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vindie
Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Posts: 11
Location: Thailand
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 Posted: Thu May 24, 2007 3:53 am Post subject: Job Hunting |
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How is this for an idea?? I'm in my early thirties with two years of TEFL teaching experience in Thailand. I have a TEFL and a BA English from a California University. So far Japanese schools haven't been terribly interested in my on-line applications. My assumption is that my age is a factor, and the fact that I'm not in Japan. With this in mind, and knowing that I look younger than my age, I have decided to pack up a suit and head for Japan for a holiday of interviews. I want to make contacts, do interviews, and hopefully set up a job for early next year. Does this sound reasonable?
Also, do Japanese schools ever do tours, or allow observations of classes for prospective hires? In Thailand schools have fairly different teaching styles, and it's important to me that I'm not the 'smells like milk' guy behind the desk (i.e. ALT).
My intention is to check out the big four, and any more interesting smaller operations around Tokyo (with an eye on obtaining a work visa, of course).
Am I crazy to put this expense out to go there and suss things out? After all I've read, face to face seems so important in Japan... the question is whether they have a 6 month memory to ride back on!
-Jeremy |
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canuck
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 1921
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2007 3:57 am Post subject: Re: Job Hunting |
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| vindie wrote: |
How is this for an idea?? I'm in my early thirties with two years of TEFL teaching experience in Thailand. I have a TEFL and a BA English from a California University. So far Japanese schools haven't been terribly interested in my on-line applications. My assumption is that my age is a factor, and the fact that I'm not in Japan. With this in mind, and knowing that I look younger than my age, I have decided to pack up a suit and head for Japan for a holiday of interviews. I want to make contacts, do interviews, and hopefully set up a job for early next year. Does this sound reasonable?
Also, do Japanese schools ever do tours, or allow observations of classes for prospective hires? In Thailand schools have fairly different teaching styles, and it's important to me that I'm not the 'smells like milk' guy behind the desk (i.e. ALT).
My intention is to check out the big four, and any more interesting smaller operations around Tokyo (with an eye on obtaining a work visa, of course).
Am I crazy to put this expense out to go there and suss things out? After all I've read, face to face seems so important in Japan... the question is whether they have a 6 month memory to ride back on!
-Jeremy |
Jeremy, if you're going to come to Japan to look for a job, do so trying to look for a job now rather than for a job early next year. If that's what you want to do, just go through the process for one of the big 4. Your age is not a factor.
Yes, you are unwise to come here and spend a lot of money just trying to get your feet wet for next year. Same the money and the trip and continue to explore other avenues. |
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gaijin4life
Joined: 23 Sep 2006
Posts: 150
Location: Westside of the Eastside, Japan
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2007 4:01 am Post subject: |
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Im sure AEON (and probably any of the other big eikaiwa) would hire you in a snap. My impression is that AEON anyway, - I cant really speak about the others, quite likes people w a bit of teaching experience, as long as the other criteria are met ofcourse..
- Wouldnt worry bout your age, I know plenty of teachers who are late 20 - early 30s over here now.
Good ruck, |
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vindie
Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Posts: 11
Location: Thailand
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2007 4:21 am Post subject: Concerns and Rationale |
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The main idea in 'getting my feet wet' is to avoid the waiting around for a month or more to get housing and a job in Japan. Right now I have a contract job and an income... I'd like the transition to be smooth, and waiting around in Tokyo for a month or more could destroy a guy with Thai savings. I'd also like a chance to start off with a more suitable smaller school if possible (I won't refuse a big four job, but most people say get it and look elsewhere). If I can build a relationship elsewhere and skip that step, it would be ideal!
I should also add that I have temporary housing availabe to me so the main expense is the air ticket from Thailand. In other words, I have thought this out... I just want to know if I can achieve the end results I am looking for. I don't see the investment being more than going there cold turkey... in which case I wouldn't be able to count on free housing for more than a week which would be much more financially damaging than a visit and some interview run-throughs. I also have an income to return to, and upon completion of my contract here I'll have a bonus to help me relocate! |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2007 4:40 am Post subject: |
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| My assumption is that my age is a factor, and the fact that I'm not in Japan. |
False on the former, true on the latter.
| Quote: |
| I have decided to pack up a suit and head for Japan for a holiday of interviews. I want to make contacts, do interviews, and hopefully set up a job for early next year. Does this sound reasonable? |
How long is this proposed "holiday"? And, exactly when do you plan to come? Figure on spending a month or 2 before landing a job and getting your first paycheck. Depends on your interviewing skills, appearance of resume and cover letter, where you want to work, when you come, etc. To set up a job for "early next year" is pretty far down the road, and you are really only qualified for entry level work. No offense. That means ALT for JET, ALT for dispatch companies, or teacher at eikaiwa. JET only hires once a year, and you miss this year's deadline by 6 months. The other places will hire throughout the year, but in some cases only on a few days of the year (and only in your home country sometimes). Few and far between are the places that will set up something now for 6-7 months down the road (with your qualifications, anyway).
| Quote: |
| Also, do Japanese schools ever do tours, or allow observations of classes for prospective hires? |
I've never heard of such a thing in Japan. In fact, what they want is the exact opposite. That is, they want YOU to provide a demonstration lesson, whether on real students or on staff members posing as students. As for "tours", the big four visit various English-speaking countries only a few times a year, as I mentioned earlier. Their schedule, not yours, and their VERY few locations, not your choice, so you have to cater to those 2 items and pay your own way to get interviewed, even if it means a 1-3 day affair.
