of the word in question) or complain to the school director that the words I use are too hard for them. Gah!!! Mad It drives me nuts that you can ask someone to their face if everything is understood and they nod but then complain. Hello! I'm here, ask me. My job is to correct you and explain things (in a level most closely resembling your own).

/end rant

Anyone else have a similar issue? Hints?? Question
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canuck



Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 1921
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 12:43 pm    Post subject: Re: My students are driving me NUTS!!! Reply with quote

feisty-red wrote:
That felt good to get out. Smile

I've been in Japan two months so far and I am privy to some of the cultural differences here. Such as students won't talk in front of the class but will talk in pairs if assigned.

Getting some students to speak and respond in a way so as to mimic/resemble natural conversation is tough. But not impossible.

But what drives me berserk is when they look things up in their electronic dictionaries (often times a poor translation of the word in question) or complain to the school director that the words I use are too hard for them. Gah!!! Mad It drives me nuts that you can ask someone to their face if everything is understood and they nod but then complain. Hello! I'm here, ask me. My job is to correct you and explain things (in a level most closely resembling your own).

/end rant

Anyone else have a similar issue? Hints?? Question


Don't let them use their dictionaries. Less explaining. More examples. Show them what to do. Let them do it. Be in control of your class.

If you can't do that, you should quit, because you are not helping you students and they are walking all over you and will continue to do so.
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feisty-red



Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the reply but perhaps I should clarify: my issue is students not wanting to look dumb in front of their peers by asking questions. Seriously, If all the examples in the text don't work for you, then ask me. If you ask for a word and still don't get it, ask me. I don't read minds.

I don't allow electronic dictionaries by the way. Some cheeky students still try (like after class while looking at their notes).

And perhaps you missed the part about me being here two months? That's right, I'm new. I can't get into the specifics too much but today was the first day of my only regularly scheduled adult class. Until now I had been subbing free conversation lessons at various schools and doing kid's lessons. So excuse me if I'm not great at this yet.

AGAIN: FIRST DAY

Don't even try to tell me you rocked the class on the first day Canuck.

So, any helpful advice is greatly appreciated. What tips do you have getting students to open up and speak more? Thank you.
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dove



Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 271
Location: USA/Japan

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have found that everything must be modeled for students--they need to know exactly what you want them to do; otherwise it's deer in the headlights. Also, the pair work you have been doing is probably the best way to get them and keep them talking, but again I find that I have to model the start of the conversation. Sometimes I put "skeleton" scripts on the board. Sometimes I give them interview sheets so they can ask their partner questions about a topic.
When I am teaching small groups, I like to go around the room and ask each student general questions about their weekend, their plans, their day. I want to get them comfortable speaking individually in front of others. I know a lot of teachers don't do this because they say it takes away from students' talking time. Yes, but it also builds their confidence and it makes them listen to their classmates. Again, I don't do this if I am teaching big groups (over Cool. In that case, I will have them interview each other.
Students sometimes complain about learning new vocabulary--especially if isn't in their textbook. But write the word down, write an example sentence for it, and give them time to take notes.
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Vince



Joined: 05 May 2003
Posts: 559
Location: U.S.

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is there a more experienced teacher who can observe one of your lessons and give you feedback?

If the experienced teacher doesn't see a problem with your lesson, it could be that the students are taking advantage of your newness by complaining to the school director with the belief that you'll be forced into giving them cake lessons.


Last edited by Vince on Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:35 pm; edited 1 time in total
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dove



Joined: 01 Oct 2003
Posts: 271
Location: USA/Japan

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Should have written "over 8" ; don't know why I pushed an emoticon button.
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Jon Taylor



Joined: 09 Mar 2005
Posts: 238
Location: Tokyo

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:34 pm    Post subject: Re: My students are driving me NUTS!!! Reply with quote

canuck wrote:


If you can't do that, you should quit, because you are not helping you students and they are walking all over you and will continue to do so.




Ignore Canuck.......everybody does.

A jumped up tosser who looks to make unhelpful and nasty comments at the first opportunity.
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feisty-red



Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vince wrote:
Is there a more tenured teacher who can observe one of your lessons and give you feedback?


Well, it's only been one lesson for this class. So I figure ask for advice and give it a go again. No one is perfect on their first shot, right?

If then, same thing, then yes I will ask headquarters to observe me. But before I go that route I thought I would ask the veterans. Very Happy

Like the skeleton script idea dove, will try that. The text was written for Europeans taking English as a second language and isn't the greatest.
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Vince



Joined: 05 May 2003
Posts: 559
Location: U.S.

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You'll get more specific advice from a trusted colleague who can observe than from a message board. Based on my experience in eikaiwa, I'd rather work with an experienced teacher than with HQ.
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feisty-red



Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vince wrote:
You'll get more specific advice from a trusted colleague who can observe than from a message board. Based on my experience in eikaiwa, I'd rather work with an experienced teacher than with HQ.


