Job Discussion Forums

[senor boogie woogie]

Hola!

I am a teacher living in China now, but I am interested in coming to Japan, possibly in the summer or fall of 2004. I would like some information about the country.

1. I know Japan is expensive, much more so than China. If I stay out of Tokyo, will I be able to save money?

2. I read from the "Westgate" school web site that the Japanese want their teachers in business suits and ties. A tie I can deal with, but a suit? I don't want to be buried, just teach.

3. Can I take my Chinese wife with me?

4. I am a big guy, (about 280 lbs 5'10") how much will I be discriminated against on employment?

5. Any information on the JET program? I want to get a TEFL this spring in Thailand. I am 36 years old, but I hear the limit has been raised to 41.

6. Lastly, I spent several monthes in Korea, how is Korea and Japan similiar? It seems to me that Koreans are not much like Chinese, I suspect they are closer to Japanese, even though they hate the hell out of each other.

Any help appreciated.

SENOR

[Glenski]

1. Saving money. Read the FAQ first (if you haven't already).
2. Japanese dress conservatively. Many language schools do NOT require a suit, but you WILL be expected to wear nice clothes and a tie. Remember where Westgate sends their teachers. It's not eikaiwa work. James English School also has high standards.
3. You probably can, but I don't know the immigration regulations on Chinese. If you have a FT job, you can try to get her a dependent visa (on which she could actually work PT with the right paperwork!). Otherwise, she'll have to settle for the 90 day tourist visa.
4. Probably not at all. I have worked with bigger.
5. Exactly what info do you want?
www.jetprogramme.com
www.bigdaikon.com (for lots of JETs)
6. Culturally different? Physically? Socially? Or from the standpoint of the teaching business? Try this one for the last point.
http://seamonkey.ed.asu.edu/~jonb/

[BenJ]

Hangzhou hey? I worked there last year at Zhejiang university City college.

Westgate require suits yes, but feel free to remove the jacket in class!

From my memory of China, I think I can save a lot more here than in Hangzhou, depending of course on your job conditions there.

[senor boogie woogie]

Hola!

I am not interested in Westgate at all. They sem way too tight arsed for me. I am interested in general Japan, their teaching standards, and the general environment of the country.

I am thinking about taking an intensive one month course to get a TEFL certificate in Thailand in March, then make applications, maybe to summer schools and ekaiwas. I just want to be able to live and see the country for one year. I am getting tired of China and want a change.

I am interested in the JET program also, but I live in China and I do not want to leave China for an interview. Also, if I go to japan, I would like to live where it is fairly rural, I would love Tokyo, but I think that Tokyo would be a money killer.

Please, more Japan opinions.

SENOR

[Gordon]

I really like Japan and live on the island of Shikoku, one of the most rural parts of the country. I have a car, traffic is nonexistent, and prices are lower than many other parts of Japan. I feel it is more authentic too as there are not a lot of western stores/restaurants around here. This is what I wanted to find before I came here.

I have lived in S.Korea too and see Japan as totally different. The people are more accepting here, more law and order, schools are better run and more professional. You'll always find the cowboy outfits, but not to the extent of Korea. Moneywise, Korea was a better place to save, the cost of living is higher here and travel is outrageous. I'd love to travel more within Japan, but it's too expensive. It's more affordable to travel outside the country.

[shmooj]

[shmooj]

Actually, I'd like to hear more comments from Japan based people.

Senor mentions being in a "fairly rural" place. My impression is that there is urban sprawl and well... pretty much nothing. I don't think that there is much in between. It all seems, from my experience, either built up or not with nothing like suburbs or small towns.

I hope I'm wrong. Am I and if so, where are these places so that Senor (and me one day) can find them?

[Celeste]

I lived in Korea for 2 years, and hav been living in Japan for over a year now. THey are not even a little similar. I found Korea to be really loud and chaotic, and I find Japan a lot more orderly and tranquil. THe subways are crowded but no one shoves me here in Fukuoka the way they did when I lived in Daegu. Having taught kids in both countries, I can say that Japanese kids are a lot more polite than Korean kids but Japanese kids have a tendency to be a bit more self conscious. In Japan it is often difficult for me to get adult students to give opinions about anything. In Korea, the adults that I taught and worked with seeemed to hold some very strong opinions (that seemed to me to have no basis in fact).
I like it better here in Japan, but I know that a lot of the single guys I know would probably be better suited to the "wild party" atmosphere in Korea. I like the tranquility and the anonnymity of living in a big city in Japan.