As for real schools (public or private), ads are scarce and often in Japanese only, and you have to be here to get the interview. No "tours".
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| Am I crazy to put this expense out to go there and suss things out? |
Not at all. If you can't afford to come here, you are limited to a very few number of places that will come to you, whether physically or by phone interview. It won't be cheap to come here ($4000-5000 to support yourself for 2-3 months), but you open more doors, get used to the country a little, network a bit, and show prospective employers that you have made a commitment of sorts just by showing up. Some employers will ONLY consider people that are already here. |
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vindie
Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Posts: 11
Location: Thailand
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2007 6:26 am Post subject: Now or Later |
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Ack... some miscommunication here. The idea is to visit for about ten days. I can do interviews, demo lessons, and distribute resumes. I want to make face to face contacts and use those to help acquire work pre-re-location. If I can maintain a dialog while I'm finishing up here... and the timing works out... the theory is that I could get hired without being in country and hemorraging money for lodging. I don't expect the best positions to be available to me, but I don't expect to be an ALT either.
I know 'the best way' is to come over and live and apply and spend lots of money, but I felt this was a good second choice... my face will be seen, I'll have person to person contact... and with regular inquiries over the next few months I would hope that something more substantial would be available to me versus applying from Thailand.
I intend to fly there for the first week of August and make contacts where I can. I should finish my contract in Thailand in November so it's really not that long a break between interviewing and availability (I would also think that completing two contracts at a school would be a plus, even if it's not in Japan). |
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canuck
Joined: 11 May 2003
Posts: 1921
Location: Japan
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2007 6:30 am Post subject: Re: Now or Later |
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| vindie wrote: |
Ack... some miscommunication here. The idea is to visit for about ten days. I can do interviews, demo lessons, and distribute resumes. I want to make face to face contacts and use those to help acquire work pre-re-location. If I can maintain a dialog while I'm finishing up here... and the timing works out... the theory is that I could get hired without being in country and hemorraging money for lodging. I don't expect the best positions to be available to me, but I don't expect to be an ALT either.
I know 'the best way' is to come over and live and apply and spend lots of money, but I felt this was a good second choice... my face will be seen, I'll have person to person contact... and with regular inquiries over the next few months I would hope that something more substantial would be available to me versus applying from Thailand.
I intend to fly there for the first week of August and make contacts where I can. I should finish my contract in Thailand in November so it's really not that long a break between interviewing and availability (I would also think that completing two contracts at a school would be a plus, even if it's not in Japan). |
I wouldn't do what you're planning on doing at all. Either try and get a job when you're here and ready to work or try and get a job without setting foot in Japan. Some places will interview you over the phone or video chat and hire you. I think the cost/benefit for what you want to achieve is quite low. |
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Gypsy Rose Kim
Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 151
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2007 9:21 am Post subject: |
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I think you have a shot.
I am also in my early 30's. Though I had worked at NOVA for four years, I was in Korea when I decided to return to Tokyo.
I sent resumes and coverletters to the places I wanted to work. In my coverletters, I said that I would be coming to Tokyo on such-and-such date and would be available for interviews at that time. I also made it clear I was not able to start working for several months after the fact.
I had no problem getting interviews that way, and got a job. They need teachers all the time, and if they like you they will wait for you.
Just try to set it all up before you go to Japan. I think what you're trying to do is quite sensible. It worked for me. |
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Glenski
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN
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| Posted: Thu May 24, 2007 1:10 pm Post subject: |
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Ten days is an extremely short period of time. As Gypsy (and I) pointed out, you are going to have to get your ducks in a row long before you come here for those 10 days. (And, remember that Gypsy had 4 years of experience already in Japan when he/she did what you are trying to do. Big difference!) By the way, Gypsy, you wrote:
| Quote: |
| I had no problem getting interviews that way, and got a job. They need teachers all the time, and if they like you they will wait for you. |
... who is "they"? Dispatch agencies? Eikaiwas? Someone else? What exactly did you end up with? Just trying to compare apples and apples as much as possible here with the OP.
Plan ahead. Send out feelers, resumes, cover letters, etc. Make phone calls. Take phone calls. Let potential employers know exactly when you are going to be in town, and then hope they can squeeze you in. Mid August is Obon, a roughly week-long period when many companies give the time off for Japan to visit its hometowns, and you are not going to interview then in many places. So, just before then will be a time when they want to do many other types of business. Who's to say they'll be eager to interview people?
