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got rice? (Off-topic, fun thread)
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JimDunlop2



Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Posts: 2286
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 6:29 am    Post subject: got rice? (Off-topic, fun thread) Reply with quote

I find it humorous each time I find inviolable bastions of Japanese culture to which people cling so desperately. Whether it's a matter of national pride, nationalism, inferiority complex or whatever, how many Japanese people do you know who are open-minded enough to concede to any of these.

No, I'm not out to "bash" Japan, but the next time you find yourself on the receiving end of an endless "We're #1" lecture, (like I have recently) remember one of these little gems... Very Happy

1. Japanese rice tastes better (than rice in other countries). I've heard this time and time again. But are we sure that it's really Japanese rice that we're eating? I was recently doing some searching on the net and randomly came up with some interesting and surprising statistics.

Japan is a huge importer of rice. The United States is Japan's largest supplier of it. In fact, in 2000-2001 The U.S. sent over 339,000 metric tons of it to Japan. The only country that bought more that year was Mexico. Canada was in third place.

This year alone, Japan has been receiving about 13,000 metric tons of rice per week from the U.S. and Vietnam expecting to sell about 170,000 tons to Japan this year alone.

2. Sukiyaki is a Japanese food. I wonder how many people in Japan realize that for all the meat they consume on a daily basis, until the end of the Edo period, it was quiet taboo to do so. In fact, if it weren't for a fellow from Ohio named Edwin Dun, who served as a foreign advisor to the Meiji Emperor, the mikado himself ate beef as part of his New Year's meal for the first time in 1872.

Although the Japanese will admit (some more readily than others) that foods such as ramen, gyoza and kimchi all have foreign origins and have become Japanese at some point, many have been very diligent in emphasizing to me the "fact" that sukiyaki is uniquely Japanese and has always been so. As the story goes, following the Emperor's foray into the world of meat, commoners and farmers started making gyu-nabe (or beef stew)... Did they develop this on their own? Hard to say... But an alternative explanation is also given -- poor, Korean students living in Tokyo during the 1920s used receive free cow entrails from butchers used to make their own version of sukiyaki... Apparently, some Japanese people had a chance to try it, and it caught on... But that's the Korean side of the story anyway...

The next one comes from the Emperor Himself....

3. How many Japanese people are actually Japanese? There is much ado about who is Japanese and who is gaikokujin (a foreigner). But for all we know, there may be more foreigners living under a Japanese disguise than we know. But several years ago, Emperor Akihito himself said some rather shocking things that were quickly forgotten in Japan (but you won't have any trouble finding record of them in Korea)...

During Emperor Akihito's 68th birthday press conference l(December, 2001), Akihito claimed a personal attachment to Korea because of the blood ties of his ancestors.

"I, on my part, feel a certain kinship with Korea, given the fact that it is recorded in the Chronicles of Japan that the mother of Emperor Kammu was of the line of King Muryong of Paekche." Emperor Kammu reigned Japan from 781 to 806 AD, while Muryong ruled the Paekche Kingdom in Korea from 501 to 523 AD.

If there's Korean blood in the royal bloodline, how about the rest of the people? Well, let's take a look at one (of numerous other) examples from old Japan. Anyone remember William Adams? He was the first Englishman in Japan, arriving on the Dutch trade ship Liefde (also called Erasmus) in 1600.

To make a long story short, he was given a samurai rank by Shogun Tokugawa Ieyasu, which also came complete with a Japanese wife. Her name was Oyuki, the daughter of Magome Kageyu, a highway official. They left a legacy -- two children, Joseph and a daughter, Susanna. Their decedents were wiped from the history books around the time that Ieyasu's grandson, Tokugawa Iemitsu officially closed the doors to Japan in 1639, and all foreign presence, especially the Christian religion were being heavily persecuted. But it is generally accepted that they had families and children of their own who survived and remained hidden from the anti-foreigner authorities.

How many Japanese today may be related to the bloodline of William Adams is unknown, but speculations continue to this day...