[Lynn]

I was in Korea only a short time, but the differances and similarities really stuck out in my mind.

Koreans are much more affectionate; especially with children.
The level of English is different.

Both Koreans and Japanese have very similar table manners. Don't pour your own drink! In Japan hold the cup with both hands when someone is pouring, in Korean hold the cup in your right while your left hand holds the right. After everyone has a drink, say "kampai" or "kanpei" only then you you drink. In both countries, don't start eating until someone says, "Please enjoy". When finished say the meal was delicious. Both countries sit on the floor on a little cushion.

I think both countries in general have a lot of "manners". Koreans bow a little more and a little deeper. Customer service in both countries is very similar. Both have women wearing almost the exact same uniform. In Korea, customer service woman, walked me about 15 minutes in the cold, without a coat on to the place I needed to go, all while hold my arm when we crossed the street.

Both countries have the senior--->junior relationship, and the language also changes. Both countries love to bathe and have public bath houses. Also bathing takes place before you go to bed.
Koreans and Japanese take off their shoes inside.

*Korean has wonderful indoor heating (nice and cozy), Japan does not.

In both countires don't use the word "you"; instead use the person's sir name plus title, or title only. If he/she is younger than you, use the person's given name plus a suffix.

The biggest difference I felt, was that in Korea, when it comes to business (your job, your money), you had to watch your back. Whereas in Japan, for the most part there is no funny business. If you do your job, there is a 99.99% chance you will get paid with no problems.

[cafebleu]

Senor Boogie Woogie - come to Japan! I don`t think you will have any real regrets about coming here so long as your wife will be able to adjust to life in Japan. If you look at my posts in the cafe you will see that I am not one of those people who can shut their eyes to the problems of living in Japan. I will have my say about matters of discrimination and other realities of life in Japan.

But hey, everywhere there are problems in daily life. There ARE big advantages to living in Japan. For a start, while in smaller eikaiwas you may have to cope with particular ways of doing things that may not be fair (at one eikaiwa I was always paying the cost of school related phone calls and other things but overall I enjoyed my job and stayed there til the contract finished), overall working conditions are decent in Japan.

Generally eikaiwa will treat you fairly, pay you on time, pay you what they should (if you want to avoid English schools that have a reputation for NOT doing this then DO NOT work for Interac - there are too many well documented cases of how bad it is) and the law is on your side regarding any number of working conditions and contractual matters. Cheating foreign teachers out of their proper money is NOT usual in Japan.

You don`t necessarily have to get a certificate in anything unless you don`t have a college degree. The big schools - Nova, Geos, Aeon to name 3- are not paradise but it depends on the branch regarding how enjoyable or not it is to work for them. They will sponsor you and help set you up in Japan. If you want to work for a smaller eikaiwa I recommend it.

The Japanese generally are decent people. Big mouthed, racist cowards like Shintaro Ishihara, the Governor of Tokyo, are attracting more support from people who should know better but usually Japan is a safe, hospitable on the surface country. If a few or some Japanese don`t happen to like you because you are a foreigner, usually you won`t know it. On public transport it is rare for displays of aggression against foreigners. The Japanese way is still to feign politeness even if the feeling is different. That`s fine by me.

Big cities have bigger communities of Chinese people. I have heard (sorry, I can`t substantiate it personally because I have never lived there) that Nagoya is not a friendly place for foreigners, including Asian foreigners. Maybe somebody can give feedback on this. As anybody from here can tell you, Kyushu is a great place to live. The city of Fukuoka is not too big and not too small. It is cheaper than most other main cities in Japan. Fukuoka has probably more openness to Asian cultures than any other city in Japan as Kyushu historically and geographically had important links with Korea and China.

Don`t worry about being a big guy. I have been to foreigner events where the big guys were a big hit with the kids and parents. A good personality is worth more than being thin. A school such as Seiha specialises in teaching kids. You will have to travel to different places a couple of times a day but remember that travelling in Kyushu and Fukuoka is not the madness that it is in cities such as Tokyo and Osaka. Even rush hour is not really rush hour compared to those two big cities.

Renting an apartment/house will at first set you back more than 200,000 yen for just signing a contract because Japan has a system of `key money`. It`s the rental deposit. Landlords have way too much power here and that`s why they can ask for rental deposits that will bleed you to some extent. However, Kyushu is great for housing. I live in a good sized apartment for 42,000 yen a month - in Tokyo or Osaka it would cost about 70,000 yen up. Make sure you save as much money as you can before you come to Japan.