That's eikaiwas.
As for mainstream schools, they will likely be on summer break then, so nobody will be around to interview you. As I tried to indicate earlier, though, you really won't be considered qualified to teach in mainstream schools (in most cases) simply because you have not taught here yet. So your comment...
| Quote: |
| I would also think that completing two contracts at a school would be a plus, even if it's not in Japan |
...may not be as valid as you think. I'm not saying it's impossible, just unlikely from my experience.
I'm not knocking your experience in Thailand. A sharp employer will value that, but in almost 10 years here, I haven't heard of that many. The rule of thumb seems to be: "get experience in Japan before you set foot in mainstream schools". You're going to have to be a very smooth talker and have a fantastic cover letter to convince Japanese employers other than eikaiwas. And, even then, there is an issue of timing (see below).
That leaves you with ALT dispatch agencies or direct hire by the BOE (whose schedule in August may be just as bad as schools themselves, and you are probably going to have to deal with the BOE for public schools, but landing a direct hire position is extremely rare). Dispatch agencies have a horrible reputation here. You would do well to read up on them.
So, for all these types of teaching positions, you are definitely going to have to work hard to get people to notice you before coming for those 10 days. Not an easy task, especially when the market here is flooded with competition.
As for timing...
| Quote: |
| I intend to fly there for the first week of August and make contacts where I can. I should finish my contract in Thailand in November so it's really not that long a break between interviewing and availability |
Help me understand this one. Do you want to just make some networking contacts in August and hope for interviews in November, or actually interview in August? November is the beginning of the deadest time for mainstream schools and eikaiwas, and it lasts until late January or early February. And, dispatch agencies service mainstream schools, so you are also unlikely to get anything done in November, and certainly not get hired then, except by desperate eikaiwas.
Have you planned how you are going to network potential employers? I can give you a list of links for all the mainstream schools K-12 in the country, but the majority are in Japanese, and certainly not all of them would advertise on their homepages. Sift through sites like OhayoSensei to get a list of eikaiwas, but it certainly won't be comprehensive, and many of the smaller outfits don't even have homepages. You have about 8 weeks to accomplish this preliminary fact-finding, and it's going to take a lot of work. |
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vindie
Joined: 29 Jun 2005
Posts: 11
Location: Thailand
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| Posted: Fri May 25, 2007 4:49 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Glenski wrote: |
| Ten days is an extremely short period of time. As Gypsy (and I) pointed out, you are going to have to get your ducks in a row long before you come here for those 10 days. (And, remember that Gypsy had 4 years of experience already in Japan when he/she did what you are trying to do. Big difference!) |
By the way, Gypsy, you wrote:
Yes, I am aware ten days is a short time. What I have just realized is that my timing is not terrific. My hope is to have these contacts (ducks in a row) before I arrive... and I suppose my DREAM (now) is that some of these schools will have hiring managers around to do interviews. I was intending to contact the big four (Nova et. al.) with the assumption that this would be possible. I know I'm stupid to make assumptions! I'll also tap into resources like gaijinpot while I am there to exploit quick chances to be seen.
| Quote: |
| [quote = "Glenski"]Help me understand this one. Do you want to just make some networking contacts in August and hope for interviews in November, or actually interview in August? November is the beginning of the deadest time for mainstream schools and eikaiwas, and it lasts until late January or early February. And, dispatch agencies service mainstream schools, so you are also unlikely to get anything done in November, and certainly not get hired then, except by desperate eikaiwas. |
I want to do the interviews in August. My contract in Thailand finishes in November, which is when my availability would open up, but I could contract on a month to month basis until early 2008. This means my starting date will be flexible for prospective schools. January or February would be pretty much ideal.
I figure worst case I will see what the schools look like, map out where they are, and get a good feeling of where I can get employment so that in the future the process will be significantly sped up. On the optimistic side I might make an impression speeding things up even more... and on the impossibly sunshiney side of the street a school will take interest, keep in contact, and have a timely offer in the future! In the meantime it's a chance to visit friends, reacquaint myself with Japan, and see some fireworks.
A previous poster wrote some rosey comments about returning to Japan from Korea. I don't expect anything that easy or positive for myself, but I hope to lay groundwork to make things easier down the road. Some of these schools recruit abroad (with future contracts in mind), I have a hard time believing that they wouldn't appreciate someone coming to them!
Special thanks to Glenski, who really should get paid for his contributions on this site!
-Jeremy |
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Gypsy Rose Kim
Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 151
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| Posted: Fri May 25, 2007 10:27 am Post subject: |
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I meant eikawa jobs, though the job I ended up taking is a little bit different. (I kind of don't want to give to much information or out that particular company.)
I assumed that's what the OP was talking about since s/he mentioned the big 4.
Ugh! Too many assumptions flying around here!  |
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