4. sakura. Try telling this to your Japanese friends and see if they believe you. The beloved cherry blossom, you can't get much more Japanese than that, were originally bred and cultivated on Jeju Island, Korea and were then imported to Japan.

Unfortunately, unlike the rest of the above information for which I have all the references and source documents, this is one for whose veracity I cannot account.


Last edited by JimDunlop2 on Wed May 02, 2007 3:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
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JonnyB61



Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 216
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting obsevations Jim, and, before the Japan Board Rottweilers start snarling, this isn't Japan bashing.

So far, the steamed rice I've been served here has been totally devoid of any flavour whatsoever, regardless of its origin. It's just mass. Last week I had a student in her 70's telling me that British food is too bland. I asked her what she thought of Japanese rice cakes, vely delicious! she shot back. What can you do?

Talking about Sukiyaki, my father-in-law always insists on making it in their house. He adds so much sugar that it becomes sickly and makes your lips sticky when you eat it. Is that the usual style of cooking it or is his incredibly sweet tooth to blame?
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markle



Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Posts: 1316
Location: Out of Japan

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 8:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting Jim, but I wouldn't use this stuff in an argument. I mean most of this stuff is fairly common knowledge to educated Japanese. In fact I'd say most foreigners are ignorant to these facts about Japan.
And the rice thing, well you won't win any arguments there because Japanese rice does taste better (but not as good as Thai rice) and the imported rice is mostly used in processed food and stock feed.
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Quibby84



Joined: 10 Aug 2006
Posts: 643
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just making it clear that Thai Jasmine Rice beats all...
I thought that they could not import rice into Japan, someone said that that is why it is so expensive and that is why there is not good ol' Louisiana rice (or Jasmine rice) to be bought....guess that someone was wrong...
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markle



Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Posts: 1316
Location: Out of Japan

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 12:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quibby84 wrote:
I thought that they could not import rice into Japan, someone said that that is why it is so expensive and that is why there is not good ol' Louisiana rice (or Jasmine rice) to be bought....guess that someone was wrong...


Japanese rice trade barriers were cracked back in the '90s. Harder to crack has been the consumer perception obstacle. Thai Jasmine rice has the wrong aroma and wrong texture (harder to eat with chopsticks) for Japanese consumers for example.
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Gordon



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 5309
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quibby84 wrote:
Just making it clear that Thai Jasmine Rice beats all...
I thought that they could not import rice into Japan, someone said that that is why it is so expensive and that is why there is not good ol' Louisiana rice (or Jasmine rice) to be bought....guess that someone was wrong...


Japanese rice is expensive because of the heavy subsidies they pay farmers. Where I live, there are all these small rice fields around. How can a farmer survive on such a measly plot of land? They get lots of money from the gov't, that's why.
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nonsmoker



Joined: 20 Apr 2007
Posts: 352
Location: Exactly here and now.

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good observations. However, I am curious about: Karaoke, Sushi, Sake, Tatami mats, etc. Those have got to be Japanese in origin, right?
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Gordon



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Posts: 5309
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nonsmoker wrote:
Good observations. However, I am curious about: Karaoke, Sushi, Sake, Tatami mats, etc. Those have got to be Japanese in origin, right?


Karaoke? Who else would claim such a thing?
Why do people think they sound better the more they drink?
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gaijinalways



Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Posts: 2279

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Foreign rice is still very expensive in Japan. Personally, I too prefer Thai jasmine rice or Indian saffron rice. Japanese rice is okay, but just that.
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JimDunlop2



Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Posts: 2286
Location: Japan

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gordon wrote:
Karaoke? Who else would claim such a thing?


HAHAHAHA!!!! Thank you Gordon, I needed that laugh! Laughing Laughing

And nonsmoker: interesting you should bring those up. I don't know (yet) but I DO know that all of them, (karaoke, Sushi, Sake, Tatami mats) were very much present and accounted for in slightly different but very comparable forms when I went to Pusan last year. Maybe it's a chicken vs. egg case, but there are certainly many similarities that transcend just plain coincidence.
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markle



Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Posts: 1316
Location: Out of Japan

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gordon wrote:
Japanese rice is expensive because of the heavy subsidies they pay farmers.