Perhaps it's worth mentioning that I am the only teacher at this school on the day when this class happens? Or that I'm usually the only teacher at any of the schools where I work???

Yeah, a little hard to have a colleague poke their head in.

Also, we all get observed once a year at my school. If you ask for an observation before one gets demanded you're better off. It doesn't count if you ask for it but if gets demanded than it could be a negative against you.
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Vince



Joined: 05 May 2003
Posts: 559
Location: U.S.

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

feisty-red wrote:
Perhaps it's worth mentioning that I am the only teacher at this school on the day when this class happens? Or that I'm usually the only teacher at any of the schools where I work???

Yeah, a little hard to have a colleague poke their head in.

Also, we all get observed once a year at my school. If you ask for an observation before one gets demanded you're better off. It doesn't count if you ask for it but if gets demanded than it could be a negative against you.

If that's your best resource, go with it. Let us know how it turns out.

Again, be careful that the students aren't playing you. That deer-in-headlights expression sometimes masks a surprising amount of craftiness. School directors don't always pick up on it.
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zorro (3)



Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 202

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My advice is to slow down in your class. Consider every word that you utter. When you have slowed down, you'll probably be able to pick up on the subtleties of non-comprehension from your students and then give it another shot.

I think that a slow, controlled approach would benefit you.

Now breathe...... in and out...... deep lungfuls of smog and grime.
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Precise



Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 140

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 5:40 pm    Post subject: Re: My students are driving me NUTS!!! Reply with quote

canuck wrote:
Jon Taylor wrote:
canuck wrote:


If you can't do that, you should quit, because you are not helping you students and they are walking all over you and will continue to do so.


Ignore Canuck.......everybody does.

A jumped up tosser who looks to make unhelpful and nasty comments at the first opportunity.


What a bunch of hogwash. I gave the guy/gal solid advice. Grow up.


Leave Canuck alone. He's pregnant.
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Glenski



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's my take.

Slow down. You've had 2 months to get used to their vocabulary level. Yeah, they won't volunteer questions for help, but that only means it's up to YOU to be sure they know everything (or at least enough) to get through a lesson. That's why you are the teacher.

Review your lessons. Perhaps you really ARE using some vocabulary that is too high for them. Even the word "vocabulary" may be tough. Don't assume you know how to teach simply enough.

Even if you are reasonably sure of the above, have someone sit down with you after school. Like others wrote, another teacher. Have them watch you do a demo 5 minutes just to confirm you aren't using language above their heads.

How about looking at previous lesson plans from other teachers?

Why not just give them some definitions, whether on paper or on the board before you even present the lesson?

Ways to get students to ask questions (or learn vocab).
1) Get the pairs together as you prepare for the activity, and tell them to make a list of the words they didn't understand. Then, before the activity even begins, look at those lists!

2) Do a vocabulary quiz. Yes, right away. (This stinks, but for an early lesson, at least it tells you something. You don't have to ever do it again.)

3) Do a vocabulary quiz. No, not #2 above. I'm talking about at the end of the lesson, or at the beginning of the next one. Force students to study some words that way. Even in eikaiwa. End of lesson quizzes can even be fun if done the right way (put all the words on the board one by one, and have the class try to explain their meanings, then with all the words there, choose one again and erase it as you ask the meaning; there are other variations on this; even BINGO games to make it sink in).
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furiousmilksheikali



Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 1660
Location: In a coffee shop, splitting a 30,000 yen tab with Sekiguchi.

PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2007 11:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What text are you teaching from? Are you sure it is appropriate to the level?

As others have already pointed out you need to make sure you are teaching them at the right pace. The best thing to do is start low and start introducing vocabulary steadily. It is easier to make a simple lesson more challenging than it is to make a challenging lesson easier. If you bombard your students with vocabulary which they don't understand and you allow your students to note your frustration (the thread title suggests a lot of frustration which students often pick up on no matter how much you may try to hide it) then they are more likely than ever to clam up rather than take a chance and incur your displeasure.

Some teachers try to teach everything from a textbook simply because it's in the textbook. But always be prepared to make supplementary materials that hit the target language in a simpler way. Giving the students vocab to practice that you know they know is good for their confidence. Then drip-feed new vocab in later.

Could you give us an example of a lesson that you taught and perhaps some of the vocab your students had trouble with? It is much easier to give advice about concrete examples rather than abstract questions about teaching style. This also applies to teaching vocabulary. When trying to teach a new word such as "disgusting" you should be concept checking them. "Are deep-fried spiders disgusting?" "Is rice disgusting?" "Are rotten eggs disgusting?" etc... As the teacher you can't always put the onus on your students.

Also, as other posters have already pointed out get your students to put away their dictionaries in pair-work conversation. The fact that you put the students in pairs to practice the language is a good thing but it is wasted if they sit constantly typing into their dictionaries. Allow them to use their dictionaries in other activities if you wish but make sure the students are clear about when they can and when they can't use them.

Sorry for the rambling nature of this post.
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