Get Ohayo Sensei - the email magazine of jobs in Japan. Send an email with the words `get issue` in the header and address it to [email protected]

Good luck, save your money and come to Japan.

[Gouki]

I am a teacher living in China now, but I am interested in coming to Japan, possibly in the summer or fall of 2004. I would like some information about the country.

1. I know Japan is expensive, much more so than China. If I stay out of Tokyo, will I be able to save money?


People avoid Tokyo because of the expensive social lifestyle there. If you have a limited need to go to fancy resturants, karaoke, check out the callgirls or just plain travelling, then you can definitely save more money than what you could in China.


2. I read from the "Westgate" school web site that the Japanese want their teachers in business suits and ties. A tie I can deal with, but a suit? I don't want to be buried, just teach.


Problem with Japan in my experiences so far (which is less than one year), I don't feel that the students are as hardworking or as eager as Chinese students (will talk about that later). Japan is more business oriented here, money speaks and therefore you have to spend quite a bit to be set, look professional and so forth. You can, however, live out in the sticks. You probably don't even have to wear a suit, just something presentable. Remember, you have to look like a teacher/academic not a rock star.


3. Can I take my Chinese wife with me?


Why not? Actually, I'm not so sure about this.I think she would have to get a visa first, and probably look for opportunities herself. Neither of you are Japanese PRs/Nationals, thus neither one of you have any permit (as of yet) to stay in Japan. Not trying to discourage you there, I think she would have to find some work as well provided that someone is willing to employ her. There are opportunities for Chinese natives to work in Japan, but it is difficult and Japanese do not really like Chinese people much (and vice versa). Some of the local Japanese-Chinese don't even like Chinese either, Snobby society I'd say.


4. I am a big guy, (about 280 lbs 5'10") how much will I be discriminated against on employment?


Not really. Dress up in a big fat chicken, and you could probably replace Bob Sapp (some big black pro-football dude). No seriously, it is better to look presentable than not. Japanese themselves are very presentable, they would expect no less from their teachers.


5. Any information on the JET program? I want to get a TEFL this spring in Thailand. I am 36 years old, but I hear the limit has been raised to 41.


JET is slowly being replaced by the ALT program, and I have a gut feeling that you would not like it. You can ask me directly about ALT if you like.


6. Lastly, I spent several monthes in Korea, how is Korea and Japan similiar? It seems to me that Koreans are not much like Chinese, I suspect they are closer to Japanese, even though they hate the hell out of each other.


I have no experiences with Koreans though I would like to get in touch with them to learn more about their styles and culture, but from what I heard, they are more 'Genki' than the Japanese, meaning that they seemed to be more enthusiastic about learning English.

SBB, I have taught in China before so I'm aware of the differences between the Chinese and Japanese students.

In terms of money, Japan is definitely the better place although cost of living can be especially high in these areas : travelling, rent. I think most people are spending up to $100 USD per month on travelling alone and from anywhere between $300 to $800 USD per month on rent. Consider that you will get the minimum of $2300 USD per month on salary, you could still probably save more than China (I was saving about $800USD per month in China). Glenski and PaulH has provided some useful information about the cost of living in Japan, they are fairly accurate.

In terms of teaching English, I find that the students here are not as serious as the Chinese students. Learning English seemed like a hobby to them, or something forced. In China, it seems as though people were desperate to learn English so that they could get better jobs/opportunities. In Japan, the English level can be awful. Some Japanese english teachers should go back to school for another 20 years learning english. I have never met anyone who is very good - excellent. At least in China, I've come across students who tries to excel in the subject.

In terms of the people, well.... I guess this forum can tell you all about that. So far, they are generally friendly and helpful. They can be really really picky about behaviour and doing the right thing, which could drive some people nuts (reminds me of the old british ways). Sometimes I would miss China because that country was so full of character. I am actually thinking of going back there again for another gig.

Sorry for the lazy ass writeup but you get my point

[Wolf]

Cafebleu - you've nearly got me convinced to go back! (In fact it's probably only a matter of time before I do . . . .)

Just wanted to say that I lived in Nagoya for three years. I knew Asain, African, European, Indian, and North Amercian and South American expats. We didn't feel like we blended in perfectly, but no one confided in me that they felt badly discriminated against - and neither did I.

[guest of Japan]

Gouki, What is the ALT program?

[Gordon]

Good post Gouki.

How were you able to save $800 US/month in China? Was your salary that high? I wasn't aware that it was that high in China.

[Gouki]