Umm Gordo that economically impossible. Japanese rice is expensive despite heavy government subsidies. The price is supported by consumer preference.

As for the rest sake is the only uniquely Japanese product, not to be confused with shochu which was introduced from Korea and Okinawa
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pastis



Joined: 21 Jul 2006
Posts: 82

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 7:54 pm    Post subject: Re: got rice? (Off-topic, fun thread) Reply with quote

JimDunlop2 wrote:
1. Japanese rice tastes better (than rice in other countries). I've heard this time and time again. But are we sure that it's really Japanese rice that we're eating? I was recently doing some searching on the net and randomly came up with some interesting and surprising statistics.

Japan is a huge importer of rice. The United States is Japan's largest supplier of it. In fact, in 2000-2001 The U.S. sent over 339,000 metric tons of it to Japan. The only country that bought more that year was Mexico. Canada was in third place.

This year alone, Japan has been receiving about 13,000 metric tons of rice per week from the U.S. and Vietnam expecting to sell about 170,000 tons to Japan this year alone.

I honestly do think Japanese rice tastes good. It has a pleasant aroma, and I like the sticky, yet smooth (?) texture (and being able to pick it up with chopsticks). Some people mentioned Thai rice, but I don't agree at all (having lived there)... Unless it's a primo Jasmine variety, I find the everyday stuff fairly dry and starchy and only good fried or with strong (ie. curry) flavors (whereas I actually enjoy Japanese steamed rice on it's own, with a meal). Anyway these are all subjective points.

As for the imports you mentioned, I wonder how much that adds up to in total percentage? 340 thousand tons intuitively seems like a fair bit, but maybe it's not in the big scheme of things. I have often read that almost all of the rice consumed is grown domestically however (don't have a ready source handy, I'll try to get back to you). And anyway while they might use the cheap American rice for processed foodstuffs etc., the stuff you eat in restaurants is almost certainly the real thing (the difference between white rice from Japan and California is not all that subtle, even I can tell and I'm no expert).

EDIT: I did a quick google and according to this source the annual rice consumption is around 8.6 million tons. Comparing the 340,000 tons of U.S. imports to the total amount, and it's a drop in the bucket.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/agr_gra_ric_con-agriculture-grains-rice-consumption
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furiousmilksheikali



Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 1660
Location: In a coffee shop, splitting a 30,000 yen tab with Sekiguchi.

PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 3:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry if this has been mentioned already, I couldn't be bothered to read the whole thread (I have a terrible hangover!).

Pretty much everything in Japan came from China and Korea. Japan, bless the little nation, has borrowed almost everything that makes them "unique".

You're right, it isn't Japan bashing. But if you ever want to cause consternation in an izakaya next time you're out with friends, just tell your companions that you love the Chinese music when you're listeing to enka. It never fails to cause horror!

(Yet enka blatantly is Chinese!)
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jademonkey



Joined: 30 Mar 2007
Posts: 180

PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2007 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are some truly unique Japanese creations:

Love Hotels
"No Panties" Restaurants
Walkmans
Mecha
Anime
Kana writing system
Haiku
Karaoke (not 100% sure of that, but I think so)
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southofreality



Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Posts: 579
Location: Tokyo

PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2007 4:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

markle wrote:
Interesting Jim, but I wouldn't use this stuff in an argument. I mean most of this stuff is fairly common knowledge to educated Japanese. In fact I'd say most foreigners are ignorant to these facts about Japan.


Gotta agree with this. The Japanese people I've met who have held firm to beliefs about how most, if not all things important in Japanese culture originated in Japan, have usually been pretty narrow-minded individuals. Still others might maintain that position (with relative strangers) because of a desire not to express ideas or facts which are contrary to conventional beliefs. It goes without saying that what people think and what people say here are often two different things